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Chamber and committees

European Committee, 09 Nov 1999

Meeting date: Tuesday, November 9, 1999


Contents


European Documents

The Convener:

The first item on the agenda is scrutiny of European documents. I should remind the committee that our test is whether the document contains provision for legislation and whether that legislation has significant impact on Scotland. Any other matters are secondary. We need to be selective in what we examine.

At our next meeting, we will have the services of Christine Boch, an EC legal affairs specialist who has recently joined the Parliament's legal office and who will assist us in technical and legal matters from here on in.

The recommendation on document 295 (EC Ref No 10499/99, COM(99)372 final) is for no further action. That is agreed.

The recommendation on document 317 (EC Ref No 10541/99, COM(99)352 final 99/0152 (COD)) is that the document should be referred to the Justice and Home Affairs Committee. That is agreed.

The recommendation for document 337 (EC Ref No 10672/99) is for no further action.

Bruce Crawford (Mid Scotland and Fife) (SNP):

Convener, although I agree with the recommendation, I think that some more information might be useful. This is the annual report on the European Investment Fund. The second sentence of the second paragraph of the Treasury explanatory memorandum on document 337 says that since 1996, the fund

"has also provided equity support for SMEs through participation in venture capital funds."

How much of that support is finding its way into Scotland? Do small to medium enterprises in Scotland know about the fund? Is anything being done to broadcast the information? I am not sure that this is an issue for this committee.

The Convener:

I think that you have a fair point. I am not sure whether we should draw it to the attention of the Enterprise and Lifelong Learning Committee or of Scottish Enterprise, which could circulate the information through its network. I am sure that that organisation is already aware of the information.

Dr Winnie Ewing (Highlands and Islands) (SNP):

I think that I have raised this point already. A scheme existed for a while, but it did not apply to Scotland because none of the Scottish banks were willing to do the work. After the fuss that many people made, the Scottish banks, one by one, entered the scheme. It was not a direct grant. Under it, loans are agreed on much more favourable terms than would be the case if they were undertaken by banks under normal risk rules. The banks were covered by the European Investment Bank if they lent under the scheme.

My understanding is that, for some reason, the Scottish banks stopped doing that. We should ask the EIB if the scheme is still being operated in Scotland.

The Convener:

That is not the issue that is before us. We are considering a specific item on the Commission report. If there is a wider issue, we should refer it to the Enterprise and Lifelong Learning Committee, to ensure that small and medium enterprises in Scotland get the benefit of the available funding.

Presumably the investment fund report would show that.

We can refer that to the Enterprise and Lifelong Learning Committee for its interest.

Ben Wallace (North-East Scotland) (Con):

On a point of order. Many colleagues and people from the European Parliament look at the Official Report of our meetings. I have received some representations from MEPs—of other parties as well—who point out that we use only Scottish Parliament reference numbers. If we could put the Commission document number in the Official Report, they would know what we are talking about.

That point has already been raised. We have addressed it.

Stephen Imrie (Committee Clerk):

I can advise you, Ben, that the minutes and the Official Report of our previous meeting now incorporate the EC and COM numbers. We are not doing that for this meeting, otherwise the convener would have to read out a lot of numbers, but we ensure that they are inserted after the meeting so that MEPs and other observers are aware of what documents we are talking about.

For document 340 (EC Ref No 10704/99, SEC(99)66 final), we are advised to take no further action. That is agreed.

It also says that we are awaiting "a short briefing note".

The Convener:

For document 341 (EC Ref No 10705/99, COM(99)367 final), we are advised to take no further action. That is agreed.

For document 346 (EC Ref No 10736/99, COM(99)388 final), we are advised to await the Scottish cover note. That is agreed.

For document 349 (EC Ref No 10251/99, SEC(99)1213 final), we are advised to await an explanatory memorandum. That is agreed.

For document 350 (EC Ref No 10742/99, COM(99)348 final), we are advised to await an explanatory memorandum. That is agreed.

For document 374 (EC Ref No 10302/99), we are advised to take no further action. That is agreed.

For document 375 (EC Ref No 10773/99), we are advised to take no further action. That is agreed.

