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Chamber and committees

Plenary, 26 Oct 2006

Meeting date: Thursday, October 26, 2006


Contents


Question Time


SCOTTISH EXECUTIVE


Health and Community Care


Health Service (Centralisation)

1. Fiona Hyslop (Lothians) (SNP):

To ask the Scottish Executive what plans it has to prevent further centralisation of the health service, in light of the paper by the Academy of Medical Royal Colleges "Centralisation and Specialisation of Hospital Services—bigger is not necessarily better for rural and remote communities." (S2O-10849)

The Minister for Health and Community Care (Mr Andy Kerr):

The paper in question is an unpublished document, which I understand has been sent by the United Kingdom Academy of Medical Royal Colleges to the authors for redrafting. I understand that, in its draft state, the report does not take full account of the work on remote and rural health care that is under way in Scotland. Nevertheless, it welcomes the Kerr report's remote and rural health care recommendations, which we have adopted in Scotland through "Delivering for Health". The national health service in Scotland will, of course, continue to consider any relevant published reports as it seeks to improve patient care.

Fiona Hyslop:

Can the minister reassure Parliament that he will take every step to re-examine the published paper and that, if it contains any clinical arguments that people who live in more remote areas are being put at risk, he will take action to ensure that the centralisation that is proceeding across Scotland—including the centralisation by stealth at St John's hospital—is tackled and stopped immediately?

Mr Kerr:

That is the usual outrageous misinformation from the Scottish National Party. It is inappropriate to base health policy on an unpublished draft that has been sent back to the authors for more work. However, the draft report actually states:

"The Kerr Report … makes very similar points, and will be debated by the Scottish Parliament … Many of the recommendations from Kerr's Rural Access Action Team are equally applicable throughout the UK, and should be considered by all bodies considering health policy in areas with remote and rural patients."

In other words, the report states that the UK should learn from and be led by Scotland's health policy.

The report ends by stating:

"All Medical Royal Colleges, UK healthcare commissioners, and NHS trusts that are responsible for patients who live in rural areas should consider the Kerr report … especially the section written by the Rural Access Action Team, and consider implementation of relevant recommendations."

That is an endorsement by the Academy of Royal Medical Colleges of our approach of making services as local as possible and as specialised as necessary.

I could correct many more such points of misinformation, but unfortunately I do not have time to do so.

Mrs Mary Mulligan (Linlithgow) (Lab):

Is the minister aware that the SNP in West Lothian continues to peddle rumours about service centralisation away from St John's hospital, which Fiona Hyslop mentioned? Such rumours are sapping the confidence of staff and patients. Will the minister follow Lothian NHS Board's lead by reaffirming his confidence in the services that are provided at St John's? Will he also confirm that services are actually being decentralised to that hospital?

Mr Kerr:

That is exactly the case. I remind members—in particular, Fiona Hyslop—of some of the facts of the case. We are now treating more in-patient and day cases at St John's than we did in the previous year. We have moved Lothian's ear, nose and throat surgery out to St John's and the phototherapy unit there is now dealing with psoriasis patients. St John's is a vibrant and busy acute hospital that has been part of NHS Scotland's overall success recently in drastically reducing waiting times for both in-patients and day cases.

To return to the substantial point, we are investing resources in health care at St John's, which plays a full and active part in NHS delivery in Scotland and will continue to do so.

Mrs Nanette Milne (North East Scotland) (Con):

The minister will be aware that Greater Glasgow and Clyde NHS Board recently announced the closure of the integrated care pilot at Vale of Leven hospital in June next year once alternatives can be put in place. Is that decision in line with the recommendations of the Kerr report? Is it also in line with the duty that all health boards now have under the National Health Service Reform (Scotland) Act 2004 to implement regional planning through managed clinical networks to sustain the delivery of services in rural areas?

The member is wrong, as ever. However, I seek the guidance of the Presiding Officer on the question, as question 6 was appropriately lodged by another member.

The Deputy Presiding Officer (Murray Tosh):

The member has asked a supplementary question that is relevant to question 1—specifically, whether the approach corresponds to the Kerr report. The minister could answer that. His response to the later question will doubtless cover the other aspects.

