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Chamber and committees

Plenary, 19 Nov 2009

Meeting date: Thursday, November 19, 2009


Contents


Question Time


SCOTTISH EXECUTIVE


General Questions

The Presiding Officer (Alex Fergusson):

I say to members at the outset of general question time that the Presiding Officers are all keen to tighten up the whole process of questioning and answering in order to get more members involved. I hope that members will respect that today. Having said that, I have acceded to a request from the Minister for Environment to give a brief update on the flooding situation in the south-west in response to question 1, so I will give her a small amount of leeway for that.


Scottish Environment Protection Agency (Flood Management)

To ask the Scottish Government when the Minister for Environment will next meet officials from the Scottish Environment Protection Agency to discuss issues relating to flood management. (S3O-8489)

The Minister for Environment (Roseanna Cunningham):

As the member might expect me to confirm, I meet officials from SEPA very regularly to discuss issues relating to flooding. The most recent meeting was on 12 November, when we had a detailed discussion about the recent flooding events in the north-east of Scotland.

I have been involved in a teleconference this morning in respect of the situation that is beginning to unfold across much of the central belt and the south-west, where a very severe event is anticipated, as the Presiding Officer may know. The local strategic co-ordinating groups have been activated, and we are in as constant contact with them as is possible. We wish to reassure all members that everything that can be done in advance of any potential impact is being carried out. However, if individual members wish to know more specific information about their areas, I invite them to get in touch with my office directly.

Maureen Watt:

I am sure that we all hope that the level of preparedness for the present flooding is better than it was previously.

The minister will be aware of the recent flooding in Stonehaven. Locals tell me that the Carron Water and the Cowie Water, which burst their banks, used to be significantly deeper than they are now. SEPA does not allow them to be deepened, as that would disturb wildlife habitats. Will she ask SEPA to review that policy, which has resulted not only in the destruction of wildlife nesting sites but in the devastation of the homes and businesses of many families?

Roseanna Cunningham:

SEPA allows dredging in certain places. It has a difficult decision to make when requests are made. Since 1997, local authorities have been under a duty to cleanse watercourses of debris and sediment where the authority considers that such works would substantially reduce the risk of flooding of non-agricultural land. That position might change very slightly under the Flood Risk Management (Scotland) Act 2009. Individual requests for dredging are dealt with on an individual basis. I am not aware of generalised requests having been turned down in Aberdeenshire. If there are specific ones that the member wishes to raise, I can get back to her.

Mike Rumbles (West Aberdeenshire and Kincardine) (LD):

The minister will be aware that there have been calls in Stonehaven, in my constituency, for a public local inquiry into the actions—or the lack of action, it has been suggested—of SEPA, Scottish Water and other agencies. Does she support the call for a public local inquiry?

Roseanna Cunningham:

The setting up of a public local inquiry would not be a matter for the Government. I am aware that other members have added their voices to that call. How such an inquiry might be organised would be a matter for the various agencies involved. I certainly would not stand in the way of an inquiry taking place.


G20 Finance Ministers Meeting (Costs)

To ask the Scottish Government what the costs were of the G20 finance ministers meeting in St Andrews and whether Her Majesty's Treasury has agreed to meet all costs from HM Government budgets. (S3O-8478)

The Cabinet Secretary for Justice (Kenny MacAskill):

We are in close contact with Fife Constabulary, which is currently collating information about the final costs of the event. We have asked HM Treasury to confirm that the United Kingdom Government will meet the costs associated with the event, in line with the statement of funding policy that was agreed between the Treasury and the devolved Administrations. A response is awaited.

Tricia Marwick:

I note that the cabinet secretary is in touch with HM Treasury and that there is no agreement yet that the Treasury will meet the costs. The cabinet secretary is aware that the costs of the G8 summit in 2005 were more than £90 million, two thirds of which was eventually paid by the Scottish Government. Such a situation would simply not be acceptable on this occasion.

Question, please.

Does the cabinet secretary agree that the costs of the G20 meeting should not be paid by the Scottish Government or Fife Constabulary?

