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Chamber and committees

Plenary,

Meeting date: Wednesday, May 4, 2005


Contents


Question Time


SCOTTISH EXECUTIVE


Justice and Law Officers


Police (Recruitment)

To ask the Scottish Executive what action is being taken to increase the recruitment of police officers. (S2O-6593)

The Minister for Justice (Cathy Jamieson):

We expect to see an increase in police retirement rates towards the end of the decade. That is why we have committed an additional £4.5 million over 2006-08 to enable forces to bring forward recruitment. That will help forces to prepare for the main retirement years, which fall in 2009 and 2010. That extra recruitment will build upon the already record number of police officers that we have in Scotland.

Helen Eadie:

On behalf of my constituents, I warmly welcome the unprecedented amount of new money that is being made available to provide new police officers in Fife. However, recruitment is just one aspect of maintaining a highly skilled police force. I ask the minister whether she will have early talks with Charles Clarke, who I am sure will be returned as Home Secretary next week, following the return of Labour for an historic third term in government. Will she discuss with Charles Clarke the retention of such highly skilled manpower? I ask that since I have the privilege of serving Cardenden, which, as the minister may know, is the birthplace of the world-famous writer Ian Rankin. On the BBC's "Page Turners" last week, Ian Rankin said that he may need to retire the world-famous Inspector Rebus because of the requirement for retiral at 55. He also said that he would be contacting the Scottish Parliament. I ask for the minister's help to help Inspector Rebus.

Cathy Jamieson:

I am tempted just to say, "Yes," but perhaps it would be useful for Inspector Rebus to think about the other options that are available to him, including the 30-plus scheme, which allows police officers to continue working so that we retain their skills. Alternatively, he may come back as a security consultant, someone in charge of antisocial behaviour in a local authority or as a secondee to the Scottish Executive. Who knows?


Motoring Offences (Sentencing Guidelines)

To ask the Scottish Executive whether it will review sentencing guidelines for motoring offences that result in fatalities. (S2O-6588)

The Minister for Justice (Cathy Jamieson):

I am very aware of the public perception that sentences for such offences are too lenient, given their tragic consequences. That is why, in 2003, following a review of prosecution practice, the Lord Advocate announced that motorists whose dangerous driving results in a fatal road traffic accident will normally be prosecuted in the High Court. Moreover, in February this year, the United Kingdom Government issued a consultation paper setting out proposals to create a tougher and more effective framework of offences and penalties to deal with bad or illegal driving. The deadline for responses is 6 May, and we will be keeping in close touch with the UK Government on taking that forward. Currently, no sentencing guidelines are issued in Scotland, but we tasked the Sentencing Commission with reviewing the consistency of sentencing for all offences, including motoring offences.

Scott Barrie:

There are few events that distress and anger the families of victims more than when a loved one is killed by a motorist, particularly if the driver is speeding, is over the permitted alcohol level, is under 17, has previously been banned from driving, or is a combination of all of those. I have recent constituency experience of that, with a child death, and I know that other members have had similar experiences. I impress upon the minister the need to ensure that guilty drivers are dealt with under the full force of the law, that there can never be any excuse for any driver convicted under the aforementioned circumstances and that leniency should never be shown.

Cathy Jamieson:

There are two issues here. First, there is the legislation, which the UK Government is considering. If members have nothing else to do this evening they may want to ensure that they get their responses in before the closing date tomorrow. However, there is also the question of consistency within the available legislation. The Lord Advocate has successfully referred a number of cases to the Appeal Court, which has resulted in sentences being increased.


Offending (Young People)

To ask the Scottish Executive what initiatives are under way with other agencies, local authorities and education departments to reduce the levels of offending among young people. (S2O-6626)

The Minister for Justice (Cathy Jamieson):

The Executive is committed to tackling offending and reoffending among young people through a range of measures covering prevention, intervention, diversion and enforcement. A wide range of focused programmes is available to meet the needs of young people who offend and to support the communities in which they live. We have increased funding from £3.5 million in 2000-01 to £63 million this year; and we have ensured that local authority and other agencies know what is expected of them, and that they have the tools and the capacity to tackle offending and reoffending. Those bodies have a responsibility to ensure that every young person who is involved in persistent offending is involved in an appropriate programme.