Mr Kerr:

Before answering the question, I must correct the member's assertion. The Vale of Leven pilot has not ended, but there are concerns about the next stage of the project. The clinical safety issues are not about the pilot as it currently stands but relate more to implementing the next phase of the operation. Any strategy by any health board in Scotland must fit exactly with "Delivering for Health". I will ensure that that is the case in the Vale of Leven and everywhere else in Scotland.


Cancer Patients (Treatment Delays)

To ask the Scottish Executive whether it has concerns about delays being experienced by cancer patients in receiving their treatment. (S2O-10800)

The Minister for Health and Community Care (Mr Andy Kerr):

Yes, we have. I am always concerned to hear about delays in cancer treatment. The possibility of cancer and the worry that it causes for patients, their families and friends is of concern to me. As I have said many times, it is unacceptable for people with cancer to wait longer for treatment than is absolutely necessary.

Michael Matheson:

I draw the minister's attention to the recently published data on the "Cancer in Scotland: Action for Change" targets, in particular the target that by 2005 the maximum wait from urgent referral to treatment for people who suffer from cancer will be two months. Is the minister aware that the data that were published indicate that in the Forth valley fewer than 65 per cent of patients who are referred urgently are receiving the treatment that they require? That is the third-lowest compliance level for any health board in Scotland.

As the minister said, people who are diagnosed as having cancer are anxious that their treatment should commence as soon as possible. Why has Forth Valley NHS Board failed so badly to meet the target? What action has the Executive taken to ensure that the board complies with it?

Mr Kerr:

We are taking significant action and I say again that I am deeply unhappy with the performance to date on the matter. However, the context is important. First, 14 per cent more patients are living through and surviving cancer. That is because of the work of our national health service. In the last quarter, performance has improved on bowel cancer, lung cancer, breast cancer, ovarian cancer and melanoma.

Nonetheless, the member asks a significant question: what are we doing about the problem? First, we have scrapped the previous system of historical performance monitoring to make the monitoring current. Weekly monitoring information is now available on the status of patients within the system. If anyone is nearing the date that would be unacceptable if the two-month target is to be met, we can therefore get to the patient much more quickly. The issue has an organisational dimension.

Secondly, the Executive's delivery unit is working with boards that are most troubled in relation to the performance targets for redesign of services. If necessary, we will devote further resources to the matter to ensure not only that we track and monitor patients, but that when we get them in the service we are able to treat them more effectively by identifying bottlenecks and other such problems. I fully accept the point of the member's question and know that there will still be concern about the issue in the community. However, the action that we are taking, particularly the weekly monitoring, should reassure patients and allow for improvements in performance to meet our target.

Cathie Craigie (Cumbernauld and Kilsyth) (Lab):

Has the minister received information from Lanarkshire NHS Board about its recent decision to site the new Lanarkshire cancer care centre at Monklands hospital? I am sure that the minister will agree that that will provide an opportunity for better access and better services for my constituents in Cumbernauld and Kilsyth. Will the minister make a speedy announcement on the issue and endorse the decision that has been taken by NHS Lanarkshire to provide this much-needed service at the Monklands site?

Mr Kerr:

My colleague Lewis Macdonald will be in receipt of that document as soon as it comes from NHS Lanarkshire.

I will make two comments. First, that is an example of the steps that we are taking throughout Scotland to ensure that we have better cancer services. Secondly, let us not forget that we have world-leading services in the Beatson oncology centre and in the Western general in Edinburgh. Nonetheless, we should be doing better on waiting times. The move is a positive one for cancer patients in Lanarkshire because the centre will serve them and their families. The decision will also reassure people in the Monklands area that Monklands hospital will remain a crucial and central part of health care in Lanarkshire.


Residential Care

To ask the Scottish Executive what assessment it has made of local authority requirements for residential care places for elderly people between now and 2014. (S2O-10842)

The Deputy Minister for Health and Community Care (Lewis Macdonald):

The report of the Executive's range and capacity review group, published in May this year, considered the available evidence on the balance of needs over the next 20 years. It recommended that local partners do further work to assess future needs in individual local authority areas and come to conclusions at local level as to what future provision of services will be required to meet those needs.