Kenny MacAskill:

That is certainly our position, which is why the protocol and arrangements were entered into. The G20 meeting was substantially smaller in scale than the G8 summit. It was remarkably well policed by Fife Constabulary and we are extremely grateful to the police that the event was trouble free and had only a limited impact on the community.

Arrangements are in place and we are in regular communication with HM Treasury. We do not want to anticipate a problem and we hope that there will be no problem, but we will seek to defend the interests of the people who pay their taxes and fund the police, whether through the Government or through their council tax. Let us see what the discussions bring.

Ted Brocklebank (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Con):

It is always important to allocate the costs for policing big events appropriately. Does the cabinet secretary agree that it is also important to say, "Thanks for a job well done"? He concedes that the policing of the recent G20 summit in St Andrews was impeccable, combining excellent public order with a degree of flexibility. Although it is not—

Quickly, please.

Although it is not the convention for ministers to sign members' motions, does the cabinet secretary agree that Tricia Marwick might consider signing the motion of congratulation to Fife Constabulary that was lodged in my name?

Kenny MacAskill:

Every elected representative in Fife, whichever party they represent, is aware of the excellence of Fife Constabulary. Indeed, every member of the Scottish Parliament is aware that we have an excellent police force. Whether a member signs a motion is a matter for them, but I think that all members heartily pay tribute to Fife Constabulary. The event passed safely, with no disruption to the surrounding community, and there were only five arrests, after a small group of protesters chained themselves together. That is testimony to the excellent policing that was provided by the police in Fife.


All Wales Convention

To ask the Scottish Government whether it had an input into the Welsh Assembly Government's All Wales Convention. (S3O-8467)

The Minister for Culture, External Affairs and the Constitution (Michael Russell):

The constitutional future of Wales is a matter for the people of Wales.

Officials have had limited contact with the All Wales Convention. However, the First Minister and I met the Independent Commission on Funding and Finance for Wales—the Holtham commission—which, given its remit to study the Assembly's funding arrangements, as well as tax-varying and borrowing powers, was of more relevance to Scotland's interests.

It is right for the people of Wales to have a say in their future, just as the people of Scotland should have their say on the constitutional future of Scotland in a referendum.

Aileen Campbell:

Will the minister join me in welcoming the publication of the All Wales Convention's final report? He will be aware of the consensus in Wales in favour of a referendum to decide the country's constitutional future. Does he agree that it is untenable for politicians such as David Cameron to support a referendum on the constitutional future of Wales while opposing a referendum in Scotland?

Michael Russell:

I can say without difficulty that I regard that position as untenable. The member will be aware that not just David Cameron's position but the Liberal Democrats' position is untenable. The one consistency to be found is within the Labour Party, which, despite its agreement with Plaid Cymru in the programme for government that it would back a referendum, is now saying that it is not sure whether it should do so. In Wales and in Scotland, the Labour Party is against reasonable change and letting people have their say.

Question 4 has been withdrawn.


School Estate (Additional Support Needs)

To ask the Scottish Government what plans it has to improve the school estate for pupils with additional support needs. (S3O-8522)

The Cabinet Secretary for Education and Lifelong Learning (Fiona Hyslop):

Our new school estate strategy recognises the importance of good-quality buildings and facilities for all pupils, including those with additional support needs. It sets an ambitious target of having well in excess of 90 per cent of pupils educated in good-condition schools, and plans for the rest.

Following an invitation in the context of the next phase of the new school building programme, Inverclyde Council submitted a proposal to us, which would improve the school estate for pupils who have additional support needs. Although I cannot say anything in advance of an announcement about the next phase of the programme, I assure Duncan McNeil that Inverclyde's proposal will be considered alongside all the others that were submitted to us and to the Convention of Scottish Local Authorities, with which we are working on the matter.

Duncan McNeil:

I thank the cabinet secretary for her answer, which anticipated my supplementary question. She is aware that Inverclyde Council has spent a significant amount of money on the school estate. It would be a terrible tragedy if special needs children lost out on new schools. I am pleased that the cabinet secretary confirmed that the council's proposal is being properly considered. When will she meet council representatives to ensure that there is quick progress on the proposal?

