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Chamber and committees

Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 4 May 2021
  6. Current session: 13 May 2021 to 10 September 2025
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Displaying 1774 contributions

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Finance and Public Administration Committee

National Care Service (Scotland) Bill: Financial Memorandum

Meeting date: 1 November 2022

Douglas Lumsden

So there is not yet one place where all the risks have been written down so that we can all see them.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

National Care Service (Scotland) Bill: Financial Memorandum

Meeting date: 25 October 2022

Douglas Lumsden

Is the aim for the new national care service to take ownership of those assets or would the local authority still be a provider to the service? Is that still to be worked out? It may not be known yet.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

National Care Service (Scotland) Bill: Financial Memorandum

Meeting date: 25 October 2022

Douglas Lumsden

As we go through the business cases, there will, as you say, potentially be additional capital costs to the Scottish Government in buying assets from local government where authorities have chosen to pull out of providing the service and leave it up to the national care service.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

National Care Service (Scotland) Bill: Financial Memorandum

Meeting date: 25 October 2022

Douglas Lumsden

This is my last point. The Scottish Government desires to reduce its estate and offices and have more people co-locating. From the financial memorandum, it looks like there will be new offices as the extra level is created. Does that not go against what the Scottish Government is doing in trying to rationalise?

Finance and Public Administration Committee

National Care Service (Scotland) Bill: Financial Memorandum

Meeting date: 25 October 2022

Douglas Lumsden

I thought that the whole idea was to provide consistency across Scotland. If different boards are doing things differently, we lose that consistency.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

National Care Service (Scotland) Bill: Financial Memorandum

Meeting date: 25 October 2022

Douglas Lumsden

We might potentially still have a postcode lottery, in which the kind of service that someone receives depends on where they live.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

National Care Service (Scotland) Bill: Financial Memorandum

Meeting date: 25 October 2022

Douglas Lumsden

Following on from your mention of the local governance review, has there been any more work on that? You are right that, if social care is no longer under local government’s responsibility, there would be a huge impact on that review.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

National Care Service (Scotland) Bill: Financial Memorandum

Meeting date: 25 October 2022

Douglas Lumsden

It was interesting to hear from the bill team that there will still be inconsistencies, between rural and urban settings. It was not going to be uniform across Scotland anyway, so my thinking is that it would be a case of changing from 32 different set-ups to perhaps five or six—I do not know how many boards there will be. We will see as we go forward.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

National Care Service (Scotland) Bill: Financial Memorandum

Meeting date: 25 October 2022

Douglas Lumsden

Will that figure come back to the committee?

Finance and Public Administration Committee

National Care Service (Scotland) Bill: Financial Memorandum

Meeting date: 25 October 2022

Douglas Lumsden

Another issue that I want to raise is information technology costs, which was touched on by Michelle Thomson. It is mentioned in the financial memorandum that a key aspect of the bill is to

“enable the creation of the nationally-consistent, integrated and accessible electronic social care and health record.”

We understand that the detailed costs of that cannot be provided yet, but the FM does not even give an indication of what those costs will be.