Plenary, 04 Oct 2001

Meeting date: Thursday, October 4, 2001

Official Report 575KB pdf

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First Minister's Question Time

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SCOTTISH EXECUTIVE

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Cabinet (Meetings)

To ask the First Minister what issues will be discussed at the next meeting of the Scottish Executive's Cabinet. (S1F-01275)

The next Cabinet meeting is planned for 8 October, when the Cabinet will discuss issues of importance to the people of Scotland.

Two weeks ago, I visited a mosque in Dundee and heard the priest there condemn the atrocities in the United States. Yesterday, I sat in the Parliament and heard the high priest of the World Islamic Mission in Glasgow condemn the atrocities as attacks

"on integrity, on civilisation and on humankind."—[Official Report, 3 October 2001; c 3021.]

In the light of those remarks, does the First Minister agree that Margaret Thatcher's remarks, reported today, and her attack on the Islamic community in Scotland and in the rest of the United Kingdom are offensive and beneath contempt? [Applause.]

I think that the whole chamber shares the sentiments that John Swinney expressed. [Members: "No."] I would have had some misgivings if no one disagreed with the points that were made. I endorse John Swinney's comments. If there is a time for sensitivity in dealing with this important issue, it is now. It would be easy for me to condemn Margaret Thatcher further, but suffice it to say that she should start to take retirement seriously.

I appreciate the First Minister's remarks. He will be aware, as we all are, of the attack on a Muslim place of worship in Edinburgh and of the desecration of Muslim gravestones in the west of Scotland. We are witnessing attacks based on religion that revive rather sad aspects of our national history of religious conflict. Will the First Minister consider strengthening the Crime and Disorder Act 1998 to create an offence on religious grounds to equate with racially aggravated harassment?

I will be positive again in replying to John Swinney's questions. I paid a private visit to the mosque in Edinburgh yesterday afternoon when I returned from Brighton. The attack was appalling. The consequences could have been much more serious but, mercifully, they were not. It was appalling that the attack was on an area that was used for prayer and by children in the mosque. The floor on which children prayed had melted. The stench of burnt plastic filled the air. Sacred pictures and prayer mats were all damaged. As John Swinney rightly says, an incident also occurred in Lanarkshire.

Those attacks are disgraceful. The whole Parliament agrees about that. There can be no haven for hatred. That is why I am pleased to say that we stand shoulder to shoulder with the Westminster Government in taking action to change legislation to accommodate religious crimes. In our opinion, those crimes should be treated as severely as race crimes. They are hate crimes and are committed by bigots, extremists and those who have no place in a modern Scotland.

I have consulted the Deputy First Minister and can tell the chamber that we are working to ensure that religion-motivated crime is covered by legislation. We will do that at the earliest opportunity, in a way that is consistent with that of our colleagues at Westminster. We embrace the spirit of John Swinney's comments, which I hope the whole Parliament shares.

I warmly welcome the First Minister's remarks and recognise them as a development of the Executive's position yesterday. In the light of those remarks, does the First Minister accept that, whatever legislation on the subject emanates from the parliamentary process, it must be rigorously enforced in all parts of Scotland, to guarantee that a clear message is received that the country is intolerant of racial and religious intolerance?

I am happy to confirm that. Yesterday, when I met Muhammed Aslam, chairman of the Edinburgh and East of Scotland Pakistan Association, I told him that Scotland was united against racism and bigotry.

It is one thing to legislate; it is another to ensure that enforcement is as good as it can be. I hope that the full force of the law will pursue the zealots, racists and bigots whenever a breach of the proposed legislation takes place. Before that happens, I expect the police who are investigating the Lanarkshire and Edinburgh incidents to ensure that the full force of the law is pursued.

We all welcome the constructive comments that John Swinney has made. In the 21st century, the Scottish Parliament is sending a powerful message that this kind of behaviour will not be tolerated. If that message goes out to every part of Scotland, it will help in the enforcement of the new legislation, when it is enacted.

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Secretary of State for Scotland (Meetings)

To ask the First Minister when he will next meet the Secretary of State for Scotland and what issues he plans to raise with him. (S1F-01277)

I last met the Secretary of State for Scotland on 3 October and we have no immediate plans to meet.

I beg the pardon of the First Minister for confusing the sex of the Secretary of State for Scotland in my question.

In the light of the economic downturn, which has been aggravated by the terrorist attacks in the United States, I hope that the First Minister gets round to discussing with Mrs Liddell the current state of the Scottish economy. Does he agree that, at this time, we should be doing everything to boost consumer confidence and to encourage business investment in Scotland? Will he and his Executive consider reducing the burden on all Scottish businesses by cutting business rates, which, thanks to his friend Mr McConnell, are higher in Scotland than in England?

The question was going well until the last point. Business rates are a matter that the Executive always has under review. As David McLetchie rightly says, business rates are an issue. However, at the present time, bigger issues face the Scottish economy.