Mr Wallace:

I am sure that the minister is aware, from correspondence with me and with the convener of Orkney Islands Council in recent months, that the percentage of the population that is elderly is set to rise much faster in Orkney than in Scotland as a whole, and that there are already concerns about the possibility of residents having to be sent across the Pentland firth for residential care places. Will he respond positively to my request for a meeting at ministerial level to discuss the issue and to consider a report, a copy of which he has been sent, that indicates that the allocation of grant-aided expenditure for social services in Orkney falls well short of the amount that the council spends on social services, and that community care services for older people, and children and family services, are among the areas that have been most acutely hit by the underallocation?

Lewis Macdonald:

I am grateful to Orkney Islands Council for sending me a copy of that report, and my officials have had a constructive meeting with officials from the authority. Jim Wallace knows that, as the allocation of resources forms part of the wider local government settlement, it will be considered as part of that wider process, and we would not wish to negotiate on the settlement within individual councils. However, we are happy to have a meeting to discuss and fully address the issues that are particular to Orkney. The report covers issues that relate to a number of different ministerial portfolios. I would like to take a little more time to consider which minister will be best placed to respond to the issues, but we will certainly accept Mr Wallace's request for a meeting.

Shona Robison (Dundee East) (SNP):

Is the minister aware of a report that was submitted to Dundee City Council's social work committee on Monday night, which shows that the number of people who are waiting for funding for a care home place in Dundee almost doubled between May and September, from 63 to 118, and that, in the same period, the number of people waiting for free personal care rose from 17 to 30? What advice can he give my constituents who are caught up in those waiting lists? Who does he hold responsible for those waiting lists? Is it the Labour-Lib Dem coalition that runs Dundee City Council, or his own Executive?

Lewis Macdonald:

Shona Robison knows very well that there are, in some circumstances, perfectly legitimate reasons why a person will wait for the delivery of full services. Responsibility for delivering those services at local level lies with the local authority. Where discharge from hospital is a factor, responsibility lies with the local authority in partnership with the local health board or with other partners. The allocation of funding for delivery of those services fully meets the earlier request that was made by the Convention of Scottish Local Authorities, and further consideration will be given to that in the spending review next year. Ms Robison is also aware of the fact that we are currently reviewing the implementation of the free personal care policy across Scotland, in order to ensure that we can learn any lessons that need to be learned and can improve the delivery of those services.

John Swinburne (Central Scotland) (SSCUP):

Will the minister give a progress report on the situation regarding the excellent proposals to make pensioners' homes, where applicable, safer for residents, to enable them to remain in their own homes, as was recommended by the Kerr report? The main benefit of such an initiative would obviously be that it would do away with the need to sell people's homes to pay for their care.

Lewis Macdonald:

Good progress is being made in addressing the issue of making people's homes safer. We are keen to enable people to stay in their own homes as long as they can, because that is what most older people want. I commend the example of West Lothian Council, which is in many respects leading the way in adaptations to housing to enable that. That is the sort of example that we would like to see being followed throughout Scotland.


National Health Service Employees<br />(Monklands Hospital)

To ask the Scottish Executive what its estimate is of the number of NHS employees in Monklands hospital in each of the next three years. (S2O-10832)

The Deputy Minister for Health and Community Care (Lewis Macdonald):

The staffing establishment at Monklands hospital in March of this year was just over 1,500 whole-time equivalents. Lanarkshire NHS Board expects the staffing establishment at Monklands hospital to remain at much the same level in each of the next three years.

Alex Neil:

Will the minister guarantee that there will be no rundown in the number of people who are employed in the accident and emergency department at Monklands, particularly while that department is still having to cope every other weekend with the overspill from the other A and E departments in Lanarkshire? Given his last-minute—though welcome—decision to retain the intensive care and renal units at Monklands, will he explain how that impacts on the effective use of consultants when he is stupidly proposing to close the A and E unit?

