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Chamber and committees

Meeting of the Parliament

Meeting date: Thursday, March 22, 2012


Contents


Scottish Executive Question Time


Rural Affairs and the Environment

Good afternoon. The first item of business is themed questions. In order to get in as many members as possible, I would prefer short and succinct questions and answers.


Cycling



1. To ask the Scottish Executive what plans it has to invest in cycling infrastructure to improve take-up rates of active travel. (S4O-00829)

The Minister for Environment and Climate Change (Stewart Stevenson)

We are providing significant investment for cycling infrastructure in Scotland’s urban and rural areas. On 8 February, an additional £20.25 million was announced for infrastructure to support active travel over the next three financial years. That funding is in addition to the £15 million over the next three years in the budget line for wider sustainable and active travel initiatives, a significant proportion of which supports the promotion of active travel across Scotland.

Anne McTaggart

The minister will have read Transport Scotland’s report on transport emissions, which concluded that the Government’s transport policies could lead to an additional 17 kilotonnes entering the atmosphere by 2022. Does he agree that the report makes it even more essential to have the infrastructure in place to encourage increased take-up of sustainable means of travel such as cycling?

Stewart Stevenson

I am pleased to say that increasing numbers of our civil servants appear to be cycling; certainly one who directly reports to ministers regularly appears with his cycling hat firmly under his arm. We want to continue to encourage walking and cycling as very important health-giving elements of active travel and to see that they are taken up by more people.

Marco Biagi (Edinburgh Central) (SNP)

Will the minister provide some insight into the potential use of the climate challenge fund to support take-up of active travel in rural and urban areas? One example that I am familiar with is the Bike Station, which sits on the boundary between the Edinburgh Central and Edinburgh Southern constituencies. Might such initiatives provide scope for further support around Scotland?

Stewart Stevenson

The Bike Station is an excellent example of work involving people in the community. Indeed, I visited it three and a half years ago and plan to visit it again soon to see what progress it has made in its initiatives. I am happy to update the member when I have had those discussions.


Climate Justice Fund



2. To ask the Scottish Executive when it will officially launch its climate justice fund. (S4O-00830)

The Scottish climate justice fund will be launched as soon as practicable.

James Kelly

I am sure that there is agreement across the chamber on the fund’s objectives. Low-carbon technology can also be used in the battle against climate change in poorer countries and to bring benefits in that respect. What role can good examples of low-carbon technology in Scotland play in other countries?

Stewart Stevenson

I am happy to have the member’s support—and, indeed, the support of the chamber—for our climate justice initiatives. Low-carbon technology and helping other countries to develop it form an important part of the agenda. What might seem like a rather simple example of the practical help we can give is a cooking stove designed by, if I recall correctly, Strathclyde University—I might be wrong, but I am pretty sure that that is right—that gives the same thermal input for one quarter of the wood input.

However, I must also sound a brief note of caution: as well as supplying technology, we also need to change human behaviours.

Annabelle Ewing (Mid Scotland and Fife) (SNP)

I am pleased to have participated in the first ever parliamentary debate on climate justice, which took place in our Parliament on 1 March. Will the minister confirm that, when it is rolled out, a key focus of the climate justice programme will be the emphasis on locally led, sustainable programmes, particularly in the agricultural sector?

Stewart Stevenson

Decision making is at an early stage but the climate justice programme should concentrate in the first instance on sectors in which Scotland has particular expertise and it should, in any event, be about sustainable projects with strong local involvement.

Does the minister recognise the United Kingdom Government’s commitment to climate justice? How will the Scottish Government work with the UK Government on the issue to ensure a co-ordinated approach?

Stewart Stevenson

I have found that it is perfectly possible to make common cause with UK ministers. I met Ed Davey, who has taken over as secretary of state at the Department of Energy and Climate Change, a week past Friday. I know that the Cabinet Secretary for Rural Affairs and the Environment has also met Ed Davey. We are always happy to work with the UK Government where we can make common cause, and this is an agenda on which we are in substantial agreement.


Air Quality Regulations (Breaches) (Grangemouth)

Angus MacDonald (Falkirk East) (SNP)



3. To ask the Scottish Government how many breaches of the sulphur dioxide 15-minute mean objective, as specified in the Air Quality (Scotland) Regulations 2000, have taken place since the Grangemouth air quality management area was declared in November 2005. (S4O-00831)

The Minister for Environment and Climate Change (Stewart Stevenson)

Between November 2005 and February 2012, 761 exceedances of the objective were recorded across the three air quality monitoring sites in Grangemouth.

