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Chamber and committees

Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 4 May 2021
  6. Current session: 13 May 2021 to 24 December 2025
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Displaying 4060 contributions

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Finance and Public Administration Committee

Public Service Reform Programme

Meeting date: 27 June 2023

Kenneth Gibson

Thank you.

Mr Emmott, I am looking at Dundee City Council’s submission to the committee. One of the questions that we asked was about how the organisation’s plans seek to deliver on the Scottish Government’s three strategic priorities, which were set out. I notice that, in Dundee City Council’s response, you say that you are

“reducing child poverty and inequalities in incomes, education”.

However, you have not expanded on that to say how you will deliver that; it is just a line. Will you expand on that a wee bit, please?

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Public Service Reform Programme

Meeting date: 27 June 2023

Kenneth Gibson

Another thing in your submission that caught my eye, Mr Tough, is the fact that you have transferred 58 assets to community ownership and operation. Obviously, rationalisation of the estate is an important part of the reform agenda. How successful have those transfers been? Have some of the assets had to be handed back, or are all the communities managing to work effectively, albeit one or two of them or perhaps more will need continued support from their local authority? How is that working? Do you believe that other local authorities could learn from East Ayrshire’s model?

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Public Service Reform Programme

Meeting date: 27 June 2023

Kenneth Gibson

Not at all. I will ask you about one more thing, and then I will move on to Mr Burr and open out the rest of the session. It is about the 12 questions that we asked. I was intrigued to note that the response to three of the questions was “Not applicable”. I will ask Mr Burr about the reasons for that in a moment. In Dundee’s submission, you did not respond to questions 10 and 11. Question 10 was one of the questions that Mr Burr also did not respond to. Question 10 was:

“What level of support and guidance has your organisation been given by the Scottish Government to deliver the efficiencies and plans necessary for your organisation, and how adequate has this been?”

Mr Tough responded to that, but I wonder why Dundee did not. What is your view on that? Do you feel that you are not getting the guidance and support?

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Public Service Reform Programme

Meeting date: 27 June 2023

Kenneth Gibson

Mr Burr wants to come back in.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Public Service Reform Programme

Meeting date: 27 June 2023

Kenneth Gibson

Okay. Time is against us, so I will not push that any further. Thank you for that. I will open the session to colleagues. The first person to ask a question is John Mason, to be followed by Douglas Lumsden.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Public Service Reform Programme

Meeting date: 27 June 2023

Kenneth Gibson

What is “fair and sustainable funding”?

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Public Service Reform Programme

Meeting date: 27 June 2023

Kenneth Gibson

Mr Tough, you also provided a lot of detail on your digitalisation strategy. You hope to invest in digitalisation but recoup that cost ultimately. Have you a time over which you think you will be able to recoup the cost of digitalisation, or will it always be something that you are never quite able to manage?

09:45  

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Public Service Reform Programme

Meeting date: 27 June 2023

Kenneth Gibson

Okay. Thank you for that.

You know what I am going to ask you, Mr Burr. Question 9 was:

“How, if at all, is your organisation working collaboratively with other public sector organisations to produce joint service reform plans for the public body landscape and use of resources (for submission to the Scottish Government later this year)?”

The reason why I was surprised by your “Not applicable” response was that you talk about a single islands partnership. I would have thought that you would be working with the other public bodies on the islands, such as the NHS. I am sure that you do work closely with those bodies. Can you give us a wee response to those questions?

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Public Service Reform Programme

Meeting date: 27 June 2023

Kenneth Gibson

Thank God you are not pushing that, John.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Public Service Reform Programme

Meeting date: 27 June 2023

Kenneth Gibson

Sometimes it is hard not to get back in when you have multimember wards. [Laughter.]