Lewis Macdonald:

Mr Neil has slightly missed the point about the clarification that I provided on renal services and high-dependency care. We have confirmed that the changes that are to be introduced in the next five years will permit continued delivery of dialysis and level 1 high-dependency support at Monklands hospital.

On the wider question of staffing at the accident and emergency unit, I am sure that Mr Neil is aware of the details of the changes that are to take place. The changes, which will take place in advance of any changes to the accident and emergency service at Monklands, will include the establishment of new community casualty units, including a seven-day, 24-hour community casualty unit at Monklands, and other changes to accident and emergency provision in Lanarkshire and in neighbouring health board areas.


Dental Students

To ask the Scottish Executive how many dental students graduated from Scottish dental schools in each year from 2004 to 2006 but did not take up dental vocational training posts in Scotland. (S2O-10814)

The Deputy Minister for Health and Community Care (Lewis Macdonald):

The number of dental students who graduated from Scottish dental schools was 116 in 2004, 109 in 2005 and increased to 133 this year. The number who did not take up vocational training posts in Scotland fell from 25 in 2004 to 14 of the 109 graduates in 2005 and 14 of the 133 graduates this year.

Fergus Ewing:

Does the minister agree that the loss to Scotland and to the national health service dentistry services of about 50 dental students is an absolute scandal? Does he agree that the situation resulted directly from the fact that, although we welcome trained students from England into the country, there were simply not enough vocational training posts in Scotland to keep about 50 dental graduates here? Given the acute shortage of NHS dentistry services, is not that an absolute scandal and a sign that the Executive simply maladministered a system that could easily have worked to the benefit of all those who are throughout Scotland languishing on waiting lists for NHS dentistry services?

Mr Ewing, you are now debating the point. I ask the minister to answer.

Lewis Macdonald:

The scandal is the misinformation from Mr Ewing—the facts are contrary to what he says. The dental action plan made it clear that the number of vocational training places that we would provide would be in excess of the number of students who graduate from Scotland's dental schools. We have done that, so Mr Ewing's information is clearly wrong.

As I said, 14 of the 133 students who graduated from Scottish dental schools this year chose to take up vocational training places elsewhere. That is a decision for them. Given the proportion of dental students in Scotland's excellent dental schools who come from other parts of the United Kingdom, it should not be surprising that about one in 10 of them chooses to take up a VT place in another part of the United Kingdom or elsewhere.

Mr Ewing should welcome the significant advances that we have made on the matter, not least of which is the introduction of bursaries to encourage students to continue in the NHS in Scotland after graduation. The Executive announced the bursary scheme in the dental action plan in March 2005, and I was pleased to launch it in Dundee a few weeks ago. I am delighted to report to Parliament the high level of interest in the scheme among dental students.


Vale of Leven Hospital (Integrated Care Pilot)

To ask the Scottish Executive why the integrated care pilot at Vale of Leven hospital has ended and what implications this has for the integrated care model in other areas. (S2O-10804)

The Minister for Health and Community Care (Mr Andy Kerr):

The integrated care pilot at the Vale of Leven hospital has not ended, but concerns about clinical safety mean that the implementation of the next phase of the pilot, which requires the removal of on-site anaesthetic support, cannot proceed. The clinical safety issues are not about the pilot as it currently operates but about implementing the next phase. The current arrangements will remain in place until alternative service proposals for the area north of the river have been planned properly.

I am afraid that the minister speaks with forked tongue.

You are not allowed to accuse somebody of lying.

He is saying two things at one time.

You are allowed to say that.

Frances Curran:

The minister is facing in two directions—that would be a surprise—because "cannot proceed" means that it will not go ahead, which is what the health board has said. Why does the minister not just admit that the proposal for an integrated care model at the Vale of Leven hospital was nothing more than a cynical political manoeuvre to derail protests on the street against the closure of the hospital? People have been duped into thinking that the hospital would be kept open using that model, but the intention is to close it.