What lessons are being learned from the Allander series of lectures that took place last year or from other external sources that could further help the process?

Cathy Jamieson:

I am always concerned to ensure that we consider best practice regardless of where it comes from. We will learn not just from what is happening in Scotland, but from what is happening south of the border and further afield. However, it is important to acknowledge what we are doing at the moment. The Executive has sometimes been accused of looking only at one end of the spectrum. The recent mapping exercise on what is happening in Scotland showed that there are 144 prevention schemes, 111 diversion schemes, 80 intensive provision schemes and 44 schemes involving victims and restorative justice. We have a number of schemes in place, but we are always keen to learn from elsewhere.


Sectarianism

To ask the Scottish Executive what steps it is taking to eradicate sectarianism. (S2O-6590)

The Minister for Justice (Cathy Jamieson):

Bigoted sectarian behaviour and attitudes have been a scar on Scottish life for far too long. Following the historic summit on sectarianism that was held in February, I established a ministerial delivery group to drive that work forward. We have already launched an anti-sectarian education resource and are working with key partners to take forward work in the areas of sport, interfaith and marches and parades.

Bill Butler:

I thank the minister for her answer; I especially welcome the steps that are being taken to highlight to young people the unacceptable nature of sectarian behaviour. Members will be aware of the recently launched wristband campaign to promote that message and of its popularity among young people. What plans does the Executive have to extend that campaign and other initiatives that are aimed at young people throughout Scotland?

Cathy Jamieson:

I am glad that Bill Butler is aware of the wristband campaign; if anyone has not seen the wristbands, I am wearing one, just as the Minister for Tourism, Culture and Sport and the First Minister did last week.

I congratulate Strathclyde police—in particular, Chief Superintendent Kenny Scott, who was the driving force behind the campaign. I was pleased to be at the campaign's launch with footballers from both the old firm clubs. So far, it has been a success. I am looking to assist Strathclyde police with the distribution of more wristbands—25,000 were issued in the first phase—and we are considering what else we can do. It may be a fairly simple idea, but if the 25,000 owners of the wristbands stop for a moment to think about the problems of sectarianism and try to do something about it, it will be worth it.

Christine Grahame (South of Scotland) (SNP):

I refer the minister to the report of the cross-party working group on religious hatred, especially recommendation 11, which states that the co-ordinating group—which comprises the police, the Crown Office, the Scottish Executive, local authorities, voluntary organisations, the Scottish Football Association and the old firm clubs—should

"seek to encourage, sponsor and evaluate project programmes and research designed to change sectarian and other aspects of religious hatred."

I return to a hobby-horse of mine and again ask the minister whether she will consider pursuing an awards scheme that will involve the co-ordinating group presenting awards to project programmes that prove successful.

Cathy Jamieson:

I have had a number of discussions with my colleague the Minister for Tourism, Culture and Sport on how we can develop—not just in relation to football, but across the whole sporting agenda—the opportunities that exist to tackle racism, sectarianism and any other problem issues that involve people being excluded. I have not ruled out taking advantage of future opportunities, but at the moment we have a range of initiatives that we want to progress.

Donald Gorrie (Central Scotland) (LD):

In addition to the welcome efforts that are being made to foster the right attitudes in young people, to which Bill Butler referred, does the minister have proposals for helping to change attitudes among adults, which is far harder? That could include encouraging employers and managers of social clubs and other venues and events to which people go collectively to improve attitudes and to reduce the amount of sectarian banter that goes on, which may be acceptable to some people, but is highly distressing to others.

Cathy Jamieson:

I agree with Donald Gorrie that the problem often lies with adults, from whom children and young people learn their attitudes and values. There is sometimes an issue in getting adults to change their behaviour. That is why I was pleased that at the Scottish Trades Union Congress annual conference we were able to discuss matters such as how we can progress that work in the workplace. The ministerial delivery group will look at how to identify those areas across all the ministerial portfolios where the agenda can be taken forward to ensure that the problem is tackled. We recognise the long-term nature of the agenda; nonetheless, we have to make a start.