A three-year INEOS-led project is expected to reduce sulphur dioxide emissions by more than 80 per cent by the end of 2012.

Angus MacDonald

I am sure that the minister will agree with me that any exceedance of the SO2 15-minute mean objective is one breach too many, and 761 is far in excess of that. Although local Grangemouth industry has made some attempt to reduce the number of exceedances, does the minister share the concerns of local residents that a proposed 100MW biomass electricity plant could have a detrimental effect on the air quality in Grangemouth, particularly when the cumulative effect from Longannet and other industrial plants in the area is taken into account?

Stewart Stevenson

I will not comment because of the possible role of Scottish ministers in making planning decisions on any specific proposal. However, the member has brought up a very important matter that decision makers should take account of so that a proper decision can be made in due course.


Climate Challenge Fund



4. To ask the Scottish Executive what the total actual reduction in CO2 tonnage has been from projects receiving grants from the climate challenge fund. (S4O-00832)

The Minister for Environment and Climate Change (Stewart Stevenson)

The reported reduction in CO2 from the climate challenge fund so far is 128,357 tonnes of savings. That figure is from community groups that are in receipt of CCF funding and have submitted final reports for the awards period 2008 to 2011. It by no means represents the total savings that will ultimately be achieved.

John Pentland

Has the minister stopped using the total that is based on estimates for projects, some of which have produced little or no actual savings, despite contributing hundreds of thousands of tonnes to the figures that have been quoted by the First Minister and others?

Stewart Stevenson

I am very optimistic that the mix of projects that we supported through the first eight rounds of the climate challenge fund, and those projects that we will support in round nine, which was announced recently, will give us a substantial figure indeed.

However, I remind members that when I was before committee in the previous parliamentary session, I made the point that not every project would deliver on its promise. We are trying to be innovative and challenging, so we will have projects that succeed—the overwhelming majority—and we will have some that teach us something negative because it is not the way forward. It is important to realise that 100 per cent success will not be achieved. The 700,000 tonne figure that we previously reported is the figure for which we are shooting.

Patrick Harvie (Glasgow) (Green)

I am glad that the minister emphasises the creative, experimental and empowering nature of the fund. That is exactly what we had in mind when we persuaded the Government to adopt the policy in the first place. What can be done to minimise the risk of projects, including small projects, being left vulnerable when they lose funding at short notice? How can we ensure the sustainability of the projects that are coming through as a result of the CCF?

Stewart Stevenson

I acknowledge Patrick Harvie’s not insignificant role in setting up the climate challenge fund. In considering projects through the panel, which is independent of ministers, we will always seek to identify the projects that have the greatest chance of delivering what they promise. So we have a process to minimise the risk. On the ending of funding, we stress to people to whom we grant funding through the climate challenge fund that it is a time-limited grant with no guarantee of successor funding from the same source or from other sources. The scheme, for which the member should take some of the credit, has been overwhelmingly successful.

Question 5, by Liam McArthur, has not been lodged.


Mackerel Fishery (Certification)



6. To ask the Scottish Executive what contingency plans it has put in place to ensure the continuing sale of mackerel in view of the possible loss of the Marine Stewardship Council certification at the end of March 2012. (S4O-00834)

The Cabinet Secretary for Rural Affairs and the Environment (Richard Lochhead)

I am continuing to work closely with the fishing industry to mitigate any damage that is caused by the possible suspension of the MSC certificate. The suspension, which would affect all European mackerel fisheries, demonstrates the irresponsibility of the actions that Iceland and the Faroes have taken in the on-going mackerel dispute. They are not only threatening the sustainability of a vital stock but putting at risk the business interests of fishermen throughout Europe.

Claudia Beamish

Can the cabinet secretary give us further reassurance on what will happen to the fishermen? Can he give consumers a guarantee that there will be a good-quality and sustainable source of that popular fish, in view of the likelihood that there will be only a frozen back-up for some time?

Richard Lochhead

It is worth mentioning that the suspension might come into place at the end of this month, but existing stocks can continue to be sold as having MSC status. Only fish that are caught after the suspension comes into place will not have the accreditation. However, Scottish-caught mackerel will continue to be caught sustainably, albeit not as part of the international agreement that is required for MSC status. Of course, as I am sure many retailers are aware, that mackerel is some of the best product anywhere. The best way in which to secure its position in the market is to get the international agreement in place as soon as possible. We need Iceland and the Faroes to see sense sooner rather than later.