In the past few weeks, I have continually said that what we are talking about is solidarity with the international community and the safety and security of our citizens. We must also seek stability for the economy. I share David McLetchie's concerns that we need to turn now to the sectors of the Scottish economy that may be affected by the global downturn and by the events of 11 September. Given those circumstances, we are trying to understand and anticipate what is happening to the Scottish economy and to those major sectors.

Tomorrow, at a business breakfast, we will publish the report that I talked about last week. I would like to put it on record that the leaders of the Conservative party and the Scottish National Party are welcome to attend that meeting. They are invited, along with the convener and deputy convener of the Enterprise and Lifelong Learning Committee.

There is no room for complacency. We face tough and testing times. The report to be published tomorrow—"The Impact of Terrorist Attacks on the Scottish Economy"—has been produced by the chief economic adviser to the Executive. It provides a full analysis of what has been happening to business sectors, including the aviation industry. I hope that this is a matter that unites the Parliament and the country, so that we can tackle the issues that lie ahead.

I thank the First Minister for his answer. I hope that he will seriously consider the rates burden in Scotland. I look forward to learning the details at tomorrow's presentation, to which he has kindly invited Mr Swinney and me.

I want to move on to an issue that is related to job creation. The First Minister may have seen this week's report of the Parliament's European Committee, which calls for the immediate implementation of a European Union directive on worker consultation. The committee's position is contrary to that which has been adopted by the Prime Minister and the United Kingdom Government. Although we accept the need for good management practices, does the First Minister agree that now is not the time to introduce yet more regulations and red tape for our businesses? To do so would save not one job in Scotland, but it would undermine the competitiveness of our businesses.

This week, the Prime Minister said that he wanted a combination of factors to be in place in the United Kingdom and hence in Scotland. He said that he wanted the enterprise of the United States to be linked to the social solidarity that we see in Europe. Surely to goodness in the 21st century, good employment conditions, good consultation, good wages and good prospects are entirely consistent with a prosperous, growing nation.

I would like David McLetchie to think deeply about the constant carping on the subject of employee regulations. We live in a time when employment is high and unemployment is low. We have growth in the Scottish economy and interest rates are at historic low levels. Surely to goodness it is important that everyone share in the wealth and prosperity of the nation. I take the point seriously. Of course we do not want to burden industry, but burdens are often opportunities, which is why Europe is moving forward.

The Prime Minister also said this week that there is no point in our being at the heart of Europe if we do not want to subscribe to the aspirations of the EU. I support those aspirations; obviously, the Conservative party still has a major problem.

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Identity Cards

To ask the First Minister whether the policy on the introduction of voluntary or compulsory identity cards will be the same in Scotland as in England and Wales and what discussions the Scottish Executive has had with Her Majesty's Government on this matter. (S1F-01276)

National security is reserved to the United Kingdom Government, which has indicated that it has no immediate plans to introduce an identity card scheme as part of its response to the atrocities in the United States. The Executive is being kept informed by the UK Government of its thinking in that area and will be fully consulted if it decides to proceed.

Does the First Minister accept that, if the British Government makes any attempt to bring the issue back on to the British agenda, he should, as First Minister, be fully consulted? Alternatively, does he support the apparent view of the Deputy First Minister that the issue could be dealt with as a devolved matter?

I have outlined the current position in terms of national security. It is important to recognise that, although there has been a flurry of activity in the media and elsewhere about ID cards, the issue is not part of the current focus in relation to the atrocities in the United States. We can reassure Lord James this afternoon that, if there is any movement on the issue, there will be full consultation, involvement and participation in any possible outcome. The key at the moment is for us to settle down and deal with the main issues arising from the terrorist attacks; the ID debate may come at a later stage.

The Scottish Parliament might not approve of a proposal or policy on the matter, so why on earth is Lord James so anxious that we should slavishly follow what the House of Commons says on it? People seem to keep forgetting that we have our own system of law here.

It is important to recognise that the Deputy First Minister was talking in the context of national security and social security, which are clearly reserved matters. It is true that the operation of such a scheme on a UK basis would involve intimate discussions in the Parliament and the Executive. That is what we hold out for everyone involved in this.

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Drug Misuse (Funding)

To ask the First Minister what impact the recently announced £5 million funding for social inclusion partnerships will have on the campaign against drug misuse. (S1F-01286)

The additional £5 million is aimed at widening and deepening the actions on drug misuse that are already being taken in social inclusion partnership areas. The funds will allow social inclusion partnerships to target the areas where there are gaps in our broader efforts to tackle drug misuse and they will assist communities in SIP areas across Scotland to complement the activity that is already being taken forward by other agencies.

Does the First Minister agree that the supply of hard drugs, which killed 340 people in 1999, into Scottish communities is a murderous trade based on a criminal disregard for human life? I welcome Margaret Curran's announcement of the extension of funding for social inclusion partnerships, including the SIP in Tranent. However, will the First Minister assure the chamber that drug action teams and other agencies will take their message and particularly their enforcement activity into every community in Scotland, especially the deprived communities that are suffering most from this scourge?

