The next item of business is a debate on motion S6M-17457, in the name of John Swinney, on commemorating the 80th anniversary of victory in Europe day. I invite members who wish to speak in the debate to push their request-to-speak button.
15:28
I am honoured to open the debate on behalf of the Scottish Government and to share my reflections on the 80th anniversary of victory in Europe day. Today, we give thanks to every individual who fought and sacrificed to ensure victory over fascism during the second world war.
Presiding Officer, 8 May 1945 was a day of great celebrations across the country and the world as news spread of the allied victory in Europe. The end of the war in Europe brought with it an enormous sense of relief, as memories of bombings and U-boat attacks could finally begin to fade, and hope for the future grew instead—especially for the safe return of family and friends overseas. We must not forget, however, that the fighting continued in Japan and Myanmar. There were another three long months of suffering before the surrender of Japan brought the second world war to its ultimate conclusion.
There are few milestones more significant in our modern history than the one that we celebrate today. Today, we enjoy our freedom thanks to our armed forces, which served during the second world war. During six years of conflict, 380,000 members of the British armed forces lost their lives, as well as more than 67,000 civilians. Memorials to the 57,000 Scottish soldiers who died can be found far and wide, from Albania to Greece and from Hungary to Zimbabwe. For every soldier killed, many broken hearts were left behind to suffer the grief as parents, as children and as friends. I am forever grateful to the Commonwealth War Graves Commission for caring for its many cemeteries here at home and abroad, which offer families peaceful moments to come together and pay their respects to loved ones who have been lost.
Will the First Minister join me in recognising and commemorating the pre-partition British Indian army—the largest volunteer force in history, with 2.5 million soldiers—for its brave actions in world war two?
I join Pam Gosal in that point of remembrance. It is significant that that point was made at the VE day 80 commemoration event in the Usher hall in Edinburgh, which I thought demonstrated the scale of the involvement of so many peoples from around the world in the effort to defeat fascism. I happily associate myself with the point made by Pam Gosal.
Before I leave the point that I was making on the Commonwealth War Graves Commission, I note that it will always be a point of significant remembrance for me that I was able to visit the site of my uncle’s grave in Argenta, in Italy, and to stand on a spot that had been visited some 30 years before by my grandmother on her only trip out of the United Kingdom to pay her respects at the grave of her beloved son. The decades that have passed dampen neither the memory and the loss nor our gratitude and pride.
Each of us now lives in freedom because of the sacrifices of the men and women who overcame fascism.
I thought that the First Minister spoke movingly of his uncle when VE day tributes were paid earlier today. I have been thinking about my mother, who, as a six-year-old child, was pulled from the wreckage of her bombed family home in Birmingham in 1940. Does the First Minister agree that we all have a sacred responsibility to keep remembrance alive in this country for the sake of those people and for future generations?
I agree with Mr Kerr’s point. His example of his mother’s experience resonates with that of my mother-in-law, who was also removed from a tenement block that was bombed in Birmingham, in exactly the same era.
That is an illustration of how people were affected, but there is a substantial point in what Mr Kerr says. If I think back to when I started my parliamentary life, 28 years ago, I would say, anecdotally, that attendance at remembrance events was perhaps beginning to dwindle. Then, in the aftermath of conflict at the start of this century, I saw attendance at remembrance events grow. That is an indication that, sadly, there have been reminders of conflict and loss, which are matters of regret. However, they reinforce Mr Kerr’s point that we cannot, for a moment, allow ourselves to forget the suffering and the after-effects of conflict. I agree very much with Mr Kerr’s point.
Scotland owes a debt of gratitude to everybody who played a part in the efforts to defeat fascism. We live in an environment in which we still witness conflicts that have a profound effect on us all, brought to us by the images that we see, whether of the unbearable suffering in Gaza, which followed the terrorist atrocity by Hamas, or of the on-going suffering of the people of Ukraine in all that they wrestle with. In reflecting on those conflicts, Scotland remembers the sacrifices that were made by so many individuals in the efforts that were undertaken.
Europe day is celebrated tomorrow, when we commemorate the signing of the Schuman declaration and the beginning of what is now called the European Union—which, of course, happened only five short years after the end of world war two. Those steps were taken by France and Germany to ensure that war was
“not merely unthinkable, but materially impossible.”
We think back to the founding values of that dialogue to overcome conflict, yet, in continental Europe, we still have conflict in Ukraine.
The First Minister is absolutely right to reference the European Union as establishing a charter for peace so that no nation could ever build a war machine again. Much of that fabric was built on the foundation of a cohesion of factors such as the Polish airmen coming to Scotland and fighting so bravely in the battle of Britain, many of them settling here and becoming part of an established Polish community. Will the First Minister join me in paying tribute to them, too?
Unreservedly. There is a very strong affinity with the Polish community in the area of Perthshire that I represent—indeed, there is a Polish cemetery in the city of Perth. Of course, in subsequent generations that has led to a very welcoming environment for the Polish community to come to, where, thankfully, they are able to contribute to our schools, local communities, churches and community activities. That is all very welcome, and it is based on the deep roots that Mr Cole-Hamilton has cited.
In the past few days and weeks, I have been mindful of a sequence of events that took place in my family’s life, which rather illustrates the mixed feelings that would have been in evidence on VE day in 1945. I had not really thought about this point until the events of the past few weeks.
On 3 April this year, I attended a memorial event down at Ocean Terminal, where a memorial to my late uncle, Corporal Thomas Hunter, has stood for many years. Here we are today, only 35 days later, marking VE day. That has made me realise that, on 3 April 1945, my mother’s family was devastated by the news of the loss of my uncle, yet, only 35 days later, the streets were full of people jubilantly celebrating the end of the war—quite understandably, of course, because there was an enormous sense of relief.
What has struck me is the level of contrast that there must have been between my grandmother’s and grandfather’s household, where people were nursing unbearable grief—which I saw in later stages of my life, when I became conscious of my family’s experience and understood the gravity of the loss that they felt—and the jubilation outside their front door. I leave that observation with members simply so that they will recognise that, although there was great relief on 8 May 1945, a lot of suffering was still going on in households the length and breadth of the country. We should never forget that contrast, which highlights the sense of loss that many individuals experienced.
Today, the Deputy First Minister has attended, on my behalf, a commemoration event in the city of Glasgow, and the Cabinet Secretary for the Constitution, External Affairs and Culture has represented the Government at the national commemorative service at Westminster abbey.
Will the First Minister take an intervention?
I can give you the time back, First Minister.
I will happily give way to Mr Brown.
I have mentioned to the First Minister on previous occasions that his uncle is remembered by every single person who goes through Royal Marines training, which is a lengthy and difficult process. They learn about the exploits of Corporal Thomas Hunter, who won the only Victoria cross given to a marine in the second world war. I hope that it will provide at least some comfort to the First Minister’s family to know that his uncle’s name is always remembered.
I am grateful to my colleague and friend Mr Brown, who has distinguished service of his own in the Royal Marines, for adding that reminder. It was made clear to me most powerfully when I attended a commemoration event that the Royal Marines organised just a few weeks ago, to mark the 80th anniversary of my uncle’s death and to recognise the significance of his contribution to their history.
