The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.
All Official Reports of meetings in the Debating Chamber of the Scottish Parliament.
All Official Reports of public meetings of committees.
Displaying 3919 contributions
Public Audit Committee
Meeting date: 7 May 2025
Richard Leonard
Okay. Thank you.
Two members of this committee at this time still have questions to put to you. I will move straight along and invite the deputy convener, Jamie Greene, to put his questions to you.
Public Audit Committee
Meeting date: 7 May 2025
Richard Leonard
Is she from the Scottish Government?
Public Audit Committee
Meeting date: 7 May 2025
Richard Leonard
I will take that as a yes.
SPCB Supported Bodies Landscape Review Committee
Meeting date: 1 May 2025
Richard Leonard
That is interesting, because one of the points that was put to us by the SPCB-supported commissioners was that there could be a shared audit service, rather than each organisation being audited individually. I have to say that I think that an underlying theme was the fee that those organisations pay to Audit Scotland for that pleasure. However, you are under the Scottish Government’s audit process, so you do not have a separate facility.
SPCB Supported Bodies Landscape Review Committee
Meeting date: 1 May 2025
Richard Leonard
Julie Paterson referred earlier to the fact that your organisation has an audit, performance and risk committee. Before I come to Julie on that, do you not have something equivalent, John Ireland?
SPCB Supported Bodies Landscape Review Committee
Meeting date: 1 May 2025
Richard Leonard
That is really interesting.
I will go back to a more general theme that we have encountered in our evidence gathering so far, especially when speaking to Scottish Parliamentary Corporate Body-supported commissioners and commissions and so on. Not all of them, but quite a few of them, have been grumbling. They have been grumbling because they think that the audit requirements that they are expected to comply with are, to use their terminology, disproportionate and overly burdensome.
I will start with you, Mr Ireland. I am simply trying to make a comparison. Is it the considered view inside the Scottish Fiscal Commission that you are over audited and that you are expected to do things that are surplus to what is necessary to keep in place a good assurance regime?
SPCB Supported Bodies Landscape Review Committee
Meeting date: 1 May 2025
Richard Leonard
That is really helpful. I want to tease out a little bit more the extent to which your working alongside Audit Scotland is purely voluntary and the extent to which that is provided for by the legislation—which I think that you said it is not—or through other means. Do you have a memorandum of understanding with Audit Scotland?
SPCB Supported Bodies Landscape Review Committee
Meeting date: 1 May 2025
Richard Leonard
That is interesting.
SPCB Supported Bodies Landscape Review Committee
Meeting date: 1 May 2025
Richard Leonard
I should preface my remarks by saying that if you appear in front of the Public Audit Committee—which I am the convener of—invariably it is because things have gone wrong. The fact that you have not is probably a reflection on your good performance and conduct.
I was quite taken aback by Julie Paterson’s remark that she and the commission had not given evidence to a Scottish Parliament committee up until now. I am surprised by that, not only because of the quality of the evidence that you have given us this morning but because of the important role that your organisation plays. You referenced your interventions around the discharge of patients into care homes and so on during the pandemic and the compromise of human rights that that entailed. I am really surprised that no parliamentary committee picked up on your role in that and asked you to give evidence on it. That is now on the record, so I am sure that that will be reviewed.
Craig Naylor, you mentioned earlier that you are working with Audit Scotland on a best-value review of policing in Scotland. The Auditor General was in front of the Public Audit Committee this week. He does not come because of bad behaviour; he comes to inform us and help us be illuminated in our work. He was talking about his forward work programme, and he mentioned the work that he is doing with your inspectorate. I think that he said that it is a requirement of the Police and Fire Reform (Scotland) Act 2012 that there has to be a collaborative relationship with you in carrying out a best-value review of the Scottish Police Authority and Police Scotland. Is that correct? Will you tell us a little bit more about how that relationship works?
SPCB Supported Bodies Landscape Review Committee
Meeting date: 1 May 2025
Richard Leonard
But are you the subject of audit by Audit Scotland?