Jean Urquhart (Highlands and Islands) (SNP)

I am sure that the cabinet secretary is aware of the importance of mackerel to the Shetland fleet and the processing industry there. Will he update us on the efforts that are being made to secure a deal with Iceland and the Faroe Islands? Are trade sanctions being actively promoted?

Richard Lochhead

I am well aware of the importance of the pelagic sector to Shetland, not only for the vessels, but for the onshore processors, which employ many people. I have just returned from the fisheries council in Brussels this week where, at the request of Scotland, the United Kingdom, with support from Ireland, put the item on the agenda for discussion. The point was made that we need sanctions to be put in place as soon as possible. I am keen to work with anyone in Europe who sees the issue as a serious one. Many member states are trying to work with the European Commission to get sanctions in place as soon as possible. Of course, the UK Government has a role, so I am making clear to it that it must accelerate its efforts to ensure that the Commission has our support for trade instruments to be put in place, which we hope will be effective in persuading Iceland and the Faroes to see sense. It is an important issue.

I understand that sanctions might not be particularly effective, because Iceland and the Faroes sell most of the mackerel to Russia—in fact, Russia is doing some of the fishing. What can be done about that?

Richard Lochhead

The member raises an important dimension to the debate. However, potentially, the trade instruments and sanctions are not solely about mackerel. We await the Commission’s view on which of the range of trade instruments that are available should be used, but they do not necessarily have to be only about mackerel.


Climate Challenge Fund



7. To ask the Scottish Government what progress the climate challenge fund is making in combating climate change by helping local communities to reduce their carbon emissions. (S4O-00835)

The Minister for Environment and Climate Change (Stewart Stevenson)

On 13 March, I was pleased to announce that 43 communities have been successful in sharing £6.9 million of awards over the next three financial years. That represents the first intake of applicants since we announced our continued commitment to the Government’s climate challenge fund. We will maintain the funding at the 2011-12 level of £10.3 million per annum over the next three years.

Jim Eadie

As the minister is aware—and as Marco Biagi mentioned earlier—the Bike Station in Causewayside, in my constituency, plays an important role in helping to achieve the Scottish Government’s 2020 target of 10 per cent of all journeys being made by bicycle. Does the minister agree that, beyond the climate challenge fund, all Government departments and local authorities must look for innovative ways of providing and encouraging investment in active travel so that we can all reap the benefits of cycling and walking as healthy, low-carbon forms of transport?

Stewart Stevenson

I agree with the thrust of the member’s question—I suspect that no one in the chamber would disagree. We all have opportunities to weave a little bit of active travel into our busy lives. Yesterday, I had enough time to walk from Haymarket to St Andrew’s house. I thoroughly enjoyed the spring weather, and others can do the same.

Patricia Ferguson (Glasgow Maryhill and Springburn) (Lab)

The minister is well aware of the good work that is carried out by the staff and volunteers of the Lambhill stables, in my constituency. By September 2011, they had reduced CO2 emissions by just over 165 tonnes with help from the climate challenge fund. The project submitted a carefully worked-out bid for further help from the climate challenge fund, which would have reduced emissions by a further 600 tonnes, but that bid was rejected by the SNP Government. Can the minister advise what other sources of funding might be made available to that important community initiative?

Stewart Stevenson

The Government has nothing to do with whose applications are accepted or rejected—an independent panel evaluates the projects. However, I have asked that those who have not been successful in the current round of funding be given help to understand why their application might not have met the criteria that the independent panel applied. I hope that that will be helpful in enabling those who have not been successful in round nine of the funding to make submissions in round 10, which is now open for applications.


Forth Estuary (Contaminated Water)



8. To ask the Scottish Government what the environmental impact on the Forth estuary was of the leak of contaminated water near South Queensferry on 14 November 2011 and what action has been taken to mitigate it. (S4O-00836)

The Minister for Environment and Climate Change (Stewart Stevenson)

A range of countermeasures were deployed during and following the incident near South Queensferry on 14 November to mitigate any environmental impact, and samples that the Scottish Environment Protection Agency gathered show that there has been no significant impact on the water environment as a result of the leak. BP is currently finalising a report on the incident, which will consider the need for further action to restore the watercourse and land fully to their previous condition. SEPA will examine any such proposals in due course and will continue to review BP’s activities at the site.