Presiding Officer, I will draw my remarks to a close. On this 80th anniversary of VE day, Scotland pays tribute to our second world war generation. We thank all those who have served, or are serving today, in our armed forces. Together, in their honour, we dedicate ourselves to enhancing democracy, standing steadfast against fascism and building a better, safer and more peaceful world. Many towns and cities across the country will stage beacon-lighting ceremonies from 9 pm tonight. The lighting of those beacons represents something that is fundamental to our society: the light of hope emerging from the dreadful bleakness and darkness of war. It is a hope that we need now more than ever, and it is one that inspires us all to act, to reach out and to be champions of peace and democracy at home, in Europe and in the world.
I move,
That the Parliament marks the 80th anniversary of Victory in Europe (VE) Day, which took place on 8 May 1945; remembers the 380,000 UK Armed Forces personnel, including 57,000 Scots, and over 67,000 civilians who lost their lives during the conflict; commemorates the service and pays tribute to the sacrifices of those individuals from across Scotland and the UK, the Commonwealth and the Allied Nations, which ensured the peace and freedoms that are enjoyed today; appreciates the efforts of Legion Scotland and Poppyscotland to mark the occasion, including a national commemorative concert held in Edinburgh on 6 May 2025, Scotland’s Salute to VE Day, which was supported by the Scottish Government, and commends the work of both organisations and of veterans charities across Scotland in supporting the veterans of this conflict and their families, many of whom continue to be affected by the tragedy of war to this day.
15:40
Today marks 80 years since the unconditional surrender of Nazi Germany. After six years of bloodshed and horror, our country awoke to the light of freedom as the dark forces of fascism were vanquished.
The victory announcement was made by Winston Churchill on 8 May 1945 at 3 pm. Following his radio address, the Prime Minister spoke from a Whitehall balcony to huge crowds of people celebrating on the streets below. This is some of what he said:
“God bless you all. This is your victory! It is the victory of the cause of freedom in every land. In all our long history we have never seen a greater day than this ... My dear friends, this is your hour. This is not victory of a party or of any class. It’s a victory of the great British nation as a whole.”
The worldwide death toll from that industrial-scale conflict is difficult to get one’s head around. Up to 85 million military and civilian lives were lost. Tens of thousands of brave Scots went off to war, only to fall in foreign fields. The average age of a Scottish serviceman killed in world war two was just 21. To our generation and the next, who have only ever known peace, the deeds of the greatest generation are almost unfathomable. It has been heartening to see the many events being held across Scotland to mark VE day. It is right and proper that war memorials stand proudly and prominently in communities across the land. Today especially, we remember that they serve as a permanent reminder of that bravery and sacrifice.
Many thousands of Scots were also killed at home as German bombers targeted industrial areas, including Clydebank, Greenock and many other towns. The war touched every family, every town and every workplace. In 1940, when hundreds of thousands of allied soldiers were rescued from the beaches of Dunkirk, tens of thousands were captured. They included my grandfather’s brother, who endured a forced march to a prisoner-of-war camp in Nazi-occupied Poland. Miraculously, he survived the disease, violence and squalor of the camp to return home to Glasgow after the war ended. During those darkest of times, Britain and our allies stood resolute and defiant. Although victory in Europe was achieved on this day 80 years ago, the war still raged in the far east for another three months.
Today, I am proud to salute the sacrifice, duty and bravery of the greatest generation. They fought and died for our peace and for our freedom, and we all live in their shadow. A famous VE day cartoon shows a wounded and bandaged soldier emerging from a battle-scarred wasteland—in his hand is a scrap of paper with the words,
“Victory and Peace in Europe”,
and the caption beneath reads:
“Here you are! Don’t lose it again!”
Yet, here we are again, with war raging in Europe and elsewhere, and the rise of murderous tyrants across the globe. Today, we must reaffirm our support for the brave people of Ukraine as they fight for the freedoms that we take for granted. We cannot abandon them. The front line between Russia and Ukraine represents a greater global fault line. On one side are our western values of democracy, decency, freedom and humanity, and on the other side are bleak tyranny, oppression and an ugly disregard for human life.
Today, the west must remember and restate what bonded us between 1939 and 1945. I return to the words of Winston Churchill, spoken on this day 80 years ago:
“I say that in the long years to come not only will the people of this island but of the world, wherever the bird of freedom chirps in human hearts, look back to what we’ve done and they will say: ‘Do not despair, do not yield to violence and tyranny, march straightforward and die if need be—unconquered.’”
Those words from history ring true today. We cannot become weary or lose our resolve when faced with Putin’s murderous regime and others. As we remember the fallen of world war two and celebrate VE day, we must recommit to supporting our armed forces. They are not a relic of a bygone age; they are essential to the defence of our islands. Last week, I was privileged to attend the ceremony to install Major General Bob Bruce as governor of Edinburgh castle. Some of the Royal Regiment of Scotland soldiers who took part in the ceremonial event were just days away from being deployed to join our allies on military exercises in eastern Europe.
Recent global events and the volatility of our times mean that we must ensure that our armed forces are properly funded and supported. As we mark VE day, we should support the veterans who have served our country. Recently, it was my privilege to speak with ex-servicemen and ex-servicewomen at the Scottish Veterans Residences centre, and I can assure all members that they will get an equally warm welcome if they pay a visit to the centre, which is just across the road from Holyrood.
I associate my party with the words of the First Minister. Today is a day to remember all that brings us together and the proud history that we share. VE day was the very best of Britain and the very best of the British people.
15:46
Eighty years ago today, the German instrument of surrender was signed by representatives of Nazi Germany, the United Kingdom, France, the United States and the Soviet Union in the ruins of the city of Berlin. With that document, the darkest chapter in the history of Europe finally came to a close. As the First Minister has pointed out, while fighting would still rage on in the jungles of Burma and the islands of the Pacific, for the first time in almost six years, the guns fell silent over the continent of Europe. The Nazi tyranny that had tried to subjugate an entire continent and eradicate an entire people had finally been defeated.
Throughout Europe, from the rubble-filled streets of Paris to the bombed-out shipyards of Clydebank, and from the devastated villages of Poland and Ukraine to the still-smouldering ruins of German cities, an entire continent was finally at peace. In the United Kingdom, we celebrated at last the victory that so many had thought would never come and the victory that, sadly, so many did not live to see. Six years of bloody fighting, from the fields of France to the deserts of north Africa, had taken the lives of almost 400,000 British soldiers—400,000 sons, brothers and fathers who would never return home; 400,000 lives that ended early in the fight against Nazi tyranny. At home, almost 70,000 British citizens—sons, daughters, mothers and fathers—were lost through blitz and bombing, hunger and disease.
The struggle against tyranny was global. Some 15 million allied personnel from Europe, North and South America, Australasia, Asia and Africa gave their lives. I want to remember all those from across the globe who stood against fascism, including members of my family who served in the British Indian Army and who fought on the front lines to protect our liberty. I hear tales about the British Indian Army only from my sole remaining grandmother, who talks often about her cousins who fought in that war and, tragically, lost their lives. Similar to the First Minister’s reflections, that makes me think about how fortunate we are that we pay service to remembrance and that we have proper records of those who have lost their lives. In many parts of the world, no such records exist, and people hear tales only because of surviving family members. I will never truly know how many of my family members were lost or how many made contributions. That is the case, I imagine, for communities right across the globe.
