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Chamber and committees

Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 4 May 2021
  6. Current session: 13 May 2021 to 8 October 2025
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Displaying 875 contributions

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Delegated Powers and Law Reform Committee

Minister for Parliamentary Business

Meeting date: 7 February 2023

George Adam

As the minister—although I was not the minister then—I do not recall it getting to that stage. During the time that I have been in post, it has been like this. I do not know whether that is due to the changes in the Administration or leadership down at Westminster; I have no idea.

I have said this before to you, convener: aspects of my job are very technical, as are aspects of the committee’s job, and they relate to going through the rules and regulations of how we go about our day-to-day business. I have spoken to equivalent Westminster ministers and said, “Let’s not have a fight unless we have to have one. Our jobs are about process; let’s try and make the process work.”

On the whole, we have that relationship at a political level, and I can talk to the equivalent minister, but that has proved difficult over the past year or so, because there have been multiple ministers in various portfolios. It becomes difficult for two reasons. First, it becomes difficult for me to have a working relationship with an individual and say, “We are not here to fight; we are here to get the job done.” Secondly, it becomes difficult for officials at UK and Scottish Government levels, because, although they remain in the same posts and have the same working relationships, the person who is in charge—the minister who is making the decisions—may have a different personality and a different idea of how to take things forward. That makes it difficult for officials to engage, because they do not know how the minister will react to certain things. That has become more difficult and a larger problem.

Delegated Powers and Law Reform Committee

Minister for Parliamentary Business

Meeting date: 7 February 2023

George Adam

I cannot think of any at the moment, but I will ask my officials whether there is anything that I have forgotten and they can correct me if there is.

Delegated Powers and Law Reform Committee

Minister for Parliamentary Business

Meeting date: 7 February 2023

George Adam

I am trying to think off the top of my head. Susan, do we know that number?

Delegated Powers and Law Reform Committee

Minister for Parliamentary Business

Meeting date: 7 February 2023

George Adam

Thank you.

Delegated Powers and Law Reform Committee

Minister for Parliamentary Business

Meeting date: 7 February 2023

George Adam

Yes—I can tell you that.

Delegated Powers and Law Reform Committee

Minister for Parliamentary Business

Meeting date: 7 February 2023

George Adam

Let us not get caught in negativity, convener. We are in a better position than we were in 2018.

Delegated Powers and Law Reform Committee

Minister for Parliamentary Business

Meeting date: 7 February 2023

George Adam

Aye, I would say that it is the same thinking. This goes back to what I said earlier on about being able to have that kind of working relationship with colleagues in Westminster. It becomes difficult when you cannot pick up a phone and say something as simple as, “We are having difficulty with—insert name of bill,” or “What are you trying to achieve with—insert name of bill,” so that we can understand it. When we cannot do that, we end up with a situation where it is just purely emails and letters going backwards and forwards to one another. That makes things a bit difficult for us.

When we are making a decision, we think about how it affects the Scottish Government and, nine times out of 10, the Scottish Government will want to put an SSI down to say that it is the Scottish Parliament that is legislating on the issue. I think it is only right that we would look to do that because, regardless of which political party is in government in Scotland, we do not want to live in a place where the UK Government is legislating too much on devolved matters.

Delegated Powers and Law Reform Committee

Minister for Parliamentary Business

Meeting date: 7 February 2023

George Adam

That is a difficult question for us to answer here and now. Trying to unpick EU laws that have been part of our legislative structure since 1972 is quite a difficult task; it is one that officials in both Westminster and the Scottish Government are looking at. We are trying to find a way. We are constantly looking at how that will affect us and at what we can do to deal with it. It is difficult for me to say at this stage what the impact will be. We need a balance between finding a way to make that work so that we can still have full scrutiny and ending up in a position where everything that we do is about EU retained law.

Delegated Powers and Law Reform Committee

Minister for Parliamentary Business

Meeting date: 7 February 2023

George Adam

Our officials are in constant communication with their counterparts in the UK Government. They are trying to find that out, which is very difficult. I was three years old in 1972. I know I do not look that age, Ms Mochan, but that is not yesterday. We are in a difficult and time-consuming situation. Officials on both sides are aware of the task and are trying to find solutions to ensure that we can retain EU law up here, although the UK Government has other ideas.

Delegated Powers and Law Reform Committee

Minister for Parliamentary Business

Meeting date: 7 February 2023

George Adam

Thank you.

11:18 Meeting continued in private until 11:25.