Will the minister clarify what remedial measures are being taken by BP and what steps are being taken to ensure that improvements to testing regimes are implemented and that any learning points are acted on?

Stewart Stevenson

The most important thing at this stage is to highlight the fact that a warning was issued by SEPA to BP as a result of the incident. If the agreed remedial actions or necessary improvements in testing regimes are not undertaken, it is possible that SEPA will take further enforcement action. I hope that that gives the member the reassurance that he seeks.


Zero Waste Plan



9. To ask the Scottish Government what progress it has made with its zero waste plan. (S4O-00837)

The Cabinet Secretary for Rural Affairs and the Environment (Richard Lochhead)

We have made significant progress, particularly through the laying of the draft Waste (Scotland) Regulations last week to drive the separate collection of food waste and recyclable materials from households and businesses. We expect to see food waste recycling available to at least 650,000 households by early 2015. The next key step will be to reduce the amount of waste that is generated in the first place. We will shortly consult on safeguarding Scotland’s resources, an ambitious programme to unlock the economic and environmental benefits of using materials more efficiently.

George Adam

Does the cabinet secretary agree that the reuse hotline that was recently launched in Renfrewshire, which allows residents to recycle their household goods by giving them to those who can use them instead of sending decent goods to landfill, is a good, practical example of how we can make a difference in our local areas?

Richard Lochhead

Yes, after careful consideration, I can tell the chamber that that is a good example. I very much welcome the reuse hotline, which I was privileged to launch outside Parliament just a few weeks ago.

I commend all the social enterprises in many of our communities across Scotland that are helping communities to reuse what might otherwise make its way to landfill. The hotline is a good initiative and I hope that members across Scotland will support it in local communities.

Claire Baker can ask a brief supplementary.

Will the cabinet secretary provide details of investment and support that are in place and are planned to help new businesses and social enterprises—particularly in high-energy-use sectors—to contribute to the zero waste strategy?

I ask for an equally brief answer, please.

Richard Lochhead

Such enterprises have quite a number of routes for support. As I do not have much time, I will not go through them all at the moment, but I am happy to write to the member with details. Zero waste Scotland is involved in a number of initiatives, and other funds are available for social enterprises generally.


Justice and Law Officers


Single Police Force (Major Function Hubs)



1. To ask the Scottish Executive what analysis it has made of the impact of the creation of a single police force on the allocation of major function hubs across the country. (S4O-00839)

The Cabinet Secretary for Justice (Kenny MacAskill)

It will be for the Scottish police authority and the new chief constable to determine how the service is organised once they are appointed. However, there is considerable scope for support functions to be located throughout Scotland, and I am keen for jobs not to be concentrated in the central belt. Our proposals create a framework that encourages resources to be located across Scotland to best meet the needs of all our communities.

David Stewart

Does the cabinet secretary share my view that the distribution of hubs across Scotland should be based on what works best for service delivery to the public? Any objective analysis of comparative advantage among police authorities would conclude that a hub in the Highlands and Islands could cover mountain rescue, corporate services, firearms licensing, wildlife crime and rural road policing. Does the cabinet secretary agree with my analysis?

Kenny MacAskill

It is not for me to interfere with the operational independence of the chief constable or the board. I am aware of the expertise and specialisms that exist in the police service in Scotland in a variety of places. It is recognised that a great deal of good work emanates from the north, as from elsewhere. I can only reiterate that the Government expects such functions to be located in a variety of places, but that will be decided by the new chief constable, whoever he or she is, in conjunction with the new police authority.

Dave Thompson (Skye, Lochaber and Badenoch) (SNP)

I am sure that Dave Stewart agrees that there is cross-party support in the Highlands and Islands for support jobs and back-room functions to be based in the north. Will the cabinet secretary confirm that that cross-party support will be an important factor when the Scottish police authority and the chief constable make decisions in due course?

Kenny MacAskill

Absolutely. I am aware that Dave Thompson has pursued the issue doggedly for some time. I give him the same assurance as I gave Unison when I addressed its conference last week, which is that we expect support jobs not to be concentrated in the central belt but to be located across Scotland.


