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Chamber and committees

Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 5 May 2021
  6. Current session: 12 May 2021 to 19 May 2025
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Displaying 3061 contributions

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Rural Affairs and Islands Committee

Wildlife Management and Muirburn (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 28 June 2023

Gillian Martin

If people declare that they want to do muirburn on peatland, that will be part of the licence. Basically, we are talking about one licence, and there will be a section that asks, “Are you going to do this on peatland?” I cannot say how the form will look, but I think that that needs to be taken into consideration.

I expect that NatureScot will have guidance in place for crofters or anyone else who applies for a licence, but people will also be able to contact NatureScot and ask for advice if they are unsure in any situation. I do not want licence applications that go in to be rubber-stamped “No” when there can be communication between the licence applicant and the licensing organisation.

Rural Affairs and Islands Committee

Wildlife Management and Muirburn (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 28 June 2023

Gillian Martin

Yes. That is where I see NatureScot providing advice to individual applicants, which could really help. We are proposing a depth of 40cm, and guidance will be given on how people can measure the depth of peat and declare what they believe it to be. People will be able to liaise with NatureScot and say, “I’m proposing to do some muirburn on this piece of land, but I’m not entirely sure how deep the peat is across the area. Can you give me some guidance?” NatureScot will respond to that and help them. I certainly hope to see that as part of the licensing arrangements. It is not a question of someone putting in an application and NatureScot saying, “Hang on a second,” because it does not believe—

Rural Affairs and Islands Committee

Wildlife Management and Muirburn (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 28 June 2023

Gillian Martin

I again point to the fact that NatureScot will take forward the development of the licensing scheme, but I think that it said in evidence to the committee that it will seek a declaration on whether the land is peatland within the one licence. I cannot see that changing. It certainly seems to be the position that NatureScot has set out.

Rural Affairs and Islands Committee

Wildlife Management and Muirburn (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 28 June 2023

Gillian Martin

It is up to NatureScot to decide how the licence is taken forward, but the indication from the discussions that I heard the committee have with NatureScot is that it will not have an onerous process that requires people to apply for umpteen licences for umpteen different muirburn activities. Again, it is up to NatureScot to take that forward.

Rural Affairs and Islands Committee

Wildlife Management and Muirburn (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 28 June 2023

Gillian Martin

I think that we might use the word “practicable”.

Rural Affairs and Islands Committee

Wildlife Management and Muirburn (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 28 June 2023

Gillian Martin

The word “available” might give the wrong impression. Other methods are available, but they may not be the right methods, such as for the reason that you have just given. That could be something that we could look at.

Rural Affairs and Islands Committee

Wildlife Management and Muirburn (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 28 June 2023

Gillian Martin

Yes. Let us look at that at stage 2.

Rural Affairs and Islands Committee

Wildlife Management and Muirburn (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 28 June 2023

Gillian Martin

We have to come to a decision about the depth. At the moment, the definition is 50cm, but other people have called for it to be 30cm, so we have taken a compromise position. We are aware that the science around that is not exact and that there are conflicting views.

This goes back to what I said to Alasdair Allan about the value of peatland. We are taking the view that 40cm is a significant depth and suggests a mature peatland. We do not want to be too restrictive by going to 30cm. If science develops—if irrefutable science comes before us—in either direction and shows that 50cm would be better or that 30cm would be more reasonable, we have flexibility to amend the definition. However, for the purposes of the bill, we have gone for 40cm because we think that that is a reasonable depth.

We must protect peatland as much as possible. I went through all the reasons why peatland is important. To use 50cm as the definition was not the right approach. I cannot be more exact. I would love to be able to point to a definitive reason for the 40cm depth, but that is where we have landed, based on the value of peat and the potential risk to that very valuable natural resource.

Rural Affairs and Islands Committee

Wildlife Management and Muirburn (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 28 June 2023

Gillian Martin

I will start with your first point, which was that muirburn does not burn peat. I absolutely get that. That is true when muirburn is done well by trained people who know what they are doing, which is another reason for having a licensing scheme. There may be people who are not trained, who are not doing it properly and who are putting peatland at risk.

You said that there is data that suggests the depth should be 50cm, but there is also conflicting data that suggests that it should be 30cm.

Rural Affairs and Islands Committee

Wildlife Management and Muirburn (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 28 June 2023

Gillian Martin

Oh—I see. You were talking about the survey maps. I will bring in Hugh Dignon.