Fiona Hyslop:

As the member knows, the taxpayer is currently supporting Inverclyde Council to the tune of £5.73 million a year over 30 years for a school building programme, the financial close of which was October 2008. He was correct to identify the importance of driving forward the programme and proposals on the estate, particularly for pupils who have additional support needs.

The member will appreciate that I cannot pre-empt the discussions with COSLA. However, when the announcement has been made we will move swiftly to engage with all councils for which the announcement means that they will be able to progress the school building programme, and particularly with Inverclyde Council, should it be part of the programme.

Stuart McMillan (West of Scotland) (SNP):

Does the cabinet secretary agree that local authorities should prepare robust proposals for additional support needs education? Does she also agree that pupils who require such education must not be used as a political football and should be considered on their own merits and needs?

Fiona Hyslop:

The point is well made. It is striking that the successful councils in Scotland are those in which political parties come together. For example, the Scottish National Party group in Inverclyde Council has made representations, as has Duncan McNeil. It is important that the individual child's needs are supported. Political posturing by any party in that context can sometimes hamper rather than support education.

Question 6 was not lodged.


South Lanarkshire Council (Meetings)

To ask the Scottish Executive when the Cabinet Secretary for Education and Lifelong Learning last met representatives of South Lanarkshire Council. (S3O-8506)

The Cabinet Secretary for Education and Lifelong Learning (Fiona Hyslop):

I most recently met representatives of South Lanarkshire Council on 2 July, as part of a programme of visits by ministers to all local authorities in Scotland, to discuss a range of education issues. The council noted that it has reduced class sizes in early primary classes and in deprived areas. It expects an educational impact, through active learning and greater interaction between pupils and teachers. Research shows us that smaller class sizes make a big difference in the early years.

Karen Gillon:

I congratulate that Labour council on its work to secure good education for young people in Clydesdale.

What is the cabinet secretary doing about the increasing number of teachers who are seeking employment, who could be further reducing class sizes to meet the Government's manifesto objective of reducing class sizes in the early years to fewer than 18 pupils?

Fiona Hyslop:

The Government moved swiftly to set up a teacher employment working group, all of whose recommendations are being enacted. I am pleased that, in South Lanarkshire, the proportion of P1 to P3 pupils who are in classes of 18 or fewer pupils increased from 9.4 per cent to 13.7 per cent last year. I look forward to seeing the figures in future.

It is important to remember that the resources that are being put into the local government settlement would enable councils to employ teachers. In particular, it is unfortunate that Glasgow City Council has reduced the number of teachers and teaching positions by 300 in one year—that represents 300 jobs that could have been available for post-probationers, had the council chosen to use the resources that it was given to employ teachers. [Interruption.]

Order.

Linda Fabiani (Central Scotland) (SNP):

Is the cabinet secretary aware of the concern of elected members of South Lanarkshire Council that restrictions on the future revenue budget are due to the increasing servicing costs of the private finance initiative/public-private partnership schools project?

Fiona Hyslop:

South Lanarkshire Council has indicated that it wants to use the savings that it can make from falling school rolls to fund its ambitious programme of school building. At one point, the biggest PFI school project in Europe was in South Lanarkshire. The continuing revenue costs, which are supported by the Government, continue to put pressure on the council's budget. The Government has had to find up to £60 million a year to fund unfunded PPP commitments from the previous Administration. We have honoured our promise to do that, but doing so puts constraints on other parts of the budget.

Andy Kerr (East Kilbride) (Lab):

Does the cabinet secretary accept that South Lanarkshire Council has renewed all its secondary schools and is in the midst of a programme of renewing all its primary schools? Further, does she accept that it would have been in that position a lot sooner if funding had been made available from this Government? Does she accept that the revenue support that is made available for PPP projects has been reduced by the Scottish Government to less than it was under Labour and that, as a result of that policy, fewer schools will be built?