Bail

To ask the Scottish Executive whether it will review the basis on which bail is granted for those charged with murder or culpable homicide. (S2O-6549)

The Minister for Justice (Cathy Jamieson):

I am very aware of public concern about bail being granted to those who are accused of serious crimes. In its recent report, the Sentencing Commission recommended various ways of tightening up the basis on which bail and remand decisions are taken. We have already made provision for electronic monitoring as a condition of bail in the case of charges of murder and rape.

Brian Adam:

The minister will be aware that only three people who were charged with murder were granted bail in 1999 whereas 55 such people were granted bail in 2004. Does the minister consider that the repeal of the statutory exclusions to the granting of bail in 2000 for those charged with murder has been a success? If not, will she consider taking further action to increase public protection beyond that which she has described today?

Cathy Jamieson:

I am sure that the member is aware of the provisions of the European convention on human rights. I am therefore unsure whether he is suggesting that his party is in favour of completely repealing those provisions—perhaps he is; if so, we can have the discussion another time. The important point to make is that far too many offences are committed by people on bail. That is not acceptable.

There are, of course, a number of standard and specific conditions that must be put on bail orders. I believe that we should tighten up some of the conditions. I am looking closely at the recommendations in the Sentencing Commission report and I expect to bring forward proposals in the not-too-distant future.

Margaret Mitchell (Central Scotland) (Con):

Is it not the case that the incorporation of the ECHR in Scots law means that there is now a presumption in favour of bail? The proper discretion of the court has been usurped, and that, in turn, has worked to the detriment of both victims and witnesses.

Cathy Jamieson:

It is certainly the case that people have concerns in some instances about those who have been granted bail. That is why I asked the Sentencing Commission to look at a number of the issues as a priority. Some commentators and other people have chosen to portray the measures that we are taking, including electronic monitoring, as a softening of the approach to bail. I want to be clear that electronic monitoring is not an alternative to remand for those who ought to be remanded. Where there are concerns, the Executive is tightening up bail conditions.


Criminal History System (Replacement Project)

To ask the Scottish Executive what project management methodology was used for the project that was designed to replace the criminal history system database. (S2O-6584)

The Scottish police information strategy, which has been developing the replacement criminal history system project, uses the Prince2 methodology, which is the Office of Government Commerce standard for information technology projects.

Mr Maxwell:

I am surprised by the minister's answer. If Prince2 was used, as recommended in the Scottish Office publication "Getting ‘IT' Right", will the minister explain how on earth it could have resulted in a situation in which no resources were planned, no budget was worked out and no time or people were allocated?

Clearly, as the minister identified in a written answer,

"a separate budget was not defined."

The document "Getting ‘IT' Right", which was published in 1999, recommends the Prince2 methodology. It further says:

"It is recommended that each force and central service should have an annual IS/IT business plan, specifying the elements of the IS/IT strategy to be tackled in that particular year, and the resources allocated to each."

The report also states:

"It is crucial therefore that properly costed option appraisals be made available … before a project is given the go-ahead."

Can we please have your question, Mr Maxwell?

I am just starting it. Given that that is part of the Prince2 methodology, why did the minister say in her written answer that no budget had been allocated?

Cathy Jamieson:

I made it clear in my answer that that budget was contained in the overall Scottish police information strategy—SPIS—budget. Obviously, I will continue to look at the issue. That said and for the avoidance of any doubt, I confirm that the current process and system provide accurate information—information that can be used by the Scottish Criminal Record Office.

The project was set up to replace the criminal history system and to get additional functionality. I am extremely concerned at the delays, because of which the Executive is putting additional resources into SPIS to monitor the project. As we go through the process of examining how common police services are procured in future, we will continue to look at the improvements that can be made. I hope that we will have the support of the Scottish National Party. It may well be that we will be looking for better partnerships between the public and private sectors.


