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Public Audit Committee
Meeting date: 7 December 2023
Richard Leonard
Our major item this morning is consideration of the 2022-23 audit of the Scottish Government’s consolidated accounts. I am pleased to welcome our witnesses: Stephen Boyle, the Auditor General for Scotland; Carole Grant, an audit director at Audit Scotland; and Helen Russell and Richard Robinson, senior audit managers at Audit Scotland.
Today’s evidence session is principally about the consolidated accounts, but we also want to take evidence on the Scottish Government’s workforce challenges, which is very much part of that. Richard Robinson is, I think, the lead auditor on that.
We have a large number of questions to put to you this morning, Auditor General, but, before we get to those, I invite you to make an opening statement.
Public Audit Committee
Meeting date: 7 December 2023
Richard Leonard
It is a simple question, Auditor General; it is a yes or no question.
Public Audit Committee
Meeting date: 7 December 2023
Richard Leonard
We have just a couple of final areas to cover. The first is governance arrangements. You say in paragraph 70 of this year’s report:
“I reported last year that many of the main governance groups are attended by the same individuals (both executive and non-executive) and cover similar topics, themes and risks. This increases the risk of duplication, inefficiency, or blurred lines of responsibility between the different roles and remits of each group.”
What progress has been made since you drew that picture last year?
Public Audit Committee
Meeting date: 7 December 2023
Richard Leonard
Can you just confirm what the strategy is? You have described how the Government has stated that, for understandable reasons, it wishes to grow the national health service workforce. Exactly a week ago, we had representatives from the further education sector talking about pretty drastic reductions already and contemplating even more drastic workforce cuts in the future. A couple of weeks ago, the Cabinet Secretary for Finance stated on the BBC that the public sector workforce will have to shrink. If the public sector workforce has to shrink, the policy is to grow the NHS workforce and we have seen one component of the public sector in front of us describing some pretty catastrophic decisions that it is contemplating, what is the overarching strategy?
Public Audit Committee
Meeting date: 7 December 2023
Richard Leonard
Two years ago, the House of Commons Select Committee on Business, Energy and Industrial Strategy was fairly direct in its conclusions. It said:
“we believe that until Mr Gupta restructures his GFG Alliance companies into a more acceptable corporate structure and publishes consolidated accounts that are adequately audited ... he fails to fulfil the criteria that we believe should be applied to define a fit and proper person for the purposes of receiving any form of Government support.”
That is a pretty direct assessment of where we are, is it not?
Public Audit Committee
Meeting date: 7 December 2023
Richard Leonard
Graham Simpson would like to come in. Is this a follow-up to Willie Coffey’s earlier line of questioning?
Public Audit Committee
Meeting date: 7 December 2023
Richard Leonard
Thank you very much. We are a little bit pushed for time this morning, so I will move straight to questions. I invite Graham Simpson to open up.
Public Audit Committee
Meeting date: 7 December 2023
Richard Leonard
I want to check something with you. We previously referred to SIMEC Lochaber Hydropower Ltd as SIMEC Energy. I do not know whether SIMEC Lochaber Hydropower Ltd is another incarnation of it, or whether that is the correct name that it has always had. It has not submitted audited accounts. Has the Liberty Group submitted audited accounts? Has the GFG Alliance submitted audited accounts?
Public Audit Committee
Meeting date: 7 December 2023
Richard Leonard
One of the areas that you mentioned in your opening statement was the long-standing request for whole-of-government accounts to be produced. There have been delays, talk of alternative proposals and so on. Will you give us an update on where we are at with the issue in a little bit more detail?
Public Audit Committee
Meeting date: 7 December 2023
Richard Leonard
As I understand it, you audit the Scottish National Investment Bank. Is that correct?