Fiona Hyslop:

I am sure that the member is familiar with the Scottish Government's budget. I refer him to the pages that show how much revenue support is being provided by this Government for PFI and PPP programmes, many of which were unfunded when we came into office. I also point out that the reason why South Lanarkshire Council can put so much money into the capital funding of primary schools in particular is because this Administration has put £2 billion of capital funding into the local government settlement for 2008 to 2010. The member should welcome that.


Catalan Referenda

To ask the Scottish Executive whether it is sending representatives to observe referenda on the constitutional future of Catalonia that will be carried out in towns across Catalonia on 13 December 2009. (S3O-8486)

The Minister for Culture, External Affairs and the Constitution (Michael Russell):

It is, of course, for the people of Catalonia to decide on their constitutional future. There are currently no plans to send representatives to observe the Catalan referenda, but I am following developments there with interest and I have enthusiasm for that democratic process.

Gil Paterson:

It seems to be a normal part of the process of devolution in Catalonia to seek the views of the public on constitutional matters. Why is it that, according to the unionist parties, Scots should be denied the same opportunity to decide their constitutional fate? I certainly hope that the minister is not deflected from his purpose.

Michael Russell:

I suspect that the significant difference between the situation in Catalonia and Wales, where these issues are current, and the situation in Scotland is that, in Catalonia and Wales, there is a range of political parties that are enlightened and democratic while, in Scotland, there appear to be only two—the Scottish National Party and the Green party.


Dyslexia (Mentoring)

9. Margaret Mitchell (Central Scotland) (Con):

To ask the Scottish Executive what its position is on the setting up of a dyslexia mentoring programme in Scotland similar to the one that operates between the British Dyslexia Association and Sir John Cass business school, City of London, which involves successful businessmen and prominent people with dyslexia working with and encouraging students with dyslexia. (S3O-8460)

The Minister for Children and Early Years (Adam Ingram):

Dyslexia Scotland was involved in the setting up of the United Kingdom dyslexia mentoring programme and is in the process of looking for more mentors to participate in the scheme in Scotland. To date, three people have registered in Scotland to take part as students, as well as one mentor, with other applications currently being processed.

Dyslexia Scotland plans to hold the first mentoring workshop in Scotland early in 2010. The Scottish Government welcomes the work that Dyslexia Scotland is taking forward with the mentoring programme and wishes it every success with its forthcoming workshop.

Margaret Mitchell:

That is encouraging. The minister will be aware that one of the aims of the mentoring programme is to build confidence in people who have dyslexia. What is the Scottish Government doing to increase the support for detecting dyslexia in undiagnosed adults and children?

Adam Ingram:

As the member will be aware from her role on the cross-party group on dyslexia, the Scottish Government has developed a framework for inclusion, which is being introduced in our initial teacher education colleges throughout the country. That will give our new teachers the tools to identify dyslexia in the children whom they teach. We are also developing continuous professional development to ensure that children with dyslexia have their needs met in the classroom.


Third Sector (Monitoring)

10. Tom McCabe (Hamilton South) (Lab):

To ask the Scottish Executive, further to the answer to question S3O-7756 by Shona Robison on 10 September 2009, what third sector organisations are being tracked over the next five years to determine the impact of single outcome agreements and the ending of ring fencing and how those organisations were selected. (S3O-8518)

The organisations to be tracked are being selected by independent researchers. We expect to have the list by the end of December.

Tom McCabe:

Will the Scottish Executive intervene at any point during the research if a third sector organisation is found to be struggling under the challenges that ministers have said that the organisations might face as a result of the concordat relationship?

The organisations to be tracked are being selected by independent researchers. We expect to have the list by the end of December.

Tom McCabe:

Will the minister clarify whether the Scottish Executive will intervene at any point during the research if a third sector organisation is found to be struggling under the challenges that the minister has said they might face as a result of the concordat relationship?

We have regular discussions with all the third sector organisations. Irrespective of the research exercise, we would always be cognisant of and responsive to any concerns by any third sector organisation at any time.

The Presiding Officer:

That concludes general questions. Before we come to the next item of business, I am sure that members will wish to join me in welcoming to the gallery the Speakers of the Parliaments of Penang, Uganda, St Lucia and the Pakistani province of the Punjab. [Applause.]