Youth Courts

To ask the Scottish Executive what role youth courts can play in reducing youth offending. (S2O-6619)

The Minister for Justice (Cathy Jamieson):

The youth courts apply an innovative approach to dealing with offending by 16 and 17-year-olds. Early evidence suggests that the fast-tracking into court and the rolling up of charges are encouraging those young offenders to take greater responsibility for their actions. I look forward to seeing the full evaluation of the Hamilton youth court soon so that we can consider what general lessons can be learned.

Karen Whitefield:

Does the minister agree that, if youth courts are to be effective, there must be effective joint working between the police, the Procurator Fiscal Service, the social work departments and the courts? Does she further agree that the scepticism that some agencies expressed about the pilot project in Lanarkshire has been replaced by real enthusiasm, particularly from the police, who are witnessing at first hand the effects of the youth court in tackling offending in the communities that they police?

Cathy Jamieson:

At the beginning of the youth court pilot project, some concerns were expressed about whether the project would have the desired outcomes. However, the genuinely multi-agency approach has been critical to the success of the project. All the organisations are working together to ensure that young offenders are brought into the courts quickly. Sheriffs have welcomed that. They have also welcomed having the right information speedily in front of them so that they can dispose of cases properly.

The youth court pilot project is ensuring that young people face up to the charges against them—especially when they have committed a number of offences, because those can now be dealt with all at once.

Miss Annabel Goldie (West of Scotland) (Con):

I might surprise the minister by saying that I think that the pilot project in Hamilton has been encouraging. However, we know that persistent young offenders command a great deal of resource in the children's hearings system. If they really require special attention, would there not be merit in allowing a pilot in the youth court to consider 14 and 15-year-olds who are persistent offenders? That might greatly assist our children's hearings system.

Cathy Jamieson:

Miss Goldie will be aware that, alongside the youth court pilot, we also had fast-track pilots in the children's hearings system for persistent offenders. In the youth court pilot, we made provision for the possibility of including 15-year-olds in some instances.

I want to learn lessons from both the fast-track pilots in the children's hearings system and the youth court pilot. We want to stop persistent offenders in their tracks, turn their lives around, get them into the right programmes and stop them offending.

Question 8 has been withdrawn.


Criminal History System (Replacement Project)

To ask the Scottish Executive how the criminal history system replacement project is being funded. (S2O-6627)

The Scottish police information strategy, which is undertaking the criminal history system replacement project, is funded from the Justice Department's police central Government budget.

Linda Fabiani:

Will the minister tell us whether the funding has come out of the capital or the revenue budget? Will she also clarify something that she said earlier to my colleague Stewart Maxwell? Did I hear her say that she would consider contracting out the IT services?

Cathy Jamieson:

I did not specifically say that I had considered contracting out the IT services. The project has been under way for a considerable time and there have been a number of changes in its governance and management. What I did say, and what I will repeat, is that my priorities are to get the system right and to ensure that we have a replacement project that does the job that it is intended to do.

Clearly, there are lessons to be learned. We have to get the best value for the public purse, so sometimes we will have to be prepared to consider public-private partnerships. I hope that the SNP will support that.


Enterprise, Lifelong Learning <br />and Transport


Retraining

To ask the Scottish Executive what action it is taking to ensure the retraining of workers who become redundant. (S2O-6550)

The Deputy Minister for Enterprise and Lifelong Learning (Allan Wilson):

Programmes such as the training for work programme assist those who are made redundant to acquire new skills.

The Executive's partnership action for continuing employment—PACE for short—helps those who are affected by large-scale redundancies. PACE ensures a rapid and comprehensive response from local agencies, which offer advice, support and guidance on retraining and employment opportunities.

Ms Byrne:

Is the minister aware that, in light of the transitional funding package that is being offered to the Hannah Research Institute, many clerical, cleaning and catering staff will lose their jobs? Will the minister outline what is being done to aid those workers, what retraining will be offered and what safeguards will be put in place to protect all jobs in other institutions that are undergoing restructuring?

