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Chamber and committees

Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 4 May 2021
  6. Current session: 13 May 2021 to 21 January 2026
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Displaying 4176 contributions

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Finance and Public Administration Committee

Pre-budget Scrutiny 2026-27

Meeting date: 30 September 2025

Kenneth Gibson

I am tempted to say something, but I will not go on any further. Ross Greer is next.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Pre-budget Scrutiny 2026-27

Meeting date: 30 September 2025

Kenneth Gibson

Scandalous.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Pre-budget Scrutiny 2026-27

Meeting date: 30 September 2025

Kenneth Gibson

Interestingly, the Finance Committee that ran from 2011 to 2016 took evidence from organisations such as Equity, the BBC, Channel 4 and Creative Scotland. However, such organisations do not really respond to calls for evidence from this committee. I think that they just give evidence to the Constitution, Europe, External Affairs and Culture Committee, which then makes recommendations through its own report. However, there is no reason why we cannot speak to them. We are not all philistines.

Incidentally, in Vilnius, Lithuania, there are, within a few hundred yards of each other, an opera house, a concert hall and a third hall, which is being built as we speak. They clearly see that the arts are an opportunity to boost revenue.

In terms of sharing services, a lot of councils already share payroll, council tax collection and roads management. There is an issue with regard to trading standards. There are 250 fewer trading standards officers than there were a few years ago. One of the issues that local government will continually raise with you is that non-statutory services have been hit really hard in recent years and that the room to manoeuvre is limited.

To finish off, I have a question on taxation, which we have not touched on. Professor David Heald, who has often given evidence to the committee in the past, although not recently, has always railed against the chronic state of the UK tax system, which is anything but progressive. He has often shown us a graph. One thinks of income and taxation as a steady line, but in actual fact it is a bit like the skyline in New York, going up and down. We have to work within that framework. However, we still have anomalies in Scotland whereby—I have mentioned this in previous years—the marginal rate of taxation for someone earning £44,000 a year is higher than for someone earning £51,000 because of the interplay between income tax and national insurance.

The medium-term financial strategy mentions two key measures to ensure a strategic approach to tax: The first is

“to improve the operation and performance of the existing tax system”,

and the second is

“Future tax reform to deliver sustainable and growing tax revenues”.

What improvements to the operation and performance of the existing tax system do you have in mind? What future tax reform will deliver those sustainable and growing tax revenues?

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Pre-budget Scrutiny 2026-27

Meeting date: 30 September 2025

Kenneth Gibson

There are 55 million people south of the border, and there has been a net influx to Scotland from the rest of the UK. It is important that those people are of working age. However, some areas, such as aerospace, say that the highest rate of tax in Scotland is a deterrent when it comes to attracting the engineers they would like to attract. Incidentally, in Lithuania, where we were last week, the top rate of tax is 32 per cent, as compared with 48 per cent in Scotland. Not every country in Europe has very high rates of personal taxation.

I think that we have given this morning’s discussion a really good go. Your responses have been very helpful to the committee, and I thank you and your officials for coming along.

Are there any final points that you would like to make to the committee before we wind things up?

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Pre-budget Scrutiny 2026-27

Meeting date: 16 September 2025

Kenneth Gibson

I must say that you referenced old technology in your submission, but not new technology.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Pre-budget Scrutiny 2026-27

Meeting date: 16 September 2025

Kenneth Gibson

On the same subject area, you have also said that it is important to

“align economic growth spending to gaps in skill and labour market needs.”

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Pre-budget Scrutiny 2026-27

Meeting date: 16 September 2025

Kenneth Gibson

Lesley Jackson, in your paper, you have expressed concern that

“The Flexible Workforce Development Fund (of which the Open University and colleges were providers) - valued at £10.5 million per year - was discontinued in 2023/24”,

and you have said that

“the Open University alone had to turn away over 1,000 learners”.

You go on to say:

“The Scottish Funding Council’s Upskilling Fund, previously valued at £7million per year, was also discontinued in 2024/25.”

You add that what is required is

“More flexibility within graduate apprenticeships to respond to employer needs.”

Can you touch on some of those issues?

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Pre-budget Scrutiny 2026-27

Meeting date: 16 September 2025

Kenneth Gibson

Lesley Jackson, you can come in on that as well if you want.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Pre-budget Scrutiny 2026-27

Meeting date: 16 September 2025

Kenneth Gibson

Sorry, what kind of negative experience?

10:15  

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Pre-budget Scrutiny 2026-27

Meeting date: 16 September 2025

Kenneth Gibson

Frankly, there is a fear of the unknown in many organisations. They think, “We’re going to have to adopt this, but do we have to do it this week?” or, “What’s the implication going to be for the workforce and the whole structure.” I led the first debate on AI in the Parliament, way back in 2018, and the information that we had then about the impact on employment was completely different from the information now. At that time, the sectors that we were told would be most adversely affected and those that would be boosted were completely different from the scenario now. That issue is still being grappled with.

I will move on to capital investments in a couple of minutes, because a few people mentioned that in their written submissions, but a couple of folk want to come in at the moment.