However, thousands of young men from different faiths travelled halfway around the world to answer Britain’s call in its hour of need. We might not know their names or where they came from, but they, too, must never be forgotten. That is why I am proud to join campaigners in calling for a permanent memorial to the soldiers of the British Indian Army in Glasgow, the city that so many of those soldiers’ descendants now call home, because the great victory over fascism is their victory, too.
Six years of total war had left our country and the entire continent of Europe on the brink of the abyss. As the victory was celebrated in the streets of Scotland and the UK, details slowly began to emerge from liberated concentration camps on the continent. The world learned the truth about the greatest crime ever perpetrated in human history: the systematic attempt to eradicate the Jewish people. Six million people were dead, and many more disabled people, LGBT people, trade unionists and minorities were killed by the apparatus of the Nazi state. The clock had struck midnight in the story of human history, but, through collective will and the united endeavour of people across the world, that evil had finally been defeated.
As people across the country celebrated that final victory, the Prime Minister addressed the nation. He said:
“God bless you all. This is your victory! ... In all our long history, we have never seen a greater day than this. Everyone, man or woman, has done their best.”
He was right. The workers in the shipyards, the women of the land army, the soldiers on the front line, the air raid precautions wardens, Home Guard volunteers and doctors and nurses—the people of the United Kingdom in their collective will and our allies, all united behind the just cause of victory—had proven triumphant.
As that victory was celebrated, the hope for a new and fairer future for our country was born. The comradeship, self-sacrifice and unity of the war years had shown the world the potential that the people of the United Kingdom held. At home, the construction of a new social and political order—one fit for our heroes—began in earnest. Coming out of the war, we developed a proper welfare state. The national health service, stronger pensions, new towns, slum clearances and new rights for workers were all delivered in the spirit of victory that people had worked so hard to deliver.
Across the world, the need for a new order was clear. The United Nations was established to promote peace across the world and to uphold the ideal that nations can resolve their issues through dialogue instead of violence. That was the lasting message of VE day—the demand for peace, justice and solidarity across the globe. That is why, today, on the 80th anniversary of VE day, we must all recommit to those ideals. No matter what walk of life people come from, their faith, their nationality or their vision for the broader world, we all have a shared aspiration for peace, dignity and freedom across the globe.
On this day, we remember them, we thank them and we pledge to carry their values forward. We think not just of those who lost their lives in that war but of those who are losing their lives in wars today. We resolve to deliver a fairer, more peaceful and more just world.
15:53
Today’s motion reminds us of the hundreds of thousands of members of the UK forces and the tens of thousands of civilians whose lives were lost in world war two. Beyond those deaths, the war caused up to 85 million deaths worldwide—about 3 per cent of the global population at the time. That number includes the 6 million Jews and the millions of others who were exterminated by the Nazis. An estimated 40 million to 60 million people were displaced.
However, mere statistics are not enough to truly comprehend the scale of what had to be done to defeat Nazism and fascism, the sacrifice of those who fought and the scale of the impact on the millions of lives affected. I honestly do not think that I can begin to imagine the emotional release that must have come—including in households that were, as the First Minister described, still suffering their own personal grief while the celebrations began—when the announcement of VE day was made.
In the wake of such suffering, VE day led to new beginnings. In recognising that they had fought together and survived together, people decided to rebuild their society together, with a welfare state and a national health service—an astonishing legacy for that generation to leave us—the creation of international institutions of peace, a framework of international law, human rights and what eventually became the European Union.
However, it is important to remember that VE day was not the end of the story for those who were still enduring war in other parts of the world, or for East Germany, which went from Nazi to communist control. It would be decades before that country would achieve freedom and join a peaceful and democratic family of European nations. It was not the end of the story for the gay men who were liberated from Nazi concentration camps but re-imprisoned by the allies.
We must also remember that the struggle to defeat fascism remains our responsibility today. We see an expansionist war against Ukraine being rewarded on the world stage and the horrific images of genocide from Gaza. We see the brutality of immigration detention camps and imprisonment without trial in countries that claim to be democracies. We see far-right ideology growing around the world and the arrest of Nazis in the UK only yesterday. We hear prominent voices in major political parties seeking to abolish our fundamental human rights and tear up the astonishing endowment that the post-war generation left us. As we see the UK Government celebrating VE day on the same day that it announces an agreement with a US President whose ideology is indistinguishable from fascism, we need to remember that appeasement never works.
I will end with the words of Ken Turner, 98 years old, as he sat in a Sherman tank. Mr Turner served in world war two, as did the tank. In a video that was posted on social media yesterday, he said:
“I’m old enough to have seen fascism the first time round, and now it’s coming back.”
After driving that tank over a Tesla and crushing it, he gave this message to Elon Musk:
“We’ve crushed fascism before and we’ll crush it again.”
Ken gets it—he knows what had to be done and the cost of what had to be done—but Ken also knows why it had to be done, and he knows that it must still be done. Let us never forget what Ken has reminded us of.
15:57
It is my distinct privilege to offer the Liberal Democrats’ respects to the fallen in our armed forces and in armed forces across the world; to the dead in our civilian population and across the world; and to the victims of the Nazi Holocaust—something that we have heard a lot about this afternoon, and rightly so.
I was reflecting on what this 80th anniversary means in Germany, and I heard a fascinating radio interview with a German diplomat who was asked that question. He explained to the interviewer that, in Germany, the date is seen as a commemoration of liberation, because it was a liberation of normal Germans from, in the words of Churchill,
“the odious apparatus of Nazi rule”.
On dates such as this, we often forget the brave Germans who stood up against Hitler within the Third Reich and those who, for want of freedom, died under its regime. Today, I am thinking of those brave people, such as Sophie Scholl and Pastor Niemöller.
We are also thinking today of our brave Scottish communities who, in a singular national effort of determination, pulled together for the war effort.
I asked the First Minister about the Polish airmen. I grew up in a farming village not far from RAF Leuchars in Fife, and there was a shed at the bottom of our garden that still had telephone lines and a fireplace for the three Polish airmen who had lived in that shed for three years. Even then, there were still signs of our collective war effort.
Just last week, in the communities of Lerwick and Scalloway in Shetland, there was a commemoration of the Shetland bus. As part of that operation, merchant navy vessels took troops, ammunition and weaponry to and from the Norwegian resistance. I pay tribute to all of them.
Each of our communities played its part in certain ways, but each of us—as the First Minister very movingly told us—will have personal reflections on this 80th anniversary.
I think of my grandfather and his three siblings in particular today. His older brother, Dick, was a German linguist and, as such, became an interrogator in prisoner of war camps. His younger brother, David, who was a commander on HMS Sikh, was, sadly, killed on a troop transport, which was sunk north of Tobruk by a Stuka dive-bomber. My father is named for him, such is the enduring memory of his loss.
Their sister, Joan, was awarded an MBE at the age of 23 for her service to the Foreign and Commonwealth Office in the Norwegian legation that evacuated the King and the Government from Oslo as the Wehrmacht rolled in. She walked overland to a resistance farmhouse, led by Frank Foley, and was eventually evacuated by submarine. Sadly, she died in 1945, just after the San Francisco conference that set up the United Nations. Her plane disappeared over the Atlantic, and we still have a letter in my attic from Anthony Eden expressing grave concern for her loss.