Mr Kerr:

The member is coming late to this game. I look back at her ministerial correspondence system cases for the Scottish Executive. She has written 26 letters, three of which relate to health: one on stoma; one on national health service dispensary; and one on chronic obstructive pulmonary disease. She has never written to, scratched a pen to or phoned NHS Greater Glasgow and Clyde about the matter. Nonetheless, we find ourselves in the chamber discussing it. What I said clearly was that the integrated care pilot at the Vale of Leven has not ended, because it has not ended. The decision of the team involved was that we could not proceed to the next stage of the integrated care pilot due to very sound clinical risks with regard to the pilot. What I have asked the NHS in Glasgow to do—and what it will do because I have told it to—is to go back and review all current services at the Vale, including anaesthetic cover, to ensure that we have a satisfactory way forward for the community north of the river. That is what we will do.

On a point of order, Presiding Officer. I want to raise a point under the Data Protection Act 1998 about how the minister gets access to the letters that I have written to the health board and under what premise he did that.

The Deputy Presiding Officer:

That is an interesting question, which I cannot answer now, but I am sure that we will endeavour to find an answer. I cannot quite put my finger on a point of order, but to be honest I was not awfully comfortable with the nature of the response. Any member is entitled to ask any question about any matter within the remit of the Scottish Executive.

Jackie Baillie (Dumbarton) (Lab):

I welcome the minister's confirmation that the integrated pilot will remain in its current form and thank him for his letter setting out the next steps. I am sure that he will agree with me that the provision of anaesthetics is key to the future provision of services at the Vale of Leven hospital. Will he therefore make two things abundantly clear to NHS Greater Glasgow and Clyde and, indeed, to Parliament? First, will he make it clear that the starting point for any review of services is that all options must be considered to sustain anaesthetics at the Vale? Secondly, will he make it clear that a north-of-the-river solution will underpin the review, with the majority of health care for my constituents delivered at the Vale of Leven hospital?

Mr Kerr:

There is little I can add to the correspondence with the member. The review will consider sustaining the provision of anaesthetics and NHS Greater Glasgow and Clyde will examine all possible models of delivery. I hope that that satisfies the member's request. As I said in the letter, the Health Department and NHS Greater Glasgow and Clyde agrees that while the work is being undertaken, there will be no changes to the services that are currently provided at the Vale.


Environment and Rural Development


Waste Management (Glasgow)

To ask the Scottish Executive whether it will consider funding the upgrading of waste management facilities in the city of Glasgow. (S2O-10863)

The Minister for Environment and Rural Development (Ross Finnie):

We have provided Glasgow City Council with more than £37 million to improve recycling facilities and we expect a further application from the council shortly to enhance those facilities. In addition, we are considering the strategic outline case from groups of local authorities, one of which includes Glasgow, for residual waste treatment.

Mr Gordon:

I acknowledge the recent generous treatment of Glasgow in respect of new facilities for recycling. It is my understanding that Glasgow and the seven other local authorities in the Clyde valley have submitted an outline business case to the minister's department in respect of three proposed new waste treatment plants in the period up to 2020. Can the minister tell us more about the current status of the evaluation of that outline business case?

Ross Finnie:

We have received the strategic outline cases. They are extremely complex and involve allocations of substantial amounts of public money. The on-going discussions between my department and the local authorities have been designed to ensure that not only do we meet the environmental targets of our policy but we achieve best value. The Glasgow case is currently under consideration, as are others, and I expect to be in a position to make announcements relatively shortly. However, we still have a number of technical issues to resolve.


Crofting Counties Agricultural Grants Scheme

To ask the Scottish Executive what the future is of the crofting counties agricultural grants scheme. (S2O-10869)

The Deputy Minister for Environment and Rural Development (Rhona Brankin):

The crofting counties agricultural grants scheme came into operation on 1 April and it has state aid clearance that would allow it to continue in operation until 2009. The future of the scheme is under consideration in the context of the rural development programme for Scotland and land management contracts.

Maureen Macmillan:

Is the minister aware of the anxiety among small crofters and farmers about the possible loss of these ring-fenced grants? Those anxieties, together with the expense of the bull scheme, the uncertainty over payments from the less favoured areas support scheme and the imposition of inappropriate animal welfare transport regulations next year, are putting additional pressure on crofters at a time when they most need our support. Will the minister consider what the Executive can do to relieve their anxieties?