For document 376 (EC Ref No 11024/99, COM(99)368 final), we are advised to request the Scottish cover note.

Are the provisions for the control of blue tongue or blue nose, convener? Can I have clarification on that? I was worried.

It is blue tongue, Margo. We have enough problems without introducing other parts of the anatomy.

Has there been an outbreak of blue nose?

The recommendation for document 376 is agreed.

For document 377 (EC Ref No 11025/99, COM(99)437 final), we are advised to request the Scottish cover note.

Tavish Scott (Shetland) (LD):

I want to ask a question about the timing of the regulation, which is a limited but important reform. We should know whether our recommendation for action will delay the implementation of the regulation. It was requested by the salmon farming industry. Document 377 already dates back to July, so there is considerable need to push on with it. I hope that that will happen.

We could possibly take that at our next meeting, and get representatives of the Rural Affairs Committee to attend.

I would be grateful.

Bruce Crawford:

In one paragraph, the paper involved mentions the need for the introduction of vaccine in salmon fishing. I do not know whether the vaccine contains antibiotics, but we have all heard about the difficulties of introducing antibiotics to livestock and the impact of that on the food chain and on humans. It would perhaps be worth putting this matter to the Health and Community Care Committee, so that it can examine the issue of vaccines and their impact on the food chain.

The issue would be one of timing. If we need to have an early view, someone from health should be invited to the next meeting. I do not know whether it will be possible for there to be longer consideration elsewhere after the relevant date.

Tavish Scott:

This issue has been discussed with the industry over the past six months or so. The issues that Bruce Crawford raised are in the public domain. Infectious salmon anaemia is a viral infection, and there is no concern whatever about it in a human context. I hope that this is a technical measure that can be taken forward at speed. There are no wider implications.

We can ask the Scottish Executive to comment on that in its cover note.

Ms MacDonald:

I appreciate that this is a technical measure, and I do not want to take up the time of the committee when we have guests coming later. Do we have time to work out whether this committee has any role to play in ensuring that the correct information about what is happening to our fishing industry permeates throughout Europe? It could be argued that that would be one lesson we might learn from the whole beef business. I do not want to open up discussions, but want to put on record that I would like to talk about that at some point.

We have links into different European structures and committees and so on. It might be wise to consider how we might use them.

I cannot answer that off the top of my head. I will ask the committee clerk to note that and I will respond once I have thought about it.

Dr Sylvia Jackson (Stirling) (Lab):

I want to support Margo MacDonald. I am sure that as we go through these documents, we will come across items on which we need to be proactive. We maybe need some time to reflect on matters such as the venture issue that you mentioned earlier.

The Convener:

The recommendation for document 377 (EC Ref No 11025/99, COM(99)437 final) is agreed. It is suggested that someone from rural affairs be invited to the next meeting and that the Scottish Executive be asked to address Bruce Crawford's specific question in its cover note.

For document 378 (EC Ref No 11029/99, COM(99) 439 final), we are advised to take no further action. That is agreed.

For document 379 (EC Ref No 11065/99, COM(99) 431 final), we are advised to take no further action. That is agreed.

For document 380 (EC Ref No 11066/99, COM(99) 415 final), we are advised to take no further action. That is agreed.

For document 381 (EC Ref No 11067/99, COM(99) 416 final), we are advised to take no further action. That is agreed.

For document 382 (EC Ref No 11068/99, COM(99) 417 final), we are advised to take no further action. That is agreed.

For document 383 (EC Ref No 11069/99, COM(99) 418 final), we are advised to take no further action. That is agreed.

For document 384 (EC Ref No 11070/99, COM(99) 419 final), we are advised to take no further action. That is agreed.

For document 385 (EC Ref No 11071/99, COM(99) 420 final), we are advised to take no further action. That is agreed.

For document 386 (EC Ref No 11072/99, COM(99) 421 final), we are advised to take no further action. That is agreed.

For document 387 (EC Ref No 11073/99, COM(99) 422 final), we are advised to take no further action. That is agreed.

For document 388 (EC Ref No 11074/99, COM(99) 423 final), we are advised to take no further action. That is agreed.

