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Chamber and committees

Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 5 May 2021
  6. Current session: 12 May 2021 to 4 May 2025
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Displaying 2046 contributions

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Delegated Powers and Law Reform Committee

Framework Legislation and Henry VIII Powers

Meeting date: 7 January 2025

Stuart McMillan

As no one else wants to comment on that, we will move on to questions from Bill Kidd.

Delegated Powers and Law Reform Committee

Framework Legislation and Henry VIII Powers

Meeting date: 7 January 2025

Stuart McMillan

I thank all the witnesses for their contributions. As colleagues have said, it has been a fascinating discussion. I am in no doubt that we could have gone on for many more hours, but parliamentary time does not allow for that.

In addition to answering Jeremy Balfour’s question about the Senedd, if there is anything else that you did not put on the record that you wanted to, please put it in writing and send it to the committee.

I suspend briefly for a comfort break.

11:18 Meeting suspended.  

11:24 On resuming—  

Delegated Powers and Law Reform Committee

Framework Legislation and Henry VIII Powers

Meeting date: 7 January 2025

Stuart McMillan

Thank you.

Delegated Powers and Law Reform Committee

Framework Legislation and Henry VIII Powers

Meeting date: 7 January 2025

Stuart McMillan

I have a question for Professor Reid on the Henry VIII powers. I chuckled when I read this part of your submission, which was in response to question 7 of our consultation. You wrote:

“There is a paradox here. The more that the use of framework legislation is avoided, the more specific details will have to be included in primary legislation and therefore the greater the need to allow Henry VIII powers to avoid Parliament being clogged up with primary legislation to achieve non-controversial legislative maintenance.”

I will come back to you on that in a moment, Professor Reid. First, it would be interesting to hear from others round the table whether they agree with what Professor Reid has suggested, or whether they think that he is potentially overstepping in his considerations in this area?

Delegated Powers and Law Reform Committee

Framework Legislation and Henry VIII Powers

Meeting date: 7 January 2025

Stuart McMillan

Before we close, do members have any final questions for the panel?

Delegated Powers and Law Reform Committee

Framework Legislation and Henry VIII Powers

Meeting date: 7 January 2025

Stuart McMillan

For our second panel, we are joined by Jessica de Mounteney, who is first parliamentary counsel, and Diggory Bailey, who is a legislative drafter, both from the office of the parliamentary counsel. Before we start, I remind you not to worry about switching on microphones—that will be done for you. Do not feel that you need to answer every question, but please indicate when you want to come in with something.

Welcome to the Scottish Parliament and thank you for coming to this session. I know that you are aware of the work that the committee is doing in relation to framework legislation and use of Henry VIII powers.

I will open with a question, before passing on to colleagues. Does the OPC consider that the categorising of certain primary legislation as a framework is helpful or necessary, or do you think otherwise?

Delegated Powers and Law Reform Committee

Instruments not subject to Parliamentary Procedure

Meeting date: 7 January 2025

Stuart McMillan

Under agenda item 4, we are considering three instruments, on which no points have been raised.

Delegated Powers and Law Reform Committee

Decision on Taking Business in Private

Meeting date: 7 January 2025

Stuart McMillan

Welcome to the first meeting in 2025 of the Delegated Powers and Law Reform Committee. I wish everyone a happy new year and all the best for 2025.

I remind everyone to switch off or turn to silent their mobile phones and other electronic devices.

The first item of business is a decision on taking items 6, 7 and 8 in private. Does the committee agree to take the items in private?

Members indicated agreement.

Delegated Powers and Law Reform Committee

Instruments subject to Negative Procedure

Meeting date: 7 January 2025

Stuart McMillan

Under agenda item 3, we are considering six instruments, on which no points have been raised.

Delegated Powers and Law Reform Committee

Framework Legislation and Henry VIII Powers

Meeting date: 7 January 2025

Stuart McMillan

Under agenda item 5, we are taking evidence on the committee’s inquiry into framework legislation and Henry VIII powers.

The witnesses on our first panel are Dr Ruth Fox, joining us online, who is the director of the Hansard Society; Dr Dexter Govan, who is the director of research at the Constitution Society; Dr Pablo Grez, who is a lecturer in public law at the University of Strathclyde; Professor Colin Reid, who is emeritus professor of environmental law at the University of Dundee; Dr Andrew Tickell, who is the head of department for economics and law at Glasgow Caledonian University; and Professor Richard Whitaker, who is parliamentary academic fellow at the University of Leicester. I welcome you all.

I remind all witnesses not to worry about the microphones, because they will be dealt with automatically. If you would like to come in on a question, please raise your hand or indicate to the clerks. There is no need to answer every question—just indicate if it is not for you. If, after the meeting, there is anything that you feel that you have not said on the record that you would like to contact the committee about, please feel free to do so.

We have received a number of submissions from today’s witnesses and others. It is fair to say that it has been quite interesting to read about a subject that most folk would probably think is quite dry. However, as you will be aware, it is a subject that comes up from time to time in the work of this committee.

Among those who have submitted evidence to the committee, there appears to be a broad consensus on what framework legislation is. Do you think that there should be a definition of framework legislation agreed by the Scottish Government and the Scottish Parliament?