Rhona Brankin:

I am well aware of some of the anxieties that Maureen Macmillan describes. I have already met her, and Ross Finnie and I will meet the Scottish Crofting Foundation next week to discuss some of those concerns.

We are in a time of change, and times of change can be difficult, but we are aware of the concerns. We are committed to the importance of crofting in the Highlands and Islands and the crofting counties and we are aware of its importance in sustaining remote and island communities.

Mr Jim Wallace (Orkney) (LD):

Will the minister acknowledge that one concern that crofters have about the possible change is that they will find that they have to bid for grants, rather than the grants being ring-fenced in the way that Maureen Macmillan mentioned? The experience of many crofters and small farmers in relation to the rural stewardship scheme was that they spent substantial amounts of money on bids that did not come anywhere near the threshold. People are concerned that the crofting counties agricultural grants scheme will go down the same route.

Rhona Brankin:

I reiterate that we are well aware of the concerns about the schemes. As I said, we will meet the Scottish Crofting Foundation next week. Jim Wallace and Maureen Macmillan can be assured that we will take the concerns into consideration and we are more than happy to keep in touch with the members who represent the affected constituencies.


Waste Water Treatment Plant (Dalmuir)

3. Des McNulty (Clydebank and Milngavie) (Lab):

To ask the Scottish Executive whether it will consider the introduction of a new legal obligation to remedy long-running odour problems from the waste water treatment plant at Dalmuir experienced by the people of Clydebank. (S2O-10876)

Hundreds of people have signed the petition to stop the smell.

The Deputy Minister for Environment and Rural Development (Rhona Brankin):

The Sewerage Nuisance (Code of Practice) (Scotland) Order 2006 came into effect on 22 April. It introduced the first statutory code of practice on the assessment and control of odour from waste water treatment works, which applies to all such works in Scotland including the one at Dalmuir.

Des McNulty:

The people of my constituency have been blighted by a failed public-private partnership project since 1998. The smell is disgusting and the catalogue of incompetence and disorganisation by the PPP company and Scottish Water beggars belief. We need the problem to be sorted out now. Does the minister recognise that the Executive cannot fail to deal with PPP projects? The smell from a PPP project needs to be treated in the same way as a smell that comes from a non-PPP project. Will the minister meet me and perhaps some of my constituents to discuss the way forward?

Rhona Brankin:

Yes. As I said, the first code of practice on the matter came into force only in April this year, but it applies to all waste water treatment works including the 21 works that are operated under the private finance initiative, so it applies to the works at Dalmuir as well. I recognise the difficulties that have been experienced by Des McNulty's constituents and I am more than happy to meet them to discuss the matter.

Susan Deacon (Edinburgh East and Musselburgh) (Lab):

Does the minister share my growing anger and frustration that, despite substantial action, investment and indeed legislative change to tackle sewage odour, there are still no plans or funding in place to provide a lasting solution to odour emissions from the Seafield waste water treatment works? Can she give a firm assurance that the Executive will do all in its power to resolve that unsatisfactory situation so that Edinburgh can be rid of the Seafield stench once and for all?

Rhona Brankin:

Yes. I am well aware of the problems associated with Seafield and the continuing work that Susan Deacon undertakes on behalf of her constituents to try to get a resolution to the problem. I am also aware that there is an on-going legal position on Seafield, but let me state that the new code of practice applies to the works operated by private finance initiative. I share Susan Deacon's frustration, and I am more than happy to meet her to consider ways that we can help to speed up the process of dealing with the problem.


Nuclear Power Stations (Leaks)

To ask the Scottish Executive what assessment has been made of the environmental impact of leaks from Scottish nuclear power stations. (S2O-10840)

The Minister for Environment and Rural Development (Ross Finnie):

That is essentially a matter for the Scottish Environment Protection Agency, which works closely with the independent regulator responsible for nuclear safety—HM nuclear installations inspectorate of the Health and Safety Executive.

Before a station can commence operation, an essential part of the assessment by the independent regulator is to consider the effects of both routine emissions and the worst-case credible accident, known as the design-basis accident. In the event of an incident at a nuclear site, SEPA considers the significance of the incident for its effect, if any, on the environment.

