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Chamber and committees

Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 4 May 2021
  6. Current session: 13 May 2021 to 23 October 2025
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Displaying 1825 contributions

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Finance and Public Administration Committee [Draft]

Pre-budget Scrutiny 2026-27

Meeting date: 16 September 2025

Michael Marra

Can you tell us when that work will be finished? One of the committee’s concerns is that we do not know whether the £1 billion of savings will be represented in the Scottish Government’s budget when it is presented at the start of next year. You are now saying that no targets are being set in the section that I have outlined for you to save money in this area--you do not have a target, blunt or otherwise. We are trying to understand the shape of the budget. On the basis of what you have just told us, we are not expecting a contribution from you for a saving to that £1 billion.

Finance and Public Administration Committee [Draft]

Pre-budget Scrutiny 2026-27

Meeting date: 16 September 2025

Michael Marra

Can I ask one more, convener?

Finance and Public Administration Committee [Draft]

Pre-budget Scrutiny 2026-27

Meeting date: 16 September 2025

Michael Marra

I am not sure that I buy that, to be honest, nor the point that was made by the convener on instability. Business and enterprise research, development expenditure and investment in business and capital in Scotland have been low for decades. It was the subject of the very first economic development policy under devolution, but those numbers have not shifted at all.

As much as I recognise the current global situation—we see what is happening in France and in other countries—and the challenges that people have, such as shifts in interest rates and political instability generally, we need to look at this more fundamentally. Part of my analysis of that is that there is a very high rate of foreign ownership of companies in Scotland. The owners would not typically invest in satellite operations in other countries, but your solution seems to be more foreign investment rather than trying to find means by which we can capitalise domestic firms and use our financial sector to make sure that people are taking on that investment and making longer-term returns. I understand the challenge behind some of that, but I am not sure that your prescription feels all that current.

There is another part to my question on capital, if it is okay to come on to that—

Finance and Public Administration Committee [Draft]

Pre-budget Scrutiny 2026-27

Meeting date: 16 September 2025

Michael Marra

I am certainly not opposed to FDI—it is an integral part of how we make sure that we have a functioning economy. In essence, the more of it there is, the better. My point is about the longer-term shape of the economy. There is a higher number of SMEs in Scotland in comparison to other parts of the UK and a smaller number of corporates. That exposes the part of the challenge that you put as well.

I want to ask Andy Witty the other part of my question on capital, if that is okay, convener. The submission from Colleges Scotland touched on some of the issues that we have been talking about—productivity through investment in information technology and other areas. However, it did not touch on the fact that there is an £800 million backlog in maintenance alone for colleges in Scotland, nor your ability to make the kind of transformations and changes that you are talking about. I would compare that to our university sector and the challenges that it faces at the moment. For example, you can go to the west end of Glasgow and see the huge number of new buildings that are there.

Is there a more fundamental challenge about taking on debt and structuring the businesses? Colleges do not seem to have that option, because they sit underneath that. Are you hearing any alternatives or ways that the Government will deal with these issues? This sits with the Government.

Finance and Public Administration Committee [Draft]

Pre-budget Scrutiny 2026-27

Meeting date: 16 September 2025

Michael Marra

It would be interesting to know, because I want to explore the issue of deterrence and what happens if a court is making a decision about fraud, in which somebody has stolen money from their fellow taxpayers and citizens. You are talking about recovering moneys, but the question is whether that separate amount can accrue. It would be appreciated if you could come back in writing with detail on that.

Cabinet secretary, in your evidence so far, I have not picked up what you are going to do to get the money back. You have rejected the Westminster approach and have given some grounds for that decision. What action will you take?

Finance and Public Administration Committee [Draft]

Pre-budget Scrutiny 2026-27

Meeting date: 16 September 2025

Michael Marra

This is what I am interested in: you have rejected the UK Government’s approach of trying to drive up the amount that can be reclaimed, so what will you do to drive up the numbers? You say that you have to look at the numbers and get more detail, which I understand, but how long have you known about the issue?

Finance and Public Administration Committee [Draft]

Pre-budget Scrutiny 2026-27

Meeting date: 16 September 2025

Michael Marra

Are those mechanisms sufficient to deal with the issue?

Finance and Public Administration Committee [Draft]

Pre-budget Scrutiny 2026-27

Meeting date: 16 September 2025

Michael Marra

What is your success rate?

Finance and Public Administration Committee [Draft]

Pre-budget Scrutiny 2026-27

Meeting date: 16 September 2025

Michael Marra

What is that as a percentage of the overall amount of money?

Finance and Public Administration Committee [Draft]

Pre-budget Scrutiny 2026-27

Meeting date: 16 September 2025

Michael Marra

I am sorry, cabinet secretary, I am asking you, because it was your decision to not take on board the UK Government position. That was up to you, and you have set out your reasoning for it. Are you happy with that figure, and do you think that 10 per cent is a reasonable outcome for the taxpayer?