It was my grandfather who taught me everything about freedom and sacrifice. He served as the lieutenant commander on a destroyer in the north Atlantic. He was one of the last surviving witnesses of the sinking of HMS Hood by Bismarck, and he lived to tell the tale. I have 19 hours of audio of his seafaring stories, which I treasure.
We have heard a lot about Winston Churchill’s remarks from the balcony of the health ministry on this day, 80 years ago. He gave a very short speech, and much of it has been quoted, but these lines have not:
“My dear friends, this is your hour. This is not victory of party or of any class. It’s a victory of the great British nation as a whole. We were the first, in this ancient island, to draw the sword against tyranny.”
With those words, he closed out a war that had endured for six years. He ushered in a long peace, and it is a long peace that it is incumbent on decision makers and parliamentarians like us in chambers such as this to safeguard for future generations, and we must also recognise those who draw the sword against tyranny in places such as Ukraine today.
We move to the open debate.
16:01
Eighty years ago, the world exhaled when the guns across Europe fell silent, because VE day marked not just victory but our survival—a freedom reclaimed and a future made possible.
This day always brings me back to my grandfather—my Pa—who fought in the war. When I was a wee girl, he would tell me stories of his time as a soldier, although I realise now that the stories were very heavily filtered for my young mind. He was a great storyteller, and it seemed to me that war was his great adventure—racing from exploding bridges, laughing with his soldier pals and falling in love with my gran through letters passed across their worlds.
For my young mind, he made it all into a Hollywood movie version. There is one particular story that he told that has stuck with me, and I have grown to understand and find deeper meaning in it. He told me that, when the soldiers were lined up for religious observance, names were called out of particular religions—Catholic, Baptist, Church of England—but my Pa would be left standing, so he would be asked, “Well, what religion are you?” He would straighten his shoulders, with his chin up, and proudly exclaim, “Church of Scotland, sir”. That always made us giggle as a family when I was little, but as I have grown up, I can see that there was more to it than just a wee funny story. In that moment, he was telling us about a deep sense of identity—a sense of belonging—that mattered very much to him. He was there proudly fighting for his country and for his people back home in Scotland.
When he was stationed in Italy, my gran was serving here at home as a firewoman, and their love story spanned war zones. I still have the love letters that they exchanged, which are filled with words of longing and hope and with plenty of the word “darling”. They dreamed of being reunited and of their future together, and thanks to VE day, they got that chance.
My dad and I are compiling those stories so that we do not lose them to time, but when I recall them now, with my adult mind, I can see the parts that my grandfather had omitted—the fear, the horror and those soldier pals who did not make it home. That is a reality that he chose to shield me from.
We must mark VE day not just as a celebration but as a solemn reminder. We are here today because our relatives survived, but many never came home. From Scotland alone, 57,000 armed forces personnel lost their lives, and millions more lives were lost across the world. They sacrificed not just their lives but their future posterity.
As we honour the efforts of Royal British Legion Scotland and Poppyscotland, which have beautifully marked this 80th anniversary with Scotland’s salute to VE day, it is important that we also acknowledge the deeper meaning behind those tributes. The concerts, the gatherings and the red poppies are not just about looking back with pride but about carrying forward a warning. Remembrance is not passive. It is a deep responsibility that rests on the shoulders of posterity, of those who survived.
At a time when war once again rages in parts of Europe, when hatred is on the rise and democracy and peace feel very fragile, we must learn from the past. Those people fought for a world for us to build, not to destroy. We must remember how we got into that war in the first place and what it cost, but we must also remember how we came back from it.
VE day should never have to be repeated. We should let it remain a celebration of hard-won peace and protect that with everything that we have. For the futures that ended too soon, and for those who never got to be, let us mark this 80th anniversary not only with words but with purpose, and let it be a thank you, but also a promise.
16:05
It is a real honour to contribute to the debate. I associate myself with the motion in the First Minister’s name, with the moving speech that he gave today and, as Stephen Kerr said, with many of the speeches that he has made on the subject in the past. It is encouraging that all our party leaders have taken part in today’s debate to show the importance of the subject.
When I was considering what to speak about, I wondered whether I should focus on the celebration that the war in Europe had finished or whether I should recognise that the war continued for some time thereafter. I will do a bit of both.
There is absolutely no doubt that VE day was a celebration. The royal family posted a comment this morning to remind us that the then Princess Elizabeth went out on to the Mall on VE day, pulling down her uniform cap so that she could go out incognito to join the thronging crowds that had turned out to celebrate. She went on to reign over this country for 70 years and it was important for her to be among the people whom she would serve for seven decades.
We have heard many quotes today from Winston Churchill. The one that strikes me most is that he said:
“We may allow ourselves a brief period of rejoicing, but let us not forget for a moment the toil and efforts that lie ahead.”
Although there was celebration, there was still much to do.
Throughout this week, as I have watched many of the events shown on television and listened to today’s debate, I have been struck by the ever-dwindling number of people who fought in that war. When I watch remembrance Sunday events, I see that the veterans marching past the cenotaph look older and frailer and are fewer in number. That reminds me that we owe them a great debt of thanks for what they did, but that we also have an obligation to ensure that their memory lives on in future generations because of what they sacrificed during the war and, as Karen Adam reminded us, because many did not come home.
This morning, my three-year-old was excited that he did not have to wear his usual uniform to nursery and that he got to wear his party clothes. He did not know why he was wearing party clothes but, in years to come, he will, and I want to ensure that the next generation knows about the sacrifices of the past.
It is in that spirit that I really commend to members a two-part podcast produced by Parklands care home. The company has care homes across Moray and the Highlands and has produced a podcast called “Peace at Last: Memories of VE Day” so that memories will not be forgotten but will be passed on to the next generation. Listening to some of the residents’ experiences will bring a tear to your eye: tears of sadness because of what happened but also tears of joy at the resilience that many of those people still have eight decades after VE day.
I will pick a couple of those who shared their first-hand experiences. Dr Jean Munro is 101 years old and is a resident at Lynemore care home in Grantown-on-Spey. She spoke about working in hut 6 at Bletchley Park, but really did not acknowledge how important her role was. In fact, until the 1980s, she would not even tell her friends and family about the role that she played in the war. Then there is 101-year-old Mamie Cree. I know Mamie because her son, Stewart Cree, was a councillor and the convener of Moray Council. She speaks about how she was conscripted to go from Keith to Dalkeith during the war, which was a major thing for her because she had never travelled further than Elgin. Mamie speaks about her work in Army payroll but also about some of the positives, such as how she went to wartime dances and how, at one of those dances, she met her future husband, Jack, to whom she was married for 75 years.
I say all that because we must recognise the horrors of war, but we must also recognise that those stories will be lost if we do not continue to articulate them in the future. It is a commitment that I give to my boys and future generations; we must ensure that they know about the horrors of the past, and that we never forget the sacrifices of so many in that war and in many other conflicts.
16:10
Today we commemorate the 80th anniversary of victory in Europe day. On this day, eight decades ago, the guns fell silent across the European continent, marking the end of a brutal conflict that engulfed the world in darkness and despair.
VE day stands as a testament to the resilience, courage and unwavering spirit of those who fought for freedom and justice. As we reflect on this historic milestone, we honour the sacrifices that were made by millions of men and women who served on the front lines and the home front. I want to reflect on some stories from Aberdeen and the north-east, but some stories I do not know.
