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Chamber and committees

Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 4 May 2021
  6. Current session: 13 May 2021 to 13 September 2025
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Displaying 2062 contributions

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Equalities, Human Rights and Civil Justice Committee

Gender Recognition Reform (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 22 June 2022

Pam Duncan-Glancy

It has been put to the committee that, if we move to a self-declaration model and do not collect data on both sex and gender, we might not necessarily have the information that we need to determine whether we are making progress in certain areas of women’s equality. I am keen to know whether you considered that.

I appreciate that some of the questions appear to be coming from slightly left field, as you have described, given the experience that you had in 2015, but I am keen to understand how much of that was explored in what you are seeing now.

Equalities, Human Rights and Civil Justice Committee

Gender Recognition Reform (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 22 June 2022

Pam Duncan-Glancy

Good afternoon, senator. Thank you for joining us and for the information that you gave us in advance—it is invaluable. The answers so far have also been really helpful.

I want to go straight to one of the areas of contention around the bill; I think that you alluded to it earlier, but I am really keen to hear from you as a legislator about how you navigated it.

You will know that a lot of the contention around the bill as proposed is that it could negatively impact on women’s ability to access single-sex spaces. What is your response to that and can you tell us a little bit about how the legislation in Ireland has interacted with women’s rights and their access to single-sex spaces? Have you seen any abuse of the self-declaration model by bad-faith actors—by men trying to use the self-declaration system in bad faith, basically?

Equalities, Human Rights and Civil Justice Committee

Gender Recognition Reform (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 21 June 2022

Pam Duncan-Glancy

That is a pity.

Equalities, Human Rights and Civil Justice Committee

Gender Recognition Reform (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 21 June 2022

Pam Duncan-Glancy

Thank you for that. Professor Sullivan, do you have any comment on that aspect?

Equalities, Human Rights and Civil Justice Committee

Gender Recognition Reform (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 21 June 2022

Pam Duncan-Glancy

Good morning, panel. Thank you for your answers to the questions so far—I had many of those questions on my list, so I will skip them. I also thank you for the hugely helpful evidence that you gave in advance of your appearance before the committee this morning.

My first question is to all of you. How would you characterise Scotland’s support—or otherwise—of LGBT people now? How might that change if the bill is passed?

Equalities, Human Rights and Civil Justice Committee

Gender Recognition Reform (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 21 June 2022

Pam Duncan-Glancy

No, convener. My question has been covered.

Equalities, Human Rights and Civil Justice Committee

Gender Recognition Reform (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 21 June 2022

Pam Duncan-Glancy

People have presented concerns to us about the risks that are associated with self-identification and the risks to women. We heard some very compelling evidence this morning from the SHRC on that matter. However, I am aware that other countries have introduced self-identification and that it has been in place for some time. For example, Argentina introduced it nearly 10 years ago now. Therefore, as a legislator, I am asking you what other legislatures did about that. How did they navigate that issue?

Equalities, Human Rights and Civil Justice Committee

Gender Recognition Reform (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 21 June 2022

Pam Duncan-Glancy

Good morning. Thank you for your answers to the questions so far, Professor Sullivan, and I thank both panellists for the evidence that they have given ahead of today.

My first question is for Professor Sullivan and it is on data. What have you learned from your research colleagues in parts of the world where self-identification has been in place for some years? What impact have they found that there has been on data collection?

Equalities, Human Rights and Civil Justice Committee

Gender Recognition Reform (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 21 June 2022

Pam Duncan-Glancy

My next question is for both witnesses. Professor Sullivan already touched on this when she mentioned section 22 of the 2004 act. What are your views on how the proposed changes would affect single-sex spaces?

Some people have said that our laws are different and not comparable with those in other parts of the world, because of section 22, on protected information. What is your understanding of the impact of the proposed changes on section 22, and how other countries have handled similar situations?

Equalities, Human Rights and Civil Justice Committee

Gender Recognition Reform (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 21 June 2022

Pam Duncan-Glancy

Are you able to comment on section 22 of the 2004 act in particular?