In addition, SEPA publishes jointly an annual report entitled "Radioactivity in Food and the Environment", in which the level of routine emissions from nuclear power stations and their impact is presented, along with an assessment of the significance of any abnormal emissions that may have occurred. Copies of those reports are held in the Scottish Parliament information centre.

Mike Pringle:

I thank the minister for his answer, and I am heartened by his reassurances. However, given the effect that Chernobyl had on Scottish agriculture and the particles that are still being found at Dounreay, does he agree that there is a risk to the Scottish environment from any new generation of nuclear power stations?

Ross Finnie:

The usual leap of logic and faith. There are two things that I want to say about that. First, anyone listening to the question and answer should not draw the inference that the current leak reported by the authority was nuclear related. It is important for the public to understand that the authority reported a crack in the pipeworks relating to the conduction of water and steam. It was not nuclear related, and I would not want anyone listening to the exchange to draw that unfortunate inference.

Secondly, on the long term, no one anywhere would want to commission a nuclear power station that was as low in its engineering and safety standards as that constructed at Chernobyl. I will not enter into the further debate. I have my views, as Mr Pringle well knows, but the Scottish Executive's position remains unchanged from that which has been stated many times.

Chris Ballance (South of Scotland) (Green):

The minister will be aware of the John Large report published this summer, which reported significant uncertainties over the structural integrity and residual strength of the moderator cores in all advanced gas-cooled reactor plants, including Hunterston and Torness. Is he also aware that the nuclear installations inspectorate yesterday reported that most of the graphite bricks in the core of Hunterston are expected to crack in the near future, "jeopardising the safe running" of the station? If so, what action does he intend to take?

Ross Finnie:

Yes, I am aware of the report; Mr Ballance would have been surprised if I had not been. Again, there are two points. First, we have regulation, which is why we are aware of the information. We have inspectorates in place to examine the sites, so we should not try to inflame unnecessary public concern when the regulator is clearly doing its job and drawing the public's attention to the problems that exist. Secondly, it will be for the operator to take action; otherwise it will fall foul of the regulations and will be required to cease operating the plants until they have been repaired. That is what the system is about, and we should not use inflammatory language when a regulator is doing its job properly.

Alasdair Morgan (South of Scotland) (SNP):

Given that the minister speaks for the Executive, is it not patently obvious that, regardless of the source of the current leak, the best way to minimise the danger of any future leaks from nuclear power stations is not to build any more nuclear power stations?

That would depend on what happened to new nuclear power stations. We are currently dealing with the leaks from existing power stations, and I do not think that even Mr Morgan is suggesting that we should necessarily close them down.


Scottish Environment Protection Agency (Licences)

To ask the Scottish Executive whether it intends to review the fees for licences issued by the Scottish Environment Protection Agency and, if so, when. (S2O-10836)

The Deputy Minister for Environment and Rural Development (Rhona Brankin):

The Scottish Executive will review any proposal by SEPA to increase its charges by more than the retail price index. A benchmarking report comparing SEPA's charging schemes with those in England and Wales has recently been published. We will study the report carefully to decide whether any action is needed. A major review of the pollution prevention and control charging scheme is also due to begin shortly.

Euan Robson:

I am interested that comparisons are to be made with England and Wales. The minister might be aware of the issue of the use of road planings from the Berwick bypass. Scottish farmers are being asked to contribute £200 to get a licence to use planings, whereas English farmers in Northumberland do not have to do so. Would the minister agree that the regulation system has almost become an industry in itself and that, if an organisation requires to raise fees to contribute towards its budget, there might be a temptation for it to be overzealous in so doing?

Rhona Brankin:

I am aware of that concern. Euan Robson has written previously on the particular issue of planings. He will understand from the letter that he got back that there is potential concern about the unregulated use of road planings as, in some circumstances, they could pose a risk to the environment. I am also aware of concerns that have been expressed about the regulatory framework and charges. We are already comparing the charging scheme here with that of England and Wales, and we are looking to review the system of regulation in Scotland.

