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Chamber and committees

Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 4 May 2021
  6. Current session: 13 May 2021 to 1 September 2025
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Displaying 3298 contributions

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Public Audit Committee

Section 22 Report: “The 2020/21 audit of National Records of Scotland”

Meeting date: 9 December 2021

Richard Leonard

We cannot hear you at the moment, Mr Samson. We will try to fix that. I am afraid that you might have to start again. [Interruption.] No, we are still not able to hear you.

Craig, do you want to press on with a supplementary, or do you want to move to your next question? Perhaps the Auditor General wants to come back in.

Public Audit Committee

Section 22 Report: “The 2020/21 audit of National Records of Scotland”

Meeting date: 9 December 2021

Richard Leonard

I apologise to Graeme Samson. We are not sure whether the problem is at our end or at his, but we cannot hear him.

The Auditor General’s undertaking to provide us with written evidence, which I suspect Mr Samson might be asked to write, is useful. I apologise to Mr Samson for being unable to hear him.

Public Audit Committee

Section 22 Report: “The 2020/21 audit of National Records of Scotland”

Meeting date: 9 December 2021

Richard Leonard

Thank you very much.

I thank Graeme Samson—I am sorry that we were unable to hear you—Asif Haseeb and Dharshi Santhakumaran for joining us online. We very much appreciate your time and contributions this morning. I also thank, as always, the Auditor General, who joined us in person.

10:13 Meeting continued in private until 11:35.  

Public Audit Committee

Section 22 Report: “The 2020/21 audit of National Records of Scotland”

Meeting date: 9 December 2021

Richard Leonard

It would be useful for us to have access to that more detailed work.

Public Audit Committee

Section 22 Report: “The 2020/21 audit of National Records of Scotland”

Meeting date: 9 December 2021

Richard Leonard

Thank you, Auditor General. We want to put several questions to you and your team, based on our reading of the report and the wider context in which it sits, part of which touches on our concern that ICT projects are not necessarily delivered on time and on budget, as you mentioned in your opening statement.

The section 22 report mentions almost as a passing reference that the census is one of the biggest ICT projects in Scotland. Could you tell us a bit more about the shape that the project takes? Is it an in-house ICT project or a new capital project, or are you just talking about the operational side of it?

Public Audit Committee

Section 22 Report: “The 2020/21 audit of National Records of Scotland”

Meeting date: 9 December 2021

Richard Leonard

We may well have the accountable officer from NRS at a future evidence session. This question may fall into the same category, but do you or your team have a view about the implications of any further delay to the census? It is planned for March 2022, but we could speculate about reasons why it might not go ahead.

Public Audit Committee

Section 22 Report: “The 2020/21 audit of National Records of Scotland”

Meeting date: 9 December 2021

Richard Leonard

I want to pick up on that last point. Over the past couple of days, I have been looking at the ONS’s summary of how things went in the March 2021 census. The document, which was published in October, says under “Main points”:

“Census 2021 exceeded expectations, with 97% of households across England and Wales taking part”.

The document also says:

“Use of cloud architecture allowed us to scale up to meet the very high demand experienced on Census Day”.

It was the first digital-first census to be held in England and Wales. The ONS says that the system did not crash, even though

“we were receiving just under half a million census submissions per hour at the peak.”

It also says:

“The success of the Census 2021 digital service shows that large government digital services can be securely delivered in-house using cloud architecture and Agile development.”

Do you have any reflections on that?

Public Audit Committee

Section 22 Report: “The 2020/21 audit of NHS National Services Scotland”; and “Personal protective equipment”

Meeting date: 2 December 2021

Richard Leonard

Thank you. I now invite Caroline Lamb to make a short opening statement.

Public Audit Committee

Section 22 Report: “The 2020/21 audit of the Crofting Commission”

Meeting date: 2 December 2021

Richard Leonard

Do you mean your election to the commission next year.

Public Audit Committee

Section 22 Report: “The 2020/21 audit of the Crofting Commission”

Meeting date: 2 December 2021

Richard Leonard

What steps are you taking to avoid a repeat of what was clearly a failure in communications and in the relationship between the commission and the setting of the budget, and the interaction between the commission and the Scottish Government?