Allan Wilson:

We have a commitment to maximising employment and an objective of securing full employment. One of the advantages of the flexible nature of the PACE approach that I outlined is that the support that is offered is tailored to individual needs as well as local circumstances. That support includes full jobcentre services, advice on welfare, access to high-quality training and retraining and one-to-one advice on career development for those who are faced with the unfortunate prospect of redundancy. All those services and others will be provided to any individual who faces that prospect.


Student Loans (Repayment)

To ask the Scottish Executive what proportion of graduates whose student loans are due to be repaid are either in arrears or are deemed to be defaulting. (S2O-6610)

The Deputy First Minister and Minister for Enterprise and Lifelong Learning (Mr Jim Wallace):

The concept of default refers to mortgage-style loans only, as repayments under the income-contingent-style loans are linked directly to a graduate's earnings. Twenty four per cent of Scottish graduates or borrowers who have withdrawn from their course have more than one monthly repayment overdue. That figure is based on the accounts that are still administered by the Student Loans Company, but I will write to Mr McNulty separately with a comprehensive figure including borrowers who are part of the sold debt portfolio, which is privately administered, because we were regrettably unable to get that figure in the time that was available.

Des McNulty:

I appreciate that the responsibility for the administration of the loans lies with the Student Loans Company, but I refer the minister to table 6.03 of the draft budget, which refers to net new lending in student loans. The figures in that table imply a 20 per cent reduction, which, I presume, is contingent on the forecast income from repayments. If there was to be a substantial shortfall in that income, how would that affect the figure for net new lending?

Mr Wallace:

I could have given Mr McNulty a more comprehensive answer with notice, but I do not have the budget before me. I assure him that, although those figures in the budget cannot, by definition, have pinpoint accuracy, they are based on experience and the best estimates that can be made. I also assure him that, if there were a shortfall, it would have to be addressed from other sources.

Question 3 was not lodged.


Scottish Enterprise (Employee Relations)

To ask the Scottish Executive what recent discussions it has had with Scottish Enterprise regarding its relations with its employees. (S2O-6551)

The Deputy First Minister and Minister for Enterprise and Lifelong Learning (Mr Jim Wallace):

The Executive has encouraged both Scottish Enterprise and the trade unions to hold discussions in respect of differences on pay systems. However, the conduct and content of meetings is a matter for Scottish Enterprise as the employer. Scottish Enterprise is keeping the Executive informed of developments.

Dennis Canavan:

Will the minister be more active in trying to find a solution to the dispute between Scottish Enterprise management and Careers Scotland staff? Given that Unison is in favour of a fair pay system that incorporates performance-related elements but management stubbornly refuses to negotiate on that point, will he use his good offices in an effort to get both sides round the negotiating table to reach a fair settlement?

Mr Wallace:

I confirm to Dennis Canavan that Scottish Enterprise is willing to discuss aspects of the performance pay award that has been offered, although it has made it clear that the basic principle of performance pay is not negotiable. I assure him that, on numerous occasions, I have encouraged both sides—Scottish Enterprise and the trade unions—to work together on meaningful negotiations to bring the dispute to an end. I have stressed to them the importance of that and will continue to do so.

Mike Watson (Glasgow Cathcart) (Lab):

I hear what the minister says on that point, but I, like many other members, have been lobbied on the issue, which is of public interest. Although it would normally be wrong for a minister to interfere in negotiations between employers and employees, I understand that the Careers Scotland performance pay scheme discriminates against women because it does not adequately reflect the fact that they tend to take career breaks and therefore often lose out on promotion or other career opportunities. Careers Scotland is refusing to review the scheme to take account of the situation as it affects women. Will he at least make representations to Careers Scotland on that specific point, so that it can be dealt with?

Mr Wallace:

Mike Watson is right that to say that generally ministers would not interfere. The staff in question are not civil servants and it is up to Scottish Enterprise, as the employer, to resolve the dispute. I said in my answer to Dennis Canavan that Scottish Enterprise is willing to discuss aspects of the performance pay award, but the principle of performance pay has been in place at Scottish Enterprise for more than 10 years. I will ensure that the point that Mike Watson raised about women is drawn to the attention of the chief executive of Scottish Enterprise, who I hope to see next week.

Question 5 was not lodged.