I know that a large group of Aberdeen women were conscripted to work in munitions factories in Coventry, because my grandmother, Violet Morris, was one of them. However, I do not know any of her tales from Coventry, because she refused to talk about her experiences, which makes me think that, for her and for those other young women who had to move far from home, those experiences were pretty grim.
We also have to look at the fact that war touched every community, with the sacrifice of the Gordon Highlanders touching every part of the globe, from Dunkirk and St Valery to Singapore and Burma, from El-Alamein to the beaches of Anzio and Normandy, and onwards as they went to liberate Rome and Germany. In the dark days of 1940, the threat of invasion was real, with the beaches of Aberdeen a tempting target. To this day, our children play among the remains of pillboxes on north-east beaches.
Although the invasion did not come, those who were at home were not spared, with Aberdeen enduring 34 bombing raids, the worst being on 21 April 1943, when 31 tonnes of bombs rained down on Hilltown and Powis.
Despite those darkest of days, through the bravery and sacrifice of our men and women in uniform, victory came 80 years ago today. On this 80th anniversary, we are reminded of the importance of solidarity. The victory that was achieved on VE day was not the triumph of one nation over another but the collective victory of all who stood against tyranny and oppression.
However, as we honour the past, we must also confront the present, because today we face some of the same challenges as those that forged the peace on VE day, and I hope that that does not unravel. The far right is again on the rise across Europe and North America, and here in these islands. The ills of society are once again being blamed on minorities and people from overseas, with older and disabled folk being singled out as a drain on society. Those movements and views threaten the very values that so many fought and died to protect during world war two.
It is our duty today to stand against hatred and division, and to uphold the principles of democracy, human rights and the rule of law.
16:14
Today, on the 80th anniversary of VE day, we paused to reflect on all those from our communities who gave their lives in the course of the second world war, for the freedom and liberation of Europe and for the peace and security of us all.
The war memorials in our towns and villages are etched with the names of those who fell—on land, at sea and in the air—and who made the ultimate sacrifice for the things that we value so much.
Today, I am also thinking of those who suffered so much and who lost their lives here in Scotland and in the communities that I represent across West Scotland. I am thinking of the terrible toll that the blitz took on communities in Clydebank, Greenock and so many other industrial towns across the west coast. The scars run deep in those communities, even to this day—whether they be scars in the minds of people who survived, physical scars or the scars that were inflicted on the landscape, which would never look the same again.
Many of us have brought personal stories and we have heard very eloquent ones. Those stories are important. Many of us have loved ones who lived through and perhaps served in the war.
I have been thinking a lot about my grandmother, who would have been 95 if she were still alive. She did not live to see me be elected to the Scottish Parliament. When she passed, she left me a painting of Craighead in Barrhead, where she was born and where she grew up. It sits in my office upstairs. I was thinking about that painting today, because it shows the house from which my grandmother experienced the second world war. She would tell us stories frequently about the blackout, rationing, carrying your gas mask to school, and the work that she did for the local co-operative society in her teenage years during the war. I was also thinking about how she would have left that close in Craighead on VE day to join the celebrations in the community of Barrhead. I remember the sense of relief and joy that she expressed that war in Europe had finally come to an end.
There is something else important that I have been thinking today about my gran and her generation. We have heard it articulated already in speeches. My gran’s generation—the generation who lived through the war—not only gifted us freedom and security but went on to gift us so much more of the things that we value in this country today. They are the generation who rebuilt this country from the ashes and rubble of war. They are the generation who turned their shoulder to the wheel, having faced the storm. Under the reforming Labour Government of Clement Attlee, they gifted us institutions such as the NHS and the welfare state, new towns and access to education.
They did it in their own ways, washing floors or putting bricks and mortar together. They fed children and helped the ill and disabled. In doing that, they also gave us something more fundamental. They gave us values that endure to this day: the values of standing with and helping our neighbours, of hard work and dedication, of keeping calm and carrying on and of never giving in.
This evening, I will join people in my community of Neilston as we light a beacon for peace. When we do so, I will think of all those who gave their lives and those who gave so much of the life that they had after the war to building this country. I will think of my gran and all those people who stood with her, whom we remember today, on VE day.
16:18
We are gathered here to mark a solemn and significant anniversary: 80 years since victory in Europe day—that moment on 8 May 1945, when, after six long and harrowing years, the guns across Europe finally fell silent.
We remember the 380,000 members of the UK armed forces—among them were 57,000 Scots—and the more than 67,000 civilians who paid the ultimate price during the second world war. Each life lost was a son or daughter, a brother or sister, a neighbour or a friend—ordinary people who were called on to do extraordinary things. Today, let us pay tribute not only to those who fell but to the living who bore the scars, those who returned home wounded in body or soul and those whose lives were forever marked by the trauma of what they had endured and witnessed.
Let us also honour the brave souls from across the Commonwealth and allied nations, whose shared sacrifice helped to secure the fragile peace that we have enjoyed in the decades since. We are indebted, too, to the on-going work of Legion Scotland and Poppy Scotland, whose efforts—such as the moving national commemorative concert that was held in Edinburgh on 6 May—ensure that that legacy of service and sacrifice is never forgotten. Scotland’s salute to VE day, which is supported by the Scottish Government, stands as a fitting tribute not only to those who served but to those who continue to bear the consequences of war.
As members across the chamber have said, today, it is also our duty to speak honestly. VE day did not mark the end of all war or the end of suffering. Just months later, the world witnessed the horrors of Hiroshima and Nagasaki, when two nuclear bombs were dropped on civilian populations, ushering in a new and terrifying chapter of human conflict. Tens of thousands of lives were ended in an instant, and generations continue to suffer from the after-effects. Those strikes were not distant events. They remain a living warning. That terrible power still exists in our world today. The nuclear threat did not die with the cold war. It lingers in arsenals and doctrines, and it whispers into conflicts that grow more complex and dangerous by the day.
That is why we must not only remember the past but learn from it. Indeed, 100 years ago, the Spanish philosopher George Santayana wrote:
“Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it.”
One hundred years later, we see that grim warning being made real. War once again rages on Europe’s borders in Ukraine. Civilians suffer, families flee and children grow up to the sounds of missiles, not music. The echoes of the past resound. The echoes of the worst atrocities of man’s inhumanity are deafening to those who are suffering in Gaza, where people have been starved and bombed to death, lives have been extinguished and graves have replaced hospitals and schools. Some call it a modern-day genocide.
Let us be clear: to honour the memory of the fallen is not only to look back, but to strive to stop war happening again and to speak out on the issue. We must ensure that “Never again” is not just a phrase—albeit a truly great phrase—that is carved on memorial stones, but a principle that is carved into the hearts of our politics and our people. Each and every one of us must strive to build a world that is free not only from war, but from the conditions that make war possible: poverty, oppression, hatred and silence in the face of injustice.
Today, as we correctly honour the sacrifice of those who fought and died for our freedom, let us not be content with ceremony alone. Let us ensure that we do not sit silently in the face of today’s atrocities. Let VE day’s 80th anniversary be not only a moment of remembrance, but a call to conscience. Let us not only speak with gratitude for peace but work with urgency for justice, and let us not only honour the sacrifice of the past but act to prevent the suffering of the future, because remembrance without action is remembrance unfulfilled.
