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Chamber and committees

Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 4 May 2021
  6. Current session: 13 May 2021 to 25 December 2025
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Displaying 1194 contributions

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Economy and Fair Work Committee [Draft]

Digital Assets (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 17 December 2025

Daniel Johnson

I am sure that your ministerial colleagues would love that response.

Economy and Fair Work Committee [Draft]

Digital Assets (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 17 December 2025

Daniel Johnson

Our approach is that we want to be as diligent as possible and to pull that apart, which is why we have asked many of our questions.

Similarly, following on from Gordon MacDonald’s line of questioning, we have talked a bit about what might happen in other jurisdictions, particularly across the rest of the UK. There has been discussion about an expert group being formed. What sort of dialogue has been established between the Scottish Government, the UK Government and the other jurisdictions in the UK about making sure that we keep pace and input, because there will be overlaps as we go forward?

Economy and Fair Work Committee [Draft]

Digital Assets (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 17 December 2025

Daniel Johnson

It therefore remains for me to conclude the public part of our meeting. I thank the minister and the bill team. The bill team has been diligent in paying attention to our evidence sessions—the committee has noted that and welcomes it. I just wanted to put that on the record. I thank you for this morning and for the on-going work.

10:52 Meeting continued in private until 12:04.  

Economy and Fair Work Committee [Draft]

Digital Assets (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 17 December 2025

Daniel Johnson

Good morning, and welcome to the 36th meeting in 2025 of the Economy and Fair Work Committee. We are holding our final stage 1 evidence session on the Digital Assets (Scotland) Bill. We have received apologies from our colleague Murdo Fraser.

I welcome to the meeting Richard Lochhead, the Minister for Business and Employment, and his officials from the Scottish Government: Kieran Burke, bill team leader; Liam Hepburn, senior policy official; Fraser Gough, parliamentary counsel; and Emma Phillips, who is from the legal directorate.

I invite the minister to make a short opening statement.

Economy and Fair Work Committee [Draft]

Digital Assets (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 17 December 2025

Daniel Johnson

I am tempted to ask Mr Gough more questions about the karmic nature of the law, but I will resist that temptation.

Economy and Fair Work Committee [Draft]

Digital Assets (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 17 December 2025

Daniel Johnson

With that, I bring in my colleague Sarah Boyack.

Economy and Fair Work Committee [Draft]

Digital Assets (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 17 December 2025

Daniel Johnson

I have a brief supplementary to that. Professor Robbie made a point about whether carbon credits should be specifically carved out in the bill. Her point was that, once you have created something as property, it makes it very difficult for the Government to exercise control, because of the nature of property rights.

I am certainly not expecting an answer this morning, but I would like to know whether the Government is reflecting on that specific point about carbon credits, given that it was raised by Professor Robbie.

Economy and Fair Work Committee [Draft]

Digital Assets (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 17 December 2025

Daniel Johnson

My question was not really about whether we need to do that; that need is relatively clear, for exactly the reasons that you set out. My question was more about why the bill uses the term “rivalrous” rather than using language such as “exclusive control”. Was there a particular reason for using that novel term, which is certainly not in common usage, as opposed to using a slightly longer-form but plainer-language definition to cover the point that it belongs to one person who controls what happens to it?

Economy and Fair Work Committee [Draft]

Digital Assets (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 17 December 2025

Daniel Johnson

Any Buddhist principles have been underexplored by the committee. I will ask a couple of additional questions, one of which draws on Kevin Stewart’s line of questioning. The bill simply establishes that digital assets are property under Scots law. I wonder whether one of the dangers is perhaps that we think about the big concepts, such as big corporate transactions or the future of technology, but are there considerations on that?

The legislation might well end up being important for things such as civil disputes, probate and divorce settlements. Should some considerations be made because of the nature of digital assets, which are different? For example, it is more possible for someone to say that they have lost access to a digital asset, such as an access key or what have you. In a divorce case going through the courts, you can imagine scenarios in which people might try to claim that they do not have the assets that it is claimed they have because they have lost the ability to access their digital assets and all their wealth.

I am not asking that specific question, but is there a need to examine any safeguards, procedures or technicalities in relation to the application of civil disputes, probate and divorce settlements, or other things that we think of as the nuts and bolts of Scots law and civil law, if the subject of those proceedings will be digital assets?

Economy and Fair Work Committee [Draft]

Digital Assets (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 17 December 2025

Daniel Johnson

Finally—again—I recognise that the bill is unusual. It is focused and short, but some of the concepts that it deals with are expansive. Before we close the meeting, I invite the minister to say whether there are any issues or items that he wants to note that we have perhaps not touched on in the questions that we have asked.