Emergency Service Communication Equipment



2. To ask the Scottish Executive what recent discussions it has had with police forces regarding the development and upgrade of emergency service communication equipment. (S4O-00840)

The Scottish Government is in regular contact with police forces and the Association of Chief Police Officers in Scotland on a range of matters, including the development and upgrade of emergency service communication equipment.

Liz Smith

I am sure that the cabinet secretary is aware of the outstanding work by our mountain rescue teams and particularly of the generous support that they receive from Scotland’s police and other emergency services for such communication equipment. Given the pressure that is placed on what are largely voluntary funds, will the cabinet secretary give a guarantee that mountain rescue service equipment will be very much part of discussions about the formation of the new single police force when they take place?

Kenny MacAskill

Absolutely—I reassure the member on that. It was a privilege to meet those who are involved in mountain rescue in central Scotland. I am aware that many such people are serving police officers who do mountain rescue in their spare time.

Mountain rescue is a separate matter, but its funding is an important aspect of ensuring safety in Scotland. That does not apply just to those who are out on the hills in the Highlands, as a great deal of the work involves the central belt. I give the member that assurance.


Police and Fire Services (Expenditure Scrutiny)



3. To ask the Scottish Executive what its position is on the need for a further level of scrutiny of expenditure by police and fire services. (S4O-00841)

The Cabinet Secretary for Justice (Kenny MacAskill)

We believe that scrutiny should be effective and proportionate. Responsibility for financial oversight lies with police and fire boards, with the Accounts Commission overseeing that expenditure.

The boards of the new single services will be appointed for their skills and expertise, including financial expertise. Their expenditure will also be scrutinised by the Auditor General and their accounts will be laid before the Scottish Parliament.

Hugh Henry

I refer to the damning report on the Highlands and Islands Fire and Rescue Service that was published by the Accounts Commission. The cabinet secretary might be aware that, previously, the Public Audit Committee, with all-party support, had expressed concern that such reports could not be scrutinised in this Parliament by the Public Audit Committee or any other committee.

Given that cross-party support, will the Scottish Government give its support to an attempt to widen the remit of the Public Audit Committee to allow such scrutiny to take place in this Parliament?

Kenny MacAskill

Any changes to the committee would be a matter for the Parliament, rather than for me, in my role as the Cabinet Secretary for Justice, or for the justice department.

As the member has mentioned, there are difficulties in the Highlands and Islands Fire and Rescue Service. We are grateful for the on-going good work that is being done at a local level by Stephen Torrie, who is our senior officer. He has gone in to ensure that we protect the integrity of the service that is there to cover all requirements in the north.

The appropriate role of the Public Audit Committee with regard to the issue of auditing is one that I am sure members will be happy to debate in the chamber.

Mary Scanlon (Highlands and Islands) (Con)

I welcome the review of the Highlands and Islands Fire and Rescue Service and the support that is being given by the Government and other services in Scotland following the critical Accounts Commission report on the serious failures.

I appreciated the cabinet secretary’s first answer, but I would like him to give a clear commitment to ensuring that the single force will be fully accountable to this Parliament, with the highest level of scrutiny, which, as Hugh Henry says, is not available to us at this time. Will the Public Audit Committee be able to exercise the same level of scrutiny as it does in relation to other Audit Scotland reports?

Kenny MacAskill

Obviously, these matters are being dealt with. I will be giving evidence at the Justice Committee on the Police and Fire Reform (Scotland) Bill. We are working on the basis that the proposals will provide the necessary financial savings and the best police and fire and rescue services, and that they will improve and expand the level of scrutiny and governance at a local level. The arrangements will be a pyramid structure, with the base in our local communities. The structure will include a chief fire officer and a chief constable, and will recognise the role that Parliament will have in relation to the fire service, which was raised by Mary Scanlon, and the police service, which was raised by Graeme Pearson. I am more than happy to engage on those matters, because it is important that the current level of governance and scrutiny should be enhanced.


Highlands and Islands Fire and Rescue Service (Best-value Audit)



4. To ask the Scottish Government what steps it has taken to assist Highlands and Islands Fire and Rescue Service following the recent Audit Scotland report, “Audit of Best Value: Highlands and Islands Fire and Rescue”. (S4O-00842)

The Minister for Community Safety and Legal Affairs (Roseanna Cunningham)

I have been taking a close interest in this issue, and I welcome the work of the peer support team and other services that are being offered to Highlands and Islands Fire and Rescue Service. I understand that the service is already addressing issues that have been raised.