I am pleased to take advantage of the opportunity provided by John Home Robertson to say that I, too, am grateful for the extension to the work that is being done in his constituency. However, let us recognise that, of the 340 drug deaths in 1999, 163 involved heroin. That is a tremendous figure. We await with interest the results for 2000. Let us also acknowledge the words of the Prime Minister, who said that 90 per cent of the heroin circulating in this country is courtesy of the Taliban in Afghanistan. That has been confirmed by experts.

When we are fighting the menace of drugs, we will do everything possible to tackle it at home, but let us also tackle the source. That is one good reason why all the discussion about the coalition is worth while. We are tackling terrorism. However, when I see people being killed on the streets of Scotland by heroin, I know that we must not only take action, if we can, to apprehend those who sell it and to deal with its victims, but ensure that we act at an international level to tackle its source.

Any new resources for tackling drug misuse in Scotland are welcome, although we all agree that much more needs to be done. Is the First Minister aware that, in the north-east of Scotland, there has been a particularly dramatic increase in drug misuse in recent years, which is reflected in a record level of drug deaths and drug-related crime? Will he ask his officials to investigate the situation in the north-east of Scotland to ascertain whether the increase in the resources that are applied to the issue matches the increase in the problem?

I agree with Richard Lochhead's analysis. There are specific problems in the north-east of Scotland, which reflect wider problems in other parts of Scotland. We want to match up resources with the difficulties that we find. A considerable investment is going into the drugs issue, including for education, for rehabilitation and for enforcement, and that level of commitment will continue. It will be of interest to members from the north-east of Scotland and from other areas that we are moving at Westminster on the confiscation of assets bill, which is hitting hard those who launder money and provide the finance that allows drug dealing to happen. It is in the overall interests of Scotland that we proceed with that legislation and implement it as soon as possible.

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Golf Tourism

To ask the First Minister what steps are being taken to promote Scotland as a centre of golf tourism in light of the decision that Scotland will not host the Ryder cup golf championship until 2014. (S1F-01289)

visitscotland remains committed to promoting Scotland as the home of golf. It is spending £1.5 million in the current financial year and at least £500,000 per annum thereafter to do so.

I am sure that we are all pleased that we will have the tournament in 2014. Does the First Minister recognise the fact that golf is a particularly strong and resilient niche market and that, in the current downturn after the events of 11 September, there is still, as David Davidson said, a massive home market in the United Kingdom, the British isles and Europe, which should be targeted in the meantime?

There was disappointment that we could not land 2010, but we have 2014. Between now and then, we will certainly make progress in promoting golf tourism. One of the hallmarks of the best bid was that we would develop junior golf to ensure that, by nine years of age, boys and girls would be able to participate in golf. That commitment stands; it is being implemented and we shall develop it. At this time, it is important for the confidence of the country that we have five of the eight open championship courses in the United Kingdom, that we have 500 courses, some of which are gems, in countryside and rural areas, and that we have the home of golf. We have the best worldwide assets to sell the game and it is important for visitscotland and all of us to ensure that tourists come, play golf, bring income and bring jobs.

What reassurances can the First Minister give that the major private sector backers remain fully committed to all aspects of the bid, including golf tourism?

That is a good question. I am confident that the major backers will be involved. Indeed, the prospect of having the tournament at Gleneagles means that the company that owns Gleneagles will be involved. I do not want to say too much about forward sponsorship. Suffice it to say that it is an important matter for us, which we will pursue very vigorously indeed.

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Tobacco Advertising

To ask the First Minister whether the Scottish Executive will introduce legislation to ban tobacco advertising in Scotland should Her Majesty's Government not do so and, if so, when. (S1F-01278)

The Executive has never ruled out a Scotland-only ban but believes that a UK-wide ban would be more effective and enforceable. We are anxious to see a ban in place as soon as practicable and will continue to press the UK Government to move quickly in that area.

Does the First Minister agree that, however desirable a UK-wide ban may be, there appears to be no realistic prospect of one in the foreseeable future? I am glad that the Scottish Executive now seems to have accepted that the Parliament could make real progress on the matter and that it has not ruled out doing so. Will he therefore today lay out a timetable for action? Will he tell us how much longer he intends to wait for Westminster to take action and will he give a commitment that, if Westminster has not acted by the deadline, the Scottish Executive will support Scottish legislation without further delay?

I will not answer no to all the questions because I do not accept the premise that there is no realistic prospect of action at Westminster. The Minister for Health and Community Care and I have discussed the matter with the Chief Whip, the Leader of the House of Commons and a large number of key players at Westminster and there is every indication that they want to pursue the matter and will look for a legislative slot. How much more effective and serious an attack on the problem would be if there were a UK-wide ban enforceable throughout the UK. We are enthusiastic and committed to achieving that, but we must be realistic. We will, of course, press Westminster hard to move as quickly as possible.