I call John Swinney. A question about fees, Mr Swinney.

I cannot imagine what you mean by that, Presiding Officer.

I am enjoining you to be skilful in your supplementary.

Mr Swinney:

You should have no requirement to suggest that.

In considering the fee for the licence that was issued by the Scottish Environment Protection Agency for Sacone Environmental Ltd's plant in Brechin in my constituency, does the minister feel that the review by SEPA of that fee is merited if that plant is failing to deliver the respite from serious odours to which the people of Brechin are entitled?

That is obviously a serious issue for the management of that plant, rather than for SEPA, but I am more than happy to enter into correspondence on the issue if there is a continuing problem with the plant.


Loch Lomond (Byelaws)

To ask the Scottish Executive when it will announce the outcome of the consultation on byelaws for Loch Lomond. (S2O-10854)

The Deputy Minister for Environment and Rural Development (Rhona Brankin):

The consultation on the byelaws was followed by a 12-week period during which objections could be sent to the Scottish Executive. That period ended in the summer. The Executive has asked the Loch Lomond and the Trossachs National Park Authority to provide additional information on some of the matters that were raised in the objections. That information will help inform my decision on the byelaws. I understand that the park authority expects to provide the additional information by the end of November.

Jackie Baillie:

I know that the minister will be considering the submissions carefully. She will, however, be aware of two issues that unite all the campaigners, irrespective of where they stand on the question of the need for byelaws. First, there is a deeply held desire to ban jet-skis. Secondly, there is a need to enforce the existing byelaws, never mind create new ones. Will the minister act on those remarkably united views?

Rhona Brankin:

The Executive has asked for information on the proposals for the effective supervision and enforcement of the byelaws, including dealing with the antisocial use of jet-skis. The Executive has asked for information on arrangements to monitor and review the effectiveness of the proposed increase in speed reduction zoning in Milarrochy bay. We have also asked for economic impact work and information on commercial operations on the loch. I am happy to provide Jackie Baillie with a copy of the letter that I sent to the chief executive of the national park authority. We are very much aware of concerns about jet-skis, and we recently met several commercial operators and people living in the national park. I am more than happy to keep Jackie Baillie up to speed with developments. To reiterate, we are seeking additional information from the park authority specifically on jet-skis.

By an incredibly narrow margin, question 7 can be called.


Energy (Security of Supply)

To ask the Scottish Executive what analysis it has undertaken of the impact on the environment if security of energy supply from indigenous sources cannot be guaranteed in the foreseeable future. (S2O-10873)

The Minister for Environment and Rural Development (Ross Finnie):

We have commissioned the Scottish Executive energy study to examine energy supply and demand in Scotland and associated carbon dioxide emissions. Volume 5 of the study will consider how Scotland's energy use could change in the medium term to 2020 and will use projections of demand and supply that are informed by different scenarios that could influence energy use in the future. Volume 5 will be published at the beginning of 2007.

Michael McMahon:

Does the minister agree that it is foolish to believe that we can replace all our power-generating plants with hundreds of windmills? If we tried that, the lights would go out when the wind chose not to blow. Does he agree that our future energy generation must have a nuclear component if we wish to reduce carbon emissions and to have security of supply? Does he agree that although renewables are all well and good, if we are serious about the environment, we must look beyond the green spin to identify carbon reduction policies that include nuclear power as not only a carbon-free solution, but an ideal solution?

Ross Finnie:

My only dispute with Michael McMahon is that to describe renewables as wind power only is wholly to misunderstand the range of renewable sources that is available to us. That range is why the Scottish Executive has invested considerable sums of money in the research centre in Orkney to test wave and tidal power. As Michael McMahon knows, although the wind may cease, the tide—strangely enough—keeps coming in and going out, so it is a much more reliable source of energy that is more attuned to meeting the problem that he raises.

Of course, I have not dealt with photovoltaics or microgeneration, or the fundamental issue that society faces, which is that we should reduce the amount of energy that we consume. A raft of renewables exists. I hope that Michael McMahon will ponder the range of renewables before concluding that there is only one other solution.