For document 389 (EC Ref No 11075/99, COM(99) 424 final), we are advised to take no further action. That is agreed.

For document 390 (EC Ref No 11103/99, COM(99) 449 final), we are advised to take no further action. That is agreed.

For document 391 (EC Ref No 11145/99, COM(99) 410 final), we are advised to take no further action, but to send a copy to the Transport and the Environment Committee for its interest. That is agreed.

For document 392, we are advised to take no further action, but to send a copy to the Justice and Home Affairs Committee for its interest. That is agreed.

For document 393 (EC Ref No 9928/99), we are advised to await the explanatory memorandum. That is agreed.

For document 394 (EC Ref No 10897/99), we are advised to take no further action. That is agreed.

For document 395 (EC Ref No 10992/99, COM(99) 441 final), we are advised to take no further action, but to send a copy to the Enterprise and Lifelong Learning Committee. That is agreed.

For document 396 (EC Ref No 10993/99, SEC(99) 1386 final), we are advised to take no further action, but to send a copy to the Enterprise and Lifelong Learning Committee. That is agreed.

We need to make a decision on document 397 (EC Ref No 10995/99, COM(99) 440 final).

Stephen Imrie:

Advice on the document has been left as,

"To be decided on 9th November"

because since the sift meeting we have been trying to find out whether a decision on which experts will sit on the employment committee will be taken at the Council meeting on 12 November. It was suggested that members of this committee might want to make recommendations on who the UK members of the employment committee should be. I am advised that nominations will not be discussed at the meeting on 12 November.

Is there a time scale?

Stephen Imrie:

The time scale for nominations is likely to be between now and Christmas.

The Convener:

We will make a note of that for the moment. There is nothing more that we can do unless we have a specific recommendation to make.

For document 398 (11020/99, COM(99)444 final), we are advised to take no further action. That is agreed.

For document 399 (11146/99, COM(99)448 final), we are advised to take no further action. That is agreed.

For document 400 (11204/99, COM(99)443 final 99/0194 (COD)), we are advised to take no further action. That is agreed.

For document 401 (10909/99), we are advised to take no further action. That is agreed.

For document 402 (10925/99), we are advised to take no further action. That is agreed.

For document 403 (10926/99), we are advised to take no further action. That is agreed.

For document 404 (10927/99), we are advised to take no further action. That is agreed.

For document 405 (10994/99, COM(99)445 final), we are advised to take no further action, but we will send a copy to the Enterprise and Lifelong Learning Committee. That is agreed.

For document 406 (11022/99), we are advised to take no further action.

I have a question on the banana disputes and their impact on the textile industry. Should not we ensure that the impact does not continue elsewhere and ask the Enterprise and Lifelong Learning Committee to have another look at the matter?

If we think that there could be consequences, we can do that. I do not know whether that is the case.

I do not know either.

We can send the document to the Enterprise and Lifelong Learning Committee for its information and ask the Scottish Executive to provide further detail to that committee for it to consider.

Dr Ewing:

I do not agree with the position that has been adopted with regard to the World Trade Organisation. The Lomé convention, which gave privileged access for the third world countries' bananas, applies to only 8 per cent of the total amount of bananas consumed in Europe. The rest come from the multinationals that prop up the two parties in the United States. The Lomé convention predates the WTO. It does not seem right that an internationally agreed global trading arrangement should be criticised and attacked by a subsequent international body—WTO. It was the WTO's interference in our arrangements on bananas that caused the United States to retaliate—quite unjustifiably, in my opinion—against cashmere and biscuits from Scotland and various other things in other parts of Europe, for example French handbags and perfume. If the situation arises again and the WTO hits back, will it happen all over again? That is my concern, because I believe that what happened was illegal

The Convener:

That is not the matter that is before us. That is a totally extraneous issue. We are being asked to comment on a specific report. While you may, Dr Ewing, have genuine concerns about the wider issues, the question today is whether to take further action on the specific report. If you want to propose that we take different action on the report, by all means do so.