16:23
We must never forget the brave men and women who fell during the conflict of world war two and those who fought to secure freedoms and liberties that we all take for granted today. We will forever be indebted to our second world war veterans for the sacrifices that they made, the friends whom they lost or the stories that they have told.
This momentous occasion marks the 80th year since the end of the war in Europe. In my short contribution, I wish to focus on why we need to keep marking that occasion. In every community across the country, names are etched into stone, alongside a rank and the date on which those soldiers died. Those are the names of family members and loved ones who will never be forgotten.
Every year, we stand at those memorials and fall silent. Among the crowds that gather are veterans of past wars and more recent conflicts, armed forces personnel, community groups, members of the public and, of course, politicians. We attend those events because we understand the significance of past conflicts and how fragile our world is. That is why I intend to introduce a member’s bill to protect our war memorials. It is important to ensure that they survive for years to come because, one day, there will be no more veterans left to attend such important occasions. We must encourage our younger generations to learn what people in our communities fought and died for—the triumph over totalitarianism.
Often we are told that there is an overfocus on world wars in our education system. However, given current global conflicts, it has never been more important that we reflect on our shared history in order to ensure that our future is one of peace. The values of victory in Europe day are as relevant now as they were then.
In the time that I have left, I will share an uplifting incentive that I read about. It is a fantastic example of how schools can connect with our armed forces and veterans community while learning about the VE day commemorations. Through the Together Coalition, 1,300 schools requested a letter from a veteran setting out their wartime experience and what it means to them 80 years later. Passing that baton of memory and meaning to the next generation will not only have helped to close the generational gap, but will have left a huge impression on the young people, who now have memories of being able to speak to a veteran who lived and fought through the second world war. The Commonwealth War Graves Foundation is the proud custodian of those letters, which have captured those moments in history and which form an additional piece of the picture that members of the public will be able to reflect on in years to come.
I think that that is wonderful. It is what we should strive for in our society—connecting older generations with younger generations, in order to learn from past mistakes. Sharing those experiences can ensure that our future generations do not repeat the mistakes that were made by previous ones.
There is only one thing left for me to say, and that is that we will remember them.
Jackie Dunbar is the final speaker in the open debate.
16:26
It is an honour to speak in today’s debate commemorating the 80th anniversary of VE day, as we remember the sacrifices that made VE day possible.
The First Minister said today that we all naturally think about how the lives of our own families were affected by the war. The stories that have come from across the chamber today have reflected that.
My first thoughts are of my granddad, Private James Dunbar. He served with the Gordon Highlanders and was captured with the 51st Highland division at St Valery. When granddad left home to serve his country, my dad was just weeks old. After years as a prisoner of war—of which he rarely spoke later—victory in Europe meant that he got home safe. He got home to my granny and their bairns, including my dad, who was by then five years old and had no memory of ever meeting his dad, so to him it was a first meeting. My granddad got to enjoy the peace and freedoms that he fought for and he got to see his children and grandchildren grow up with those.
That was not the case for thousands of others who served during that war, including 57,000 Scots. Today, as we remember those who lost their lives during world war two and those who contributed to the war effort across that time, I urge folk also to reflect on what they fought for.
VE day was a victory for democracy. It ensured freedoms for folk across Europe. In its aftermath, the Universal Declaration of Human Rights was agreed and concerted efforts were made to maintain and build on what was secured with the end of that long and bloody war. There was a recognition that peace for their time was not enough and that building a lasting peace is an on-going process.
Scotland has enjoyed 80 years of peace since then, but across the world we are seeing democracy, human rights and basic freedoms increasingly under threat. We cannot afford to just paper over the cracks. We owe it to those who sacrificed so much to make peace happen in the first place to ensure that it continues for decades more to come.
We also owe it to them, and to the veterans who since then have helped to maintain that peace, to ensure that we look after those who served and their families. Charities such as Poppyscotland, Legion Scotland, Forces Children Scotland and many others go above and beyond to ensure that people do not slip through the support net that we have in place. They support and stand up for everyone who is part of the armed forces family. I put on record my appreciation for the work that they do.
I finish on the point that, 80 years on from VE day, there are not many veterans from world war two left. The youngest, who would have been just teenagers at the end of the war, are nearing 100 years of age. The second world war is fading from living memory. The next few years will be the last chance that we have to hear about world war two at first hand, rather than just reading about it in history books. I hope that folk will take that chance to speak to the veterans that we have left, not just about what they did, but about why they did it, why it was so important to win that war and why it is so important that we build peace and commit to not repeating the mistakes of the past. Their legacy is the peace that they secured and built on, and we need to ensure that that legacy is passed on to generations to come.
We move to the closing speeches.
16:30
Eighty years ago today, after monumental sacrifice and suffering, Nazi Germany was forced into unconditional surrender. However, that was not the end of the fighting in Europe. The battle of Slivice did not end until 12 May and the battle of Odžak in Bosnia did not end until 25 May. Across Europe, for weeks after VE day, people still fought and died in the struggle against the remnants of Nazism. Today, we remember them as well. As the First Minister said, there were three more months of suffering in Asia before Japan was defeated. Nonetheless, the greatest moment in the history of Europe was the absolute defeat of the Nazi empire on 8 May 1945. It is now more important than ever to remember that, given, as Jackie Dunbar highlighted, that experience is fading from living memory.
I will never forget what my gran told me about surviving the Clydebank blitz—how the children were taken to the bottom of the tenement close, how every adult left to fight the fires and how every window was shattered. There was an inescapable orange glow because everything was on fire. In that whole community, just 12 buildings were left undamaged at the end of that 48 hours. My church was hit—the building took a direct hit from an incendiary and was destroyed. It is so hard to imagine now—bombs falling on Clydebank. What an incredible privilege it is to live in Scotland in this era, when that kind of conflict here is unfathomable.
The First Minister mentioned the contrast between the loss and the joy that were felt by so many families, and Patrick Harvie mentioned that, for entire nations, that joy was short lived because the iron curtain then fell. I add to that the experience of the Spanish exile community here in Scotland and across Europe. Nazism was defeated in 1945, but it would take 30 more years before fascism was defeated in Europe, with its end in Spain. I also want to remember the Scots who volunteered to fight against fascism in Spain before we were forced to do so against Nazi Germany.
Nazism was defeated only through unimaginable sacrifice by our armed forces, our allies and resistance movements across the continent. It was years before we fully understood the scale of the Holocaust in particular—the attempted extermination of Jews, disabled people, LGBT people, the Gypsy Roma Traveller community and other so-called undesirables. When we learned of that, we said, “Never again.”
The United Nations and the European Union were established on that commitment to peace, but attempted extermination has happened again across the world. It is happening now in Israel’s genocidal assault on Palestine. We also have a war of aggression in Europe that is being fought against free and democratic Ukraine by Putin’s fascistic Russian regime.
Douglas Ross recognised the tension today between reflecting on evil and the suffering that it caused, and the joy at its defeat. Today is a day for both of those. It is a day for us to remember those who were lost, to celebrate the freedom that their sacrifice won and to recommit to the fight against rising fascism today and the fight for freedom here and now.