Enterprise (Inverclyde)

To ask the Scottish Executive what action it is taking to promote enterprise and business in the Inverclyde area. (S2O-6608)

The Deputy Minister for Enterprise and Lifelong Learning (Allan Wilson):

The Executive's enterprise strategy "A Smart, Successful Scotland" provides strategic direction to the enterprise networks and the framework for direct support available from the Executive. The support to business that is provided, in Inverclyde as elsewhere, is in line with that strategy and contributed to the formation of 205 new businesses in the area in 2004. Our aim is to improve productivity and competitiveness so as to enhance the long-term growth rate of the Scottish economy.

Mr McNeil:

In asking about business in Inverclyde it would be remiss of me not to mention and add my voice to the strong and consistent representation that my colleague Trish Godman has made on behalf of Ferguson Shipbuilders. I hope that ministerial colleagues will ensure that no stone is left unturned to secure the future of the yard. Its closure would have a severe impact on West Renfrewshire and Greenock—many of my constituents work in the yard.

The minister will be aware of the successful pathfinder projects throughout Scotland. Does he agree that the Inverclyde riverside regeneration action plans would benefit from the creation of an urban regeneration company for Inverclyde?

Allan Wilson:

The member raises two important issues in relation to retaining jobs in Inverclyde and building the economy to create employment opportunities. On the first issue, in which I know that you have a personal interest, Presiding Officer—we debated a motion in your name on the subject—I give the commitment that Duncan McNeil seeks that I, along with colleague ministers with responsibility for environment and rural development and transport, will leave no stone unturned in order to secure fairness and equity in the awarding of contracts within European Union procurement rules.

On the second issue, I express support for the point that Duncan McNeil makes. I believe that urban regeneration companies are a suitable vehicle for the regeneration of areas such as Inverclyde and beyond. We are considering the outcome of the pathfinder studies to see whether the lessons that are learned can be rolled out to other areas, such as Inverclyde and other candidates for urban regeneration company status.

What efforts have been made to classify fisheries protection vessels as grey ships, which are not subject to EU procurement regulations? That would greatly help yards such as Ferguson in Port Glasgow to survive.

Allan Wilson:

The reason why the long-term future of shipbuilding on the Clyde is so secure is in large part because of the actions that the Government has taken to procure grey-ship contracts in indigenous yards. I assure Bruce McFee and other colleagues that every effort is being made to consider the conditions that apply to the EU procurement process, including the definition of grey ships, to establish that fairness and equity apply in relation to the awarding of the tenders.

Des McNulty (Clydebank and Milngavie) (Lab):

One of the things that would help Inverclyde and my area is the removal of the tolls on the Erskine bridge. Will the minister link up with his colleague the Minister for Transport to consider the transport strategy for Clydeside and the ways in which transport, as well as the areas for which he himself is responsible, such as enterprise and business support, can contribute to a comprehensive regeneration that would benefit areas such as Duncan McNeil's, as well as mine?

I am being lenient in saying that you can answer that, minister.

Allan Wilson:

I agree fundamentally that investment in transport infrastructure is a key driver of economic growth, and I am sure that the creation of the west of Scotland transport partnership as a strategic transport authority will facilitate that process. I look forward to discussions with the Minister for Transport to ensure that the outcome of those discussions and the strategic decisions that require to be taken in relation to transport and infrastructure investment are in line with the principle of economic growth as the priority. Any impediment to economic growth that relates to transport infrastructure, whether it be tolls and bridges or otherwise, will be part of that consideration.

Question 7 has been withdrawn.


State Aid (Reform)

8. Gordon Jackson (Glasgow Govan) (Lab):

To ask the Scottish Executive what representations it has made to the United Kingdom Government regarding the European Commission's plans to reform state aid and the potential impact on the Executive's ability to provide financial assistance to industry in Scotland. (S2O-6598)

The Deputy First Minister and Minister for Enterprise and Lifelong Learning (Mr Jim Wallace):

We have been closely engaged with the United Kingdom Government to seek to improve on the Commission's proposals for regional aid post-2006 and to ensure that Scottish interests are reflected in the UK responses to the Commission. Full consideration will also be given to the Commission's reform proposals once they are published, including consultation with key stakeholders, and we will continue to work closely with the UK Government to ensure that Scottish interests are fully reflected in the developing UK line. However, until such time as the European Commission's proposals are developed and turned into new frameworks and guidelines, it is too early to assess the impact.