Dr Ewing:

I propose that we find out whether I am right or wrong by asking an expert about the WTO's position, so that what happened cannot happen again. There is a settlement—possibly—but we do not know for how long it will last. We have no details about that.

Bruce Crawford:

It would be useful to get from the Scottish Executive something that explains the wider ramifications of the dispute, in case there are areas of the Scottish economy, as Winnie mentioned, that need to be considered. Having an explanatory note and the paper will raise our awareness of the issue and enable us to discuss it.

The Convener:

The issue that you and Winnie are addressing, Bruce, is of more concern to the Enterprise and Lifelong Learning Committee than to the European Committee. If members of that committee want to pursue the matter, that is up to them. We can refer the matter to them for their consideration.

We can ask the Executive to provide more detailed information and to address the specific question that has been raised, but we have already suggested that the document should be referred—with that Executive information—to the Enterprise and Lifelong Learning Committee. If there is any concern about the impact on the Scottish economy, that committee should consider the matter.

I would like to see a copy of the memorandum, so that we can at least be broadly aware of what is going on.

We can circulate that as well. Do members agree that we should send the document to the Enterprise and Lifelong Learning Committee for information, with the further caveats that have been discussed?

Ms MacDonald:

We should not just send the document to the Enterprise and Lifelong Learning Committee, but draw its attention to the fact that a previous WTO ruling had a direct relevance for Scottish industry. Our concern is that the WTO should not be able to pick us off in that way under any new arrangements.

The Convener:

I do not agree. In this document, we have been asked to do something very specific. If we did as you suggest, we would be led into a wider debate that involves subjective opinions. That debate is not relevant today; if we want to have that debate here, it would be a separate matter. We have been asked whether we want to process the document further or to take no further action. What Margo is saying differs from the recommendation.

Cathy Jamieson (Carrick, Cumnock and Doon Valley) (Lab):

Much as I, too, might have reservations in relation to the WTO, I do not think that this committee ought to deal with that issue. I am sure that there will be other opportunities in the Parliament for people to make comments on the matter.

We have a recommendation that this document should go to the Enterprise and Lifelong Learning Committee so that it can comment on the economic situation. That is the correct course of action, notwithstanding the issues that should be debated elsewhere.

Allan Wilson:

I support that. The document should be referred to the Enterprise and Lifelong Learning Committee, with the proviso that the attached advice—that the UK Parliament supports, and the Scottish Parliament should support, a Commission proposition for a quota-based solution to the problem—is correct. The dispute had a damaging impact on a number of industries and companies, some within my constituency, and it is appropriate that the matter be looked at in that context by the Enterprise and Lifelong Learning Committee to ensure that no further damage arises from the proposed quota-based solution.

The Convener:

We recommend, therefore, that the document be referred to the Enterprise and Lifelong Learning Committee and that we ask for further information from the Scottish Executive to assist that committee with its deliberations. In addition, Bruce has asked that the memorandum be circulated to members of this committee. Is that agreed?

Members indicated agreement.

The Convener:

For document 407 (EC Ref No 11060/99, COM(99)384 final 99/0162 (CNS)), we are advised to take no further action. That is agreed.

For document 408 (EC Ref No 11144/99, COM(99)337 final COD 99/0152), we are advised to take no further action. That is agreed.

For document 409 (EC Ref No 11155/99, COM(99)450 final), we are advised to take no further action. That is agreed.

For document 410 (EC Ref No 11260/99, COM(99)432 final), we are advised to take no further action. That is agreed.

For document 411 (EC Ref No 11084/99, COPEN 37), we are advised to consider the matter at the next meeting. That is agreed.

For document 412 (EC Ref No 11570/99, COPEN 42), we are advised to consider the matter at the next meeting. That is agreed.

For document 413 (EC Ref No 11571/99, COPEN 43), we are advised to consider the matter at the next meeting. That is agreed.

For document 414 (EC Ref No 11603/99, COPEN 44), we are advised to consider the matter at the next meeting. That is agreed.

For document 437 (EC Ref No 12010/99, COPEN 47 COMIX 344), we are advised to consider the matter at the next meeting. That is agreed.

