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Chamber and committees

Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 4 May 2021
  6. Current session: 13 May 2021 to 29 November 2025
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Displaying 3519 contributions

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Public Audit Committee

Section 22 Report: “The 2022/23 audit of NHS Forth Valley”

Meeting date: 29 February 2024

Richard Leonard

Let me finish, please.

Public Audit Committee

Section 22 Report: “The 2022/23 audit of NHS Forth Valley”

Meeting date: 29 February 2024

Richard Leonard

The last word goes to you, Janie McCusker.

Public Audit Committee

Section 22 Report: “The 2022/23 audit of NHS Forth Valley”

Meeting date: 29 February 2024

Richard Leonard

We have been speaking about whistleblowing, for example. I am just asking whether, if there are cultural issues that mean that you are not able to retain staff at any level, you are able to monitor that.

Public Audit Committee

“Decarbonising heat in homes”

Meeting date: 29 February 2024

Richard Leonard

I will pick up straight away on governance arrangements, which was one of the themes in that introduction. In the report, you say:

“The Scottish Government should: finalise governance arrangements for the Heat in Buildings Strategy programme as soon as possible”.

That is the expression that you use—there is a degree of urgency. That seems to be instructive, when we look at some of the dates in the report and the scale of the challenge that is to be met by those dates. Can you tell us what governance arrangements the Scottish Government needs to finalise at this stage?

Public Audit Committee

“Decarbonising heat in homes”

Meeting date: 29 February 2024

Richard Leonard

Have you had an opportunity to evaluate the evaluation framework? Do you have any sense of whether the monitoring and evaluation framework that was published back in November will be up to the job that has been set for it?

Public Audit Committee

“Decarbonising heat in homes”

Meeting date: 29 February 2024

Richard Leonard

The other thing is a delivery plan, is it not? I think that there is talk of the production of a delivery plan by the end of this calendar year. Do you consider that to be a reasonable timescale, or is it coming too late, when you look at the timescale and targets that have been set? What is your opinion on that?

Public Audit Committee

“Decarbonising heat in homes”

Meeting date: 29 February 2024

Richard Leonard

One of the factors at play relates to the on-going consultation on the proposed legislation, which I understand will come before the Parliament before the end of the year, and concerns the housing market. There is an expectation that, if someone buys a property, a condition will be put on the purchase such that, within a certain timeframe, the new owner will convert. That could have some interesting consequences, could it not?

Public Audit Committee

Section 22 Report: “The 2022/23 audit of NHS Forth Valley”

Meeting date: 29 February 2024

Richard Leonard

We will have two evidence sessions this morning. First, we will consider the Auditor General for Scotland’s section 22 report entitled “The 2022/23 audit of NHS Forth Valley”.

I welcome our witnesses from NHS Forth Valley, who have joined us in the committee room. Amanda Croft is the interim chief executive. Alongside her is Janie McCusker, who is here on her last day as chair of the board. You are very welcome—thanks for joining us. Andrew Murray is the medical director on the board; Kevin Reith is the director of human resources; and Professor Frances Dodd is the executive nurse director.

The committee has quite a number of questions to put to you. Before we get to them, I ask Amanda Croft to make a short opening statement.

Public Audit Committee

Section 22 Report: “The 2022/23 audit of NHS Forth Valley”

Meeting date: 29 February 2024

Richard Leonard

You refer to the note that you sent us in advance of your appearance here today. There was a lot of managerial jargon in it, and it was quite long. When it came to staff relations, it mainly just discussed whistleblowing. We all accept that whistleblowing is part of a suite of ways for the staff’s voices to be heard, but I would have thought that whistleblowing public interest disclosures were in extremis. As I read it, the point that is being made in the external reviews, including the HIS review, is that there are not good, normalised, routine communications with the staff—including through the staff trade unions, I presume. I do not know whether Mr Reith, as the human resources director, wishes to comment on that.

Public Audit Committee

Section 22 Report: “The 2022/23 audit of NHS Forth Valley”

Meeting date: 29 February 2024

Richard Leonard

Perhaps Professor Dodd could come in briefly on the point about staff relations under the HIS report. Other questions about the report are still to come.