Gordon Jackson:

Is the minister aware of the Commission's proposals for new regional aid guidelines, which, with the reduction in population coverage from 68 per cent to 3 per cent, could have a severe impact on economic development in the many disadvantaged areas of the west of Scotland? Given the fact that those guidelines are due to come into effect in January 2007, is he convinced that the Department of Trade and Industry is fully aware of the potential effects of the proposals and that it will safeguard Scotland's interests?

Mr Wallace:

I acknowledge the point that Gordon Jackson is making. The Commission's initial proposals for regional aid post-2006 would give assisted area coverage only to the Highlands and Islands, which would reduce population coverage from around 48 per cent to around 8 per cent. The Executive is concerned about that loss of coverage.

We support the more general aim of the Commission to deliver less and better targeted state aid in order to focus on the Lisbon agenda, but we are concerned that the proposals prevent aid from being targeted at some of Scotland's most underperforming areas. That is why we will continue to argue for more scope to provide regional aid in more of our underperforming areas that are not covered by the proposals.

I can reassure Gordon Jackson not only that our officials are regularly engaged with the DTI on these issues but that I have had discussions with the Secretary of State for Trade and Industry on the specific matter that he raised.

Phil Gallie (South of Scotland) (Con):

Will the minister accept my congratulations on his and the Executive's standing firm against the European and External Relations Committee's recommendation that would have seen payments to Europe for regional assistance increase massively? Would he further accept that the present Government's current plan to renationalise regional assistance is a wise step?

Mr Wallace:

I think that Phil Gallie is talking about the future of structural funds as opposed to the future of regional aid assistance.

I point out that the Enterprise and Culture Committee recently carried out a fact-finding visit to Brussels as part of its investigation into state aid reform. The report of its visit concluded that the considerable amount of work that had been undertaken by the Scottish Executive to influence the Commission's proposals had had a significant impact in that regard.

Jim Mather (Highlands and Islands) (SNP):

In the context of state aid, can the minister tell me why our major European competitors seem to be able to have the vast majority of their publicly funded ships built in their own shipyards? Can he also tell the chamber whether he believes that there are lessons to be learned from those countries that could help Ferguson Shipbuilders to gain the publicly funded orders that it desperately needs, which would help to grow our economy?

Mr Wallace:

The question that Jim Mather asks about other European Union countries' shipyards is one that I, the Minister for Transport and the Minister for Environment and Rural Development have also been asking. We have been trying to gather information as to why that is the case. I assure Mr Mather that, whenever we hear allegations that unfair advantage has been given to certain shipyards, we take them seriously and make such inquiries as we can.


Transport (Fife)

To ask the Scottish Executive what recent discussions have taken place with Fife Council and the Forth Estuary Transport Authority regarding transport issues in Fife. (S2O-6604)

The Minister for Transport (Nicol Stephen):

The Scottish Executive is in regular contact with Fife Council and the Forth Estuary Transport Authority on a range of transport issues. I met representatives of FETA last Thursday and agreed that the Scottish Executive would underwrite up to £24 million of funding to allow the A8000 dualling project to proceed as quickly as possible.

Christine May:

I welcome the minister's announcement, because the A8000 is a severe bottleneck for Fifers and others.

The minister will be aware that recent proposals for improving transport and access within, to and from Fife include a new multimodal bridge across the Forth, reopening the rail link to Leven and a cross-estuarial ferry. At the weekend, the use was proposed of the ports on the east coast of Scotland, including those in Fife, for freight transport—I wrote to the Minister for Enterprise and Lifelong Learning about that last year. Will the Minister for Transport agree to discuss with me, with other interested members from Fife and with Fife Council ways in which those projects might be funded?