For document 415, we are advised to take no further action, but copy to the Justice and Home Affairs Committee. That is agreed.

For document 416 (EC Ref No 11203/99, SEC(99)1470), we are advised to take no further action. That is agreed.

For document 417 (EC Ref No 11492/99, COM(99)425 final), we are advised to await the explanatory memorandum and make the Enterprise and Lifelong Learning Committee aware of the issue. That is agreed.

For document 418 (EC Ref No 11523/99), we are advised to take no further action. That is agreed.

For document 419 (EC Ref No 11217/99, COM(99)438 final), we are advised to take no further action. That is agreed.

For document 420 (EC Ref No 10608/99, PESC 257 COWEB 101), we are advised to take no further action. That is agreed.

For document 421 (EC Ref No 11552/99, SEC(99)1555), we are advised to take no further action but to copy the document to the Enterprise and Lifelong Learning Committee. That is agreed.

For document 422 (EC Ref No 11156/99, SEC(99)1302 final), we are advised to await the explanatory memorandum. That is agreed.

For document 423 (EC Ref No 11326/99, PESC 305 COWEB 118), we are advised to take no further action. That is agreed.

For document 424 (EC Ref No 11780/99, DROIPEN 14) we are advised to take no further action. That is agreed.

For document 425 (EC Ref No SEC(99)) we are advised to take no further action. That is agreed.

For document 426 (EC Ref No11583/99, COM(99)454 final) we are advised to take no further action. That is agreed.

For document 427 (EC Ref No 11707/99, COM(99)457 final) we are advised to take no further action but to copy the document to the Enterprise and Lifelong Learning Committee. That is agreed.

For document 428 (EC Ref No 3710-07r6 Draft 3) we are advised to take no further action. That is agreed.

For document 429 (EC Ref No 11545/99, COM(99)459 final) we are advised to take no further action. That is agreed.

For document 430 (EC Ref No 11696/99, COM(99)459 final) we are advised to take no further action. That is agreed.

For document 431 (EC Ref No 11708/99, COM(99)453 final) we are advised to take no further action, but to copy the document to the Enterprise and Lifelong Learning Committee. That is agreed.

For document 432 (EC Ref No 11756/99, COM(99)461 final) we are advised to take no further action. That is agreed.

For document 433 (EC Ref No 11762/99, COM(99) 462 final) we are advised to take no further action. That is agreed.

For document 434 (EC Ref No 11788/99, COM(99)464 final) we are advised to take no further action, but to copy the document to the Enterprise and Lifelong Learning Committee. That is agreed.

For document 435 (EC Ref No 10767/99, COM(99)371 final) we are advised to take no further action but to copy the document to the Education, Culture and Sport Committee. That is agreed.

For document 436 (EC Ref No 11910/99, COM(99)466 final) we are advised to take no further action. That is agreed.

For document 438 (EC Ref No 11690/99, PESC 350 COWEB 130) we are advised to take no further action. That is agreed.

For document 439 (EC Ref No 11760/99, COM(99)469 final) we are advised to take no further action. That is agreed.

For document 440 (EC Ref No 11766/99, COM(99)473 final) we are advised to await the explanatory memorandum and to consider the document at the next meeting. That is agreed.

For document 441 (EC Ref No 11767/99 COM(99)472 final) we are advised to await the explanatory memorandum and to consider the document at the next meeting. That is agreed.

For document 442 (EC Ref No 11889/99, COM(99)470 final) we are advised to take no further action. That is agreed.

For document 443 (EC Ref No 11909/99, COM(99)455 final) we are advised to take no further action. That is agreed.

For document 444 (EC Ref No 11911/99, COM(99)460 final) we are advised to take no further action. That is agreed.

For document 445 (EC Ref No 11919/99, COM(99)474 final) we are advised to take no further action, but to copy the document to the Enterprise and Lifelong Learning Committee. That is agreed.

For document 446 (EC Ref No 10522/99, COM(99)406 final) we are advised to take no further action. That is agreed.

For document 447 (EC Ref No 10525/99, COM(99)429 final) we are advised to consider the matter at the next meeting. That is agreed.