The important thing here is public safety. Will the minister do all that she can to help Highlands and Islands Fire and Rescue Service to ensure safe coverage across the area until all fire stations are brought up to standard?

Roseanna Cunningham

It is the case that safety—of the community and of the officers in the service, whether they be full time, retained or volunteer—is paramount. The chief inspector, my officials and senior officers from other fire services are all in regular contact with the service to find out how it can best be helped. I spoke to the convener of the Highlands and Islands fire board not long ago.

Of course, this is primarily a matter for the board, but I am willing to consider any requests for further help that are made.


Grampian Police (Civil Contingencies)



5. To ask the Scottish Executive whether it will review the support that it provides to Grampian Police in relation to civil contingencies. (S4O-00843)

The Cabinet Secretary for Justice (Kenny MacAskill)

The Scottish Government will, in 2013-14, review the support that it provides for civil contingencies work to the Grampian strategic co-ordinating group, of which Grampian Police is a key partner, as well as to the other seven SCGs in Scotland, in the light of police and fire reform.

The Scottish Government will continue to engage with SCG partner agencies to ensure that the essential elements and strengths of successful multi-agency planning and response are maintained and to build consensus around an optimum future resilience model.

Nanette Milne

The cabinet secretary will be aware of the significant challenges that confront Grampian Police in providing police protection for the royal family when they are resident in the Deeside area, policing the oil and gas sector, including the St Fergus terminal, and providing protection to the First Minister when he is in the area. What discussions has the Scottish Government had with Grampian Police regarding those extended responsibilities? What provision will be made for the future single police force to take into account those policing challenges in the north-east?

Kenny MacAskill

Those are ultimately matters for the chief constable. I met the chief constable of Grampian Police recently, and we are aware of those matters. There is a formula to address the specific challenges that Grampian Police faces, including the offshore aspects to which Nanette Milne referred and those relating to Balmoral. Such challenges are faced by other jurisdictions, such as Lothian and Borders, which has Holyrood palace and other challenges in its area.

Such issues are being discussed as we move towards a single police service to ensure that we achieve the best possible position in that regard. We will ensure that the support and skills are available for meeting challenges such as the monarch being at Balmoral. We will ensure that there is no waste of resources in that regard whenever she moves down into the Lothian and Borders jurisdiction. In general, we will ensure that we get best value from the police and that they continue to provide an outstanding service.

Lewis Macdonald (North East Scotland) (Lab)

The cabinet secretary will recall that the Civil Contingencies Act 2004 defines areas for civil contingency preparation in terms of the existing forces. Further to his initial answer around working with partners, will the cabinet secretary indicate to Parliament today how he envisages that being structured in the future, given the police and fire service reform?

Kenny MacAskill

The short answer is that we are happy to leave it as it has been operating. Whether that will be appropriate when we move to a single force, given that the SCGs are predicated on the force boundaries, is something that we are happy to consider. We want to get the optimum size and number in Scotland. The Government does not have a fixed view on that and will engage with the agencies concerned, such as the new single police and fire services and the local authorities, which are key partners. We could end up maintaining the current figure of eight SCGs, albeit that one would cover almost 50 per cent of Scotland, or there could be alternative structures.

I assure the member that we are not rushing into anything and that we are happy to debate the matter with him. Equally, I would be more than happy to discuss it as we proceed. However, it is fair to say that we want to ensure that we get the best possible civil contingencies and that we will discuss the structure in due course.


Police Officers (Investigation of Conduct)



6. To ask the Scottish Government what procedures are followed in relation to police officers under investigation. (S4O-00844)

The Cabinet Secretary for Justice (Kenny MacAskill)

Police officers who have a complaint made against them, whether it alleges criminality or misconduct, may be subject to the procedures set out in the Police (Conduct) (Scotland) Regulations 1996 or the Police (Conduct) (Senior Officers) (Scotland) Regulations 1999.

If an officer is not satisfied with a decision that is made at a misconduct hearing or with the manner in which the procedures were carried out under the conduct regulations, they can appeal first to the chief constable and then to the police appeals tribunal.

Linda Fabiani

I am dealing with a constituency case in this regard. It seems to me that a serving police officer who is under investigation can be left in an intolerable situation with nowhere to turn outwith their own institution. Will the cabinet secretary clarify a point for me? Should a serving police officer who is under investigation wish to make a complaint of a criminal nature, or a misconduct complaint about how he was treated, against those who are carrying out the investigation, what rights and recourse does the officer have beyond internal procedures?

