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Chamber and committees

Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 5 May 2021
  6. Current session: 12 May 2021 to 26 August 2025
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Displaying 2622 contributions

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Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee

Circular Economy (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 5 December 2023

Douglas Lumsden

I absolutely agree, but is there not a concern that big distributors, such as Amazon, which you mentioned, will just move their distribution south of the border to get round some of the legislation that you are going to put in place?

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee

Circular Economy (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 5 December 2023

Douglas Lumsden

In its letter, COSLA talks about co-production and the Verity house agreement and says that the threat of penalties is not in tune with that agreement. Do you not agree with it that the threat of penalties is not the way of building relationships and having a joint way of working?

11:30  

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee

Circular Economy (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 5 December 2023

Douglas Lumsden

During our evidence sessions, we heard from Orkney Council, which has quite a low recycling rate just now—I think that it is about 22 per cent, or around about that. However, it said that the amount of waste going to landfill was not high, because it has energy from waste, for example. It feels that, if it was to push that higher, it would mean more cost for it and probably be worse for the environment, as it would have to start shipping goods off to be recycled on the mainland, to Aberdeen or wherever.

What would you say to Orkney Council? Does it simply have to reach that higher target, even if it is worse for the environment?

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee

Circular Economy (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 5 December 2023

Douglas Lumsden

Minister, in relation to the previous questions, we have had discussions with the Office for the Internal Market. Have you had discussions with it, too? It is not part of the UK Government; it is there to advise all Administrations on potential issues relating to the internal market act.

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee

Circular Economy (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 5 December 2023

Douglas Lumsden

My final question, which ties in with that, is about waste charging for bulky uplifts and whether that potentially disincentivises good behaviours. We often hear that some local authorities charge too much for a bulky uplift, which may send people down the road of using somebody else who might fly-tip elsewhere. Would you like to see more consistency between local authorities in bulky uplift charges?

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee

Circular Economy (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 5 December 2023

Douglas Lumsden

Earlier, I asked questions about the Convention of Scottish Local Authorities. I should have declared that, at the start of this parliamentary session, I was a councillor at Aberdeen City Council.

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee

Subordinate Legislation

Meeting date: 5 December 2023

Douglas Lumsden

The committee heard evidence from the waste industry about sofas that contain POPs, or persistent organic pollutants, being banned from going to landfill. So many recycling centres across Scotland are no longer going to accept them. Are you concerned that that will feed into more fly-tipping—that people who go to a recycling centre with a sofa and are told that the site will not accept it might decide to dump it elsewhere instead, perhaps on the drive home?

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee

Circular Economy (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 5 December 2023

Douglas Lumsden

Minister, companies such as Amazon already have distribution south of the border. What is there to stop them closing centres in Scotland and moving everything south of the border so that they can distribute from there?

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee

Circular Economy (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 5 December 2023

Douglas Lumsden

Minister, I absolutely agree—

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee

Circular Economy (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 5 December 2023

Douglas Lumsden

I will come in on that point. If we deal with only larger businesses, is there the unintended consequence that some of them will move their distribution centres south of the border, where the same legislation to prevent them from disposing of unsold goods is not in place?