16:34
I thank members for some very thoughtful and, at times, moving contributions. Eighty years is an important milestone. It is a literal lifetime since the war ended in Europe, and we need to reflect on that.
My personal reflection, as it always is at moments of silence, was on what it would have been like. Beyond the numbers, which we need to remember, and the history and politics, we need to ask what it would have been like to be one of those young people in a landing craft on D day, or in a bomber flying over the darkened skies of Germany, knowing that, in the latter case, you had a 40 per cent chance of survival. What would it have been like knowing that, coming off one of those landing crafts, there was a very high chance that you would lose your life in pursuit of democracy and against fascism? I do not know what that would be like; I actually really cannot imagine it. I also cannot imagine what it would have been like to come from a civilian life and to be conscripted and asked by your country to do that.
As we move past the 80-year anniversary and beyond living memory, we need to keep that fresh, visceral memory alive. It must have been incredibly scary. It was an incredible sacrifice, and an incredible thing to go through. After all, 85 million people—3 per cent of the world’s population—lost their lives. It was a conflict the like of which and the scale of which we had never seen before, and we must never allow it to be seen again. Members are right to have raised concerns about whether we are continuing to learn those lessons.
We also need to remember that it was not only armed forces personnel that made that commitment. The nature of world war two was different; it was a total world war. It was good to hear contributions from across the chamber about that, including Douglas Ross’s reflections about family members going down to Dalkeith to work on Army payroll, and Kevin Stewart’s comments on family members going to work in Coventry. There were a vast number of people in reserved occupations—people whose duty was to serve on the home front—including those conscripted to work in the coal mines. The conflict consumed the whole of society. Everyone had a part to play, and everyone did that. The scale is not just about the number of people fighting, because the conflict consumed the whole of society. That is why the lessons of world war two are so important.
At this 80-year mark, we need to remember that many of the lessons stem from the fact that world war two occurred only one generation following world war one. The commitments and the lessons learned from world war two happened because we could not afford the proximity of another global conflict so swiftly after that war, as had happened after world war one.
I was pleased to hear the contributions of the First Minister and Anas Sarwar, which reflected on how the new order was created and the institutions that people sought to create. What I find most interesting is that people did not wait until after the war to create those. In 1943, Winston Churchill called for the creation of the Council of Europe, which came into being. It was in 1944 that the Bretton Woods conference took place, which sought to create economic institutions, including many that exist today.
The lesson of the first world war was that war was created by economic and political circumstances, and that the world had to work together to ensure that those could not—
I agree entirely with the analysis that the member is sharing with Parliament. Does he agree that there is a particular threat and challenge to the strength of those global institutions at the moment? There is a duty on everybody to reflect on the significant role that those institutions have played—although it has not been perfect—in avoiding conflict for many years. Does he agree that we all need to recognise the peril that many of those institutions now face?
I very much agree with that point, and that was the conclusion that I was seeking to draw. Although people are right to reflect on the rise of the far right and fascism, and we must guard against that, more fundamentally, we need to understand that the institutions that sought to create economic stability and economic equality were vitally important ingredients in the 80 years of peace that we have enjoyed. At a time when people are seeking to retreat into economic isolation and protectionism, we must see that there are consequences to that. We need a world system in which everyone across the world can enjoy access to economic prosperity. I would make this observation—
I am loth to interrupt Daniel Johnson’s eloquent exposition of what happened to the structures of global unity after the war so that there would never be a war again, but does he recognise that the first treaty of the European Union established the European Coal and Steel Community, so that no country could ever again build a war machine without an EU signatory country knowing that?
That is absolutely right.
It is my observation that our physical security is inextricably linked with our economic security and our political security—the three go hand in hand. We need to protect our national physical, economic and political security all at the same time. That is what the people who were involved sought to do with the creation of structures such as the Council of Europe, the United Nations and the Bretton Woods system. It is also what was sought when we undertook, as Paul O’Kane mentioned, the effort of house building and building the welfare state in the UK. Although it is true at international level, it is also true at national level: everyone must have a stake and everyone must have a fair share.
As we pass the 80-year mark, and as the war passes out of living memory, we must, as many members have said, continue to remember what needs to be done. Institutions matter, equality matters and equity matters. Ultimately, we need countries around the world to continue to work together and not to forget the lessons of world war two.
16:41
It is an honour to speak in today’s debate marking VE day, especially as I am the convener of the cross-party group on the armed forces and veterans community. I thank Graeme Dey, as minister with responsibility for veterans, for his support over the years in recognising the role of not just the CPG but the veterans community.
Eighty years ago, Sir Winston Churchill marked this hour of victory with the following words to the British people. It is a much-used quote, and so it should be. He said:
“My dear friends, this is your hour. This is not victory of a party or of any class. It’s a victory of the great British nation as a whole.”
He was right. It was a victory that belonged to everyone—the ordinary men and women who had been forced to put their lives on hold and endure the most awful conflict in human history. They had risen to the occasion like no generation before or since. They fought and died in far-off fields. They suffered night after night of relentless bombing that brought terror to their homes. They raised families and tended the sick while cities fell down around them, and they waded through the rubble to rebuild and carry on. Today, we remember their courage, their sacrifice and their victory over tyranny.
However, even as we celebrate the victory, we must never forget that war itself is nothing to celebrate or glorify. Around 384,000 British soldiers died in world war two, including almost 60,000 Scots. Fighting alongside us, 580,000 Commonwealth troops were killed, and we must never forget the enormous casualties that were suffered by our allies, either.
Sadly, I do not have time to mention every allied contribution, but I want to highlight the role that Polish troops played in my part of Scotland in the early days of the war, with Britain under threat of invasion. It was Polish troops who helped to defend the coast between Arbroath and Burntisland, and we honour them for standing alongside us in that dark hour.
It was not only soldiers who suffered. Tens of thousands of British civilians perished, too, on the streets, at work and even in the one place where they should have been safe—their own homes. By the end of the war, tens of millions of civilians around the world had been killed, including 6 million Jews who were murdered in the Holocaust. Although this is a day of victory, it is also one of remembrance and reflection. With that in mind, I will highlight elements of other members’ contributions, with a focus on those of the party leaders.
The First Minister outlined that few milestones could be more significant in our history. He spoke about visiting his uncle’s grave in Italy and about the gravity of the loss felt by his family. In a poignant and heartfelt contribution, he made it clear that the passing decades do not dampen that memory.
Russell Findlay spoke of the six years of bloodshed and horror that our country endured until it awoke to the light of freedom as the dark forces of fascism were vanquished. He also mentioned the disturbing fact that the average age at which a Scottish serviceman was killed was only 21.
Anas Sarwar spoke of a global struggle against tyranny, in which members of his own family fought in the British Indian Army. He called for a permanent memorial to those heroes and remarked that VE day was the day on which evil was finally defeated.
Patrick Harvie spoke about the scale of the war’s impact on the millions of people whom it affected. In the wake of such suffering there were new beginnings. On the domestic front, the NHS and the welfare state emerged; internationally, institutions such as the United Nations were born.
Alex Cole-Hamilton highlighted the end of the war from the German perspective. For many Germans, today is viewed as a day of liberation from their Nazi oppressors. He spoke about the contributions made in all communities, including that of his own family.