Kenny MacAskill

That matter would be addressed by the chief constable rather than by me. Such things are dealt with as part of the employer-employee relationship, in which we would not seek to interfere. I am happy to enter into discussions and write to Linda Fabiani on that issue. However, it seems that the matter would be raised first with the chief constable’s office, and the individual officer would—depending on their rank—presumably be represented by the Scottish Police Federation or the Association of Scottish Police Superintendents. If any misconduct issues arose beyond that, it would at present be open to the chief constable to have another force investigate them, and in due course it will be for the commissioner to do so.

We also have the Solicitor General for Scotland, who is sitting across from me, and any allegations of criminality can be referred to the Crown, which will be able to deal with them. It is, after all, the Crown and not I that can direct police investigations.


Police Guidelines (Children of Arrested Parents)



7. To ask the Scottish Executive what guidelines there are for police on how to treat children when arresting a parent. (S4O-00845)

The Cabinet Secretary for Justice (Kenny MacAskill)

There are no specific guidelines for police on how to treat children when a parent is arrested. Such guidance would be a matter for the Association of Chief Police Officers in Scotland. Each case varies, but when a parent is arrested several different agencies, including social services and the police, often meet to ensure that the needs of the child are met. The welfare of the child is of paramount importance.

Mary Fee

I thank the cabinet secretary for his response. However, the recent Quaker United Nations Office report highlighted that children are 73 per cent more likely to suffer from post-traumatic stress if they are present when a parent is arrested. Does the cabinet secretary therefore agree that clear and unambiguous guidelines should be in place for when the police arrest a parent when a child is present, and that more support and counselling should be available for children in that position? What steps will he take to ensure that support and counselling is available?

Kenny MacAskill

Fundamentally, such matters are for the police to deal with. As we go through police and fire reform, we are at pains to make it clear that there will be no operational interference by a minister, whether that is me or a successor of any political hue.

The police need to ensure that they have guidance that can be issued in training at Tulliallan for those who are coming into the service and on an on-going basis. Each and every case is different. A situation in which a police officer arrests a man who is beating his wife in the presence of their child is vastly different from a situation in which a police officer comes through the door with a drug arrest warrant or deals with someone who is shoplifting and has their child with them. There are a variety of situations, and we need to provide guidelines for the police while recognising that police officers must use their discretion, subject to the training and guidance that they are given.

Sometimes matters are fairly clear cut and common sense dictates what should be done, but other situations—such as an assault to which the child is a witness—can be problematic. I assure Mary Fee that I will discuss the issue with John Geates when I meet him next at Tulliallan.

I will ensure that the matter is passed to ACPOS to be addressed, but fundamentally we must trust in the good sense and judgment of our police officers in doing what is necessary. In some instances in which a parent is arrested, it is in the child’s best interests for the parent to be detained.

Question 8 has been withdrawn for understandable reasons.


Scottish Prison Service (Key Performance Indicators)



9. To ask the Scottish Government how well the Scottish Prison Service is performing against its key performance indicators. (S4O-00847)

The Cabinet Secretary for Justice (Kenny MacAskill)

The Scottish Prison Service’s most recent set of key performance statistics was published in its annual report in July 2011. The next annual report and accounts is due for publication during the summer. Despite the pressures associated with record population levels during 2011 to 2012, the SPS continues to perform well against all its key performance indicators.

John Wilson

As the cabinet secretary is aware, Colin McConnell has been appointed as the chief executive for the Scottish Prison Service and will take up his post on 28 May. He will be returning to the Scottish Prison Service after an absence south of the border and in Northern Ireland. What will the new chief executive’s key focus be when he takes up post? Are there any proposals to review the SPS performance indicators after the next report?

Kenny MacAskill

I look forward to meeting Dr Colin McConnell next week. I think that he is due to come in for a cup of coffee. I look forward to him giving me his insight into what is necessary. There are some things that we clearly accept are necessary under the key performance indicators, but I give John Wilson a clear indication that I want to hear Dr McConnell’s views.

Dr McConnell has served as a prison officer and a governor in Scotland, he has served south of the border and, most recently, he was in charge of the prison service in Northern Ireland. He comes with an outstanding curriculum vitae and I am sure that he will provide outstanding service. I look forward to working with, and learning from, him and I am open minded as to what actions he thinks that we should take.