The paper has been submitted by the Department of Trade and Industry. When the clerk gets the notes back, could we have the Scottish Executive's view on this paper as well?

Is that agreed by the committee?

Members indicated agreement.

Dr Ewing:

If the papers that we receive do not tell us the answers to our questions, what will be the state of play regarding anti-dumping action against Norway? Will we be told in the documents? This battle has been going on for about 20 years—it comes and it goes. Action is started and then it is withdrawn and settlements are promised. Perhaps when we get bits of paper, that question might be answered on them.

The Convener:

For document 448 (EC Ref No 10733/99, COM(99)433 final) we are advised to take no further action. That is agreed.

For document 449 (EC Ref No 10737/99, COM(99)436 final) we are advised to take no further action. That is agreed.

The clerk will report back to us regarding documents 334 (EC Ref No 10609/99, COM(99)396 final) and 345 (EC Ref No 10486/99, COM(99)387 final) so that we have a summary view to send to the Executive and to Westminster.

Stephen Imrie:

I would like to advise the committee regarding document 334, which deals with liability for defective products. We have taken a decision to refer this to the Enterprise and Lifelong Learning Committee for its views. I have received a summary of its views in the form of an e-mail from the committee clerk.

That committee wants to bring to this committee's attention an issue about the document in relation to Scots law. They want to know whether future proposals on legislation that deals with liability for defective products will be consistent with Scots law.

It is for this committee to decide what it wants to do. The normal course of action is to compile the views of another committee with the views of this committee into a letter or report from the convener of this committee. That report would be given to the Scottish Executive and to the House of Commons European Scrutiny Committee.

The Convener:

An issue has been raised by the Enterprise and Lifelong Learning Committee about Scots law and that committee would like us to incorporate its comments in our submission. Does the committee agree that that should be the case and that we should forward the comments to the Executive and to Westminster?

Members indicated agreement.

Stephen Imrie:

On a similar procedural matter, document SP 345, which deals with boneless dried meat of bovine animals, was referred to the Rural Affairs Committee, which has met and considered it. The committee noted the document and decided that there were no matters of substance on which it wanted to report back to us.

Bruce Crawford:

I was rather surprised when the document came back to us. I realise that there are no specialists here involved in gristling, but the raw materials are coming from Argentina, rather than from the EU. I do not know or understand what has been happening in the background, or whether there has been some sort of quid pro quo with Switzerland to permit this enhancement of its position. I am simply raising the issue. I do not know what to do about it, but I am concerned that Switzerland is getting special dispensation for a raw product—beef—that is being imported from Argentina, rather than from an EU country. Why is that happening? It beats me, and we may need to ask about it. I am not sure that it will stop us doing what we are doing, but I would like an answer to my question—although I realise that it is rather obscure.

I suggest that we note the recommendation of no comment either to the Scottish Executive or to Westminster, but ask Stephen Imrie to try to get an answer from Brussels to Bruce's question.

This may not be a matter for us, but the Rural Affairs Committee should be aware of what is intended here.

What will be the format of any report that we might submit?

Stephen Imrie:

Reports will normally take the form of an extended letter to the convener of the Westminster committee, which will be sent to Westminster and the Scottish Executive and circulated to all members. They will contain some standard text, outlining which document is being considered and when, followed by some paragraphs compiled by the clerks and signed by the convener. When we have something more substantial to report, we will have to consider what is the appropriate format for that. It might not be a letter.

What will happen to the letter? Will it be tabled at a meeting of the Westminster committee? How will it subsequently be reported?

Stephen Imrie:

As I understand it, after I have sent the letter to the clerk of the Westminster committee, they bring it to the attention of the chair. I do not know whether they formally table the document or whether they circulate it to all members of the Westminster committee. At the moment, I believe, it is brought to the attention only of the chair. However, I can find out more details about exactly what happens.

David Mundell:

This is important, because if we provide submissions we need to know that they are being taken fully into account. It is not enough for it to be noted that there has been a letter from the Scottish Parliament. The content of our submission must be fully understood by everyone involved in the process.

Stephen Imrie:

I will find out more about how the submission is received.