Skip to main content
Loading…

Chamber and committees

Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

Filter your results Hide all filters

Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 4 May 2021
  6. Current session: 13 May 2021 to 30 November 2025
Select which types of business to include


Select level of detail in results

Displaying 3519 contributions

|

Public Audit Committee

“New vessels for the Clyde and Hebrides: Arrangements to deliver vessels 801 and 802”

Meeting date: 21 September 2023

Richard Leonard

Thank you. We have run over our time slightly. I suspect that we could go on much longer, minister, but the committee has another evidence session this morning.

I thank all of you—Fiona Hyslop, Colin Cook, Alison Irvine and Chris Wilcock—for your time and input this morning. There might be things that we want to follow up with you in writing, but I thank you for your openness in answering the questions that we have been putting to you.

I suspend the meeting to allow for a change of witnesses.

10:30 Meeting suspended.  

10:36 On resuming—  

Public Audit Committee

Section 22 Report: “The 2021/22 audit of Scottish Canals”

Meeting date: 21 September 2023

Richard Leonard

Welcome back to the second session of this morning’s evidence taking by the Public Audit Committee, which will consider the section 22 report by the Auditor General for Scotland on the audit of Scottish Canals.

I welcome our witnesses, who include representatives from Transport Scotland—that is, the Government—and Scottish Canals. From Scottish Canals, we have John Paterson, chief executive; Maureen Campbell, chair of the board; Sarah Jane Hannah, director of finance and business services; and Richard Millar, chief operating officer. From Transport Scotland, we have Alison Irvine, interim chief executive—good morning, Alison; Kerry Twyman, director of finance and corporate services; and Gary Cox, interim director, aviation, maritime, freight and canals.

We have some questions to put to you about the report but, before we do that, I invite Mr Paterson to make a short opening statement.

Public Audit Committee

“New vessels for the Clyde and Hebrides: Arrangements to deliver vessels 801 and 802”

Meeting date: 21 September 2023

Richard Leonard

You mentioned the former First Minister’s evidence to us. She told us that

“no formal decisions were taken by Cabinet on these matters.”

Was the decision to nationalise the yard, for example, not a Cabinet-level decision?

Public Audit Committee

Section 22 Report: “The 2021/22 audit of Scottish Canals”

Meeting date: 21 September 2023

Richard Leonard

I will quote back to you what the Auditor General’s report says. Paragraph 15 includes expressions such as

“could not be supported by evidence”,

“lack of data”, “potential errors”, “There were errors”, “a lack of documentation”, “several errors” and so on. The report contains quite a catalogue of criticisms of your methodology, all of which has led to a decision not to issue approval of your accounts. As I mentioned earlier, that was described by the Auditor General as “a serious matter”.

From my point of view, I do not want us to be here again in a year’s time, and I am sure that you do not want that, either, but it feels as though we are hearing the same arguments that we heard a year ago. I think that we need persuading that things are moving forward.

Graham Simpson wants to come in.

Public Audit Committee

Section 22 Report: “The 2021/22 audit of Scottish Canals”

Meeting date: 21 September 2023

Richard Leonard

Yes—if it is a short one.

Public Audit Committee

“New vessels for the Clyde and Hebrides: Arrangements to deliver vessels 801 and 802”

Meeting date: 21 September 2023

Richard Leonard

These things we shall return to. Graham Simpson has some questions.

Public Audit Committee

Section 23 Report: “Criminal courts backlog”

Meeting date: 14 September 2023

Richard Leonard

The deputy convener will turn to another part of the justice system that has faced increased pressure and, I presume, increased costs.

Public Audit Committee

Section 23 Report: “Criminal courts backlog”

Meeting date: 14 September 2023

Richard Leonard

Good. Do you accept the recommendations and the timescales set out in the Auditor General’s report?

Public Audit Committee

Section 23 Report: “Criminal courts backlog”

Meeting date: 14 September 2023

Richard Leonard

I am not entirely clear from that whether you are going to meet the timescales set out in the recommendations. For those people who are following this, the Auditor General’s report sets out a series of recommendations, some of which the Scottish Government should carry out in the next three to six months and others for which the realistic timescale is in the next 12 months. There are others that should be carried out in the next two years and, finally, there is a section of recommendations that the Auditor General thinks should be carried out in the next 12 to 18 months. Do you agree that they are realistic timescales, and is it your intent to meet those timescales?

Public Audit Committee

Section 23 Report: “Criminal courts backlog”

Meeting date: 14 September 2023

Richard Leonard

Thank you. I am conscious of the time, so I will move on to Willie Coffey, who has a couple of questions to put to you.