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Chamber and committees

Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 4 May 2021
  6. Current session: 13 May 2021 to 10 October 2025
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Displaying 2501 contributions

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Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee [Draft]

Ecocide (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 23 September 2025

Mark Ruskell

What is the concern, then?

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee [Draft]

Ecocide (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 23 September 2025

Mark Ruskell

I am interested in a scenario in which the bill, as it stands, is passed into law. What would change in your sector as a result and is that to do with governance or risk management?

Catherine, you represent a wide range of interests including, I imagine, big oil and gas majors such as Shell and BP with complex corporate governance structures, right through to SMEs. Let us start with the bigger companies: what are your bigger members telling you would be the impact on the culture in the board in relation to governance and risk management if the bill were to become law?

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee [Draft]

Ecocide (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 23 September 2025

Mark Ruskell

No immediate changes are required. You operate in a highly regulated environment, with ministerial objectives and an economic regulator. Is that system fit for purpose under the bill?

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee [Draft]

Ecocide (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 23 September 2025

Mark Ruskell

Is your concern with the marine directorate that the science is not agreed? Fishers could be trawling and dredging in an area with no understanding of the impact that it will have on species, so someone could come back later and say that they have just dredged out the last remaining flame shell reef or something like that. Is it the shifting nature of data and understanding of the environment that is causing your members concern, because they do not know whether they will be retrospectively charged with ecocide under the bill?

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee [Draft]

Ecocide (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 23 September 2025

Mark Ruskell

Do you have any comments on the defence of necessity in the bill? Are there any examples of where that would come up as a defence from any of your sectors?

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee [Draft]

Ecocide (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 23 September 2025

Mark Ruskell

That is quite broad, because you could put a wind farm in one location and perhaps have less environmental impact, or you could fish from a part of the sea where there is no environmental pressure.

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee [Draft]

Ecocide (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 23 September 2025

Mark Ruskell

Simon Parsons, are there particular examples in the water industry of something being absolutely necessary?

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee [Draft]

Ecocide (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 23 September 2025

Mark Ruskell

I know that Monica Lennon wants to come in, so I will leave it.

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee [Draft]

Ecocide (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 23 September 2025

Mark Ruskell

This has been a fascinating evidence session, and I certainly welcome the bill coming to the committee at stage 1. Sometimes members’ bills can highlight the Government’s blind spots, so the session has been really interesting. I want to pick up on a couple of things that came out of Kevin Stewart’s questioning.

First of all, we have this system of environmental regulation and environmental permitting, and I am interested in other jurisdictions that have adopted ecocide as an overarching offence. Has that driven reform of regulation, permitting and licensing, simply because of an underlying fear that some of the regulations are not fit for purpose and that, even though companies might have a licence under those regulations, they might, in some extreme examples, still be found by a court of law to have committed ecocide? I am just interested in finding out what this overarching legal change will do, if anything, to drive further environmental regulatory reform.

Professor Fogleman, I see you nodding vigorously.

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee [Draft]

Ecocide (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 23 September 2025

Mark Ruskell

Did you want to come in, Dr Fifield?