Nicol Stephen:

I would be pleased to do that. It is clear that significant transport issues need to be addressed. I am pleased that Christine May described the long list of transport proposals that are under consideration. The focus is not all on road transport.

I take the opportunity to nail an unfortunate story in the press recently about the condition of the Forth road bridge. It has been suggested that the bridge's life expectancy is severely restricted, but that is not the case. Testing of the cables is still at an early stage and it will be some months before we can begin to make a proper and full assessment of the long-term position. Until the full results of the testing are known and analysed, it will be impossible to estimate the bridge's lifespan, as has been done in the media. Neither FETA nor the Executive can do that.

We emphasise that early testing work shows few problem wires. Of 11,600 wires, 32 were snapped. That is not a lot of damage, in contrast to what was reported in the press today. FETA has assured the Executive and the travelling public that no safety issue affects the bridge at present, and that remains the case today. Irresponsible reporting from whatever source is extremely unfortunate and seriously undermines FETA's message.

Alasdair Morgan (South of Scotland) (SNP):

A new bridge will undoubtedly be required at some stage. When the minister has the final details of the assessment, will he say how much time would be required to take a replacement bridge from initial design to completion while keeping the existing bridge open?

Nicol Stephen:

It is important to examine options. We have encouraged FETA to consider the possibility of a second bridge and it has done that. The project is major and long term. An early indication is that it would take about 10 years to progress such a project. That is why FETA has done initial work. It is proceeding to a further stage of examination and will report to the Executive in due course.

Scott Barrie (Dunfermline West) (Lab):

The minister will be aware that the Forth rail bridge is due to close for repairs for a week in July. That will place added pressure on commuting traffic across the Forth road bridge. What discussions has he had about minimising the already increasing delays for commuters who will have to head to Edinburgh in that period?

Nicol Stephen:

I discuss such issues regularly with Network Rail and ScotRail. Maintenance of the rail bridge has knock-on consequences for other forms of transport. Similarly, when the number of lanes that are in operation on the road bridge is reduced to only two, as in recent months, that has a significant impact on traffic that is trying to enter and leave Edinburgh. It is important to manage those major challenges. I do not underestimate the scale of the challenges that face us for the movement of traffic across the Forth road bridge and of passengers across the Forth rail bridge.

We must do more to free up capacity. The Stirling-Alloa-Kincardine rail project is part of what we are doing and it will make a significant difference, as will the longer trains and the longer platforms, which will significantly improve the capacity for rail travel across the rail bridge. All of those things will address the problem in the short-to-medium term, but we need to consider longer-term solutions and I emphasise that the Executive is encouraging such consideration. It is absolutely wrong to suggest that there are immediate safety concerns or that we know that either of the bridges has a definite and limited lifespan. We are doing work on the road bridge and we will report back to the Parliament on that work as information becomes available.


Community Enterprises

To ask the Scottish Executive what action Scottish Enterprise is taking to help community enterprises to provide recycling services. (S2O-6562)

The Deputy First Minister and Minister for Enterprise and Lifelong Learning (Mr Jim Wallace):

Scottish Enterprise is one of a number of bodies that provide support to community enterprises. Its specific role is to identify social economy organisations with growth potential and offer them appropriate business support services that will enable them to realise that potential. It has actively supported a number of community enterprises that provide recycling services through its network of local enterprise companies.

Donald Gorrie:

That is encouraging. The recycling world offers particularly good opportunities for the voluntary or community sector as a result of the mixture of paid and voluntary people involved. Will the minister encourage Scottish Enterprise to support enterprises that need encouragement and help to start up? Will he encourage councils to ensure a fair contest so that local community groups can successfully compete for the recycling services for which councils are looking?

Mr Wallace:

I certainly hope that local community groups get fair opportunities to bid for work that is to be done on recycling and to progress our waste strategy. I confirm to Donald Gorrie that I am certainly willing to encourage Scottish Enterprise and Highlands and Islands Enterprise to provide support, but doing so would be pushing at an open door in many respects. There are many examples of practical support that is already being given to community enterprises to provide recycling services and I would be happy to give Donald Gorrie a note of those examples if he wishes.