Douglas Ross spoke of the requirement for not only celebration but commemoration on this day. I will certainly listen to the podcast that he mentioned, so that I can hear the interesting stories to which he referred.
Meghan Gallacher said that we will be forever in debt to our veterans, and she outlined why it is so important that we never forget their sacrifice. She also highlighted the importance of war memorials in supporting us to do that.
Victory in Europe was hard won. Let us remember that, especially in the early days of the war, victory was not certain. Despite that, Britain and our allies stood for what was right. We chose to uphold the rule of law, to oppose tyranny and to defend freedom and democracy.
16:47
I thank members for their contributions. It is an honour to close the debate. Every so often, certain topics selected for parliamentary debate require us to set aside our usual tribalism. This has been one such occasion. Colleagues across the chamber have very much risen to the challenge by making excellent, memorable and moving contributions.
Russell Findlay helped to set the tone for the afternoon by reminding us of the scale of the loss worldwide—85 million people—and that the average age of a Scottish serviceman killed during world war two was just 21.
I echo Anas Sarwar’s comments about the members of the British Indian Army who travelled halfway around the world so that, as he put it, they could answer the call. I recognise the tremendous work done by the Colourful Heritage archive here in Scotland to raise awareness of that contribution and remind us of it for ever. The response to fascism truly crossed the boundaries of nationality and faith, and we should never forget that.
Today has served to remind us how greatly Scotland values and supports our armed forces and veterans, which is a reflection of a proud Scottish tradition. Going back through history, Scotland has always had a close link with its armed forces community, regardless of where the people concerned originally hailed from. In large part, that has been due to our regimental structures, which established traditional recruiting grounds across the country. For example, I hail from a part of Scotland that was the home of the Gordon Highlanders, in which my grandfather served, and both the First Minister and I represent the one-time home turf of the Black Watch.
However, as a nation, we have also welcomed many service personnel and units from further afield. As the First Minister rightly noted in his opening speech, it is important that we remember our links with the Commonwealth and the countless men and women from around the world who fought and suffered alongside the people of the United Kingdom during the second world war.
A staggering number of countries were actively involved in the liberation of Europe. More than 14,000 Canadians landed in Normandy during D-day alone, and nearly a million served over the course of the war. South Africans, New Zealanders and Australians all fought alongside the British Indian Army during the gruelling allied advance up the spine of Italy. From even further afield, they were accompanied in their liberation of Italy by an infantry division from Brazil. The free French forces under Charles de Gaulle played a proud part in liberating their homeland, assisted by French colonial troops from Morocco, Senegal and Algeria, while the Polish airborne brigade suffered huge casualties at Arnhem. Alex Cole-Hamilton reminded us of the Poles who served in the RAF and then settled in Scotland.
Resistance fighters and guerrillas across Europe played a vital role in keeping hope of eventual victory alive.
It is important that we recognise people such as my grandfather, who, due to being in a reserved occupation as a dairyman, was part of the home guard, and my gran, who fibbed about her age and left the Calton in Glasgow to come down to Ayrshire with the land army, and who received a medal in recognition of her service only in 2008. Does the minister agree that it is important that we remember them?
I intend to come to that issue at the end of my contribution.
It is important that, when we reflect on the countless sacrifices made during the conflict, we do not overlook the contributions made by civilians here and elsewhere or the broader impact that the war had on them. We should never forget the suffering of families who were left behind at home, facing the future uncertain of what would become of their loved ones, or the sad cases of those who did not come home. Suffering never truly ended for widows, friends and other family members, as the First Minister eloquently reminded us.
Nor should we forget those who lost their lives or homes during bombing attacks, such as the 1,200 people who were killed during the Clydebank blitz, which left only seven properties undamaged of the 12,000 or so in the town at the time. More than 35,000 people were left homeless, and many families were devastated by loss and injury. It was the worst destruction and civilian loss of life in Scotland in the entire second world war. The people of Clydebank showed incredible bravery and commitment in rebuilding their community and their lives under such terrible circumstances. In the face of devastation, they pulled together and worked continuously for three days to rescue trapped victims and minimise losses. Paul O’Kane was right to remind us of the sacrifice of Clydebank.
I am grateful to the minister for giving way, because he is making a very impressive speech. Does he agree that today’s anniversary, and nearly all the contributions in the debate, highlight the importance of history and the teaching of history, and that we, as a Parliament, should commit to continuing the teaching of the subject of the second world war in our schools? Does he agree that once young people learn the history, as has been the experience of my children and now my grandchildren, they will have an awakened appreciation of the value of freedom, the price of freedom and what it takes to stay free?
I agree with that. I note the contribution to keeping tradition and history alive of the poppy bud, which travels Scotland under the guidance of Poppyscotland. It certainly brings to life, particularly for young children, what actually happened, which is incredibly important.
The resilience that I talked about a moment ago during that time came to the fore once more during the pandemic, when those who were young children back in the early 1940s coped, as they did, with the social isolation that was required for society to respond to Covid-19. Much is rightly made of the impact of the pandemic on young people, but often the most elderly in our communities were the most isolated. The wartime generation pointed the way for us when it came to being resilient in the face of that challenge.
On the subject of showing resilience and coping with adversity, it would be remiss of us all not to reflect on the legacy issues of war, which have been carried for years by those who witnessed combat horrors and atrocities during the second world war.
Combatants returned in their hundreds of thousands to their civilian lives after the second world war, and many carried some quite awful, unimaginable memories with them. Post-traumatic stress disorder was barely acknowledged back then, and our understanding of its impact was negligible. It is only now, at a time when PTSD is far better recognised, that we can perhaps reflect that the impact of the second world war on those who served was felt way into the future. In doing that, our admiration for the resilience of that generation is surely only enhanced.
My grandfather, Major James McIntosh, formed the 5th and 7th Gordon Highlanders old comrades association when he returned to civilian life. His commitment to and passion for the task of maintaining the connection with the men he served with was something to behold. Behind that and the amazing camaraderie of the members, there was the deep sadness of loss, reflected in the fact that the 5th and 7th battalions of the Gordons were merged due to the losses that each had suffered during the war—there were so few of them left that they could not maintain two battalions. It is a compliment to the sense of purpose that they returned with and, as I said, to their camaraderie that they placed such importance on maintaining their connection for decades afterwards.
I want to focus briefly on some of the elements of the second world war that are all too often overlooked. We all recognise that the role of the merchant navy has often been overlooked when we reflect on the second world war. Members of the merchant navy showed incredible bravery and resilience in transporting vital supplies through the Arctic convoys to mainland Europe and beyond, despite the threat of U-boat attacks. It would also be utterly remiss of us not to note the many other civilian contributions to the war effort. I am thinking of the fire service, the home guard, which Elena Whitham touched on, those who worked so hard in our shipyards, the munitions factories, and, of course, the land army. They are great examples of that contribution.
In the honour roll of those who did not serve at the front but ensured that the front could serve, mention should be made of our mining communities, particularly here in Scotland.
Hear, hear. My apologies. In listing some, we run the risk of leaving others out, but it is absolutely correct for Martin Whitfield to remind us of that.
Eighty years on from the original VE day, we continue to hold an honoured place in our hearts for those who laid down their lives in protection of the ideals and values that we rightfully cherish. All of us owe them a great debt. They will never be forgotten. As Anas Sarwar said, we must carry forward their values.