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Chamber and committees

Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 4 May 2021
  6. Current session: 13 May 2021 to 5 September 2025
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Displaying 5780 contributions

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Local Government, Housing and Planning Committee

Pre-Budget Scrutiny 2023-24

Meeting date: 6 September 2022

Ariane Burgess

Thank you. That points back to what Ailsa Raeburn said at the beginning of the meeting, when she described the need for a much more local base, as is happening on Eigg.

Local Government, Housing and Planning Committee

Pre-Budget Scrutiny 2023-24

Meeting date: 6 September 2022

Ariane Burgess

Thanks. We will move on.

Local Government, Housing and Planning Committee

Pre-Budget Scrutiny 2023-24

Meeting date: 6 September 2022

Ariane Burgess

We move to questions on the same theme from Marie McNair.

Local Government, Housing and Planning Committee

Pre-Budget Scrutiny 2023-24

Meeting date: 6 September 2022

Ariane Burgess

Thanks for that point.

As I was saying, we have come to the end of our time—it is exactly 11 o’clock. Some good points have been raised that I know that I, at least, will have to look at in a little more detail. Next week, on 13 September, we will take evidence on the same topic from the Cabinet Secretary for Social Justice, Housing and Local Government.

I thank everyone who has contributed to this morning’s discussion. As agreed previously, we will take our next item in private.

11:00 Meeting continued in private until 11:34.  

Rural Affairs, Islands and Natural Environment Committee

Hunting with Dogs (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 29 June 2022

Ariane Burgess

They are absolutely connected. One of the problems of this committee is the need to recognise that they are connected.

Rural Affairs, Islands and Natural Environment Committee

Hunting with Dogs (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 29 June 2022

Ariane Burgess

In a previous evidence session, Robbie Kernahan from NatureScot made the point that when there are too many exceptions, they become unexceptional.

Some stakeholders, including the League Against Cruel Sports and Scottish Badgers, are concerned that the bill may be in danger of having too many exceptions to enable it to fulfil the Scottish Government’s original intentions. What are your thoughts on that, minister?

Rural Affairs, Islands and Natural Environment Committee

Hunting with Dogs (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 29 June 2022

Ariane Burgess

I thank the minister and her team for being here to provide evidence. A 2019 poll found that 77 per cent of the Scottish public felt that legislation to protect wild animals from hunting with dogs needed to be strengthened, and much of the evidence that the committee has received backs that up. Police Scotland, Lord Bonomy and Chief Superintendent Mike Flynn of the SSPCA have all talked about the challenges of convicting and proving offences under the existing Protection of Wild Mammals (Scotland) Act 2002.

Do you believe that the bill will fully resolve those difficulties or is there scope for amendments to further clarify and define the offences to ensure that, as you previously stated,

“chasing and killing a mammal with a dog, for sport or otherwise, has no place in modern Scotland”?

10:30  

Rural Affairs, Islands and Natural Environment Committee

Hunting with Dogs (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 29 June 2022

Ariane Burgess

Context matters, whether for enforcement or in relation to the bill as a whole. The UK Climate Change Committee has called for a 20 to 50 per cent cut in the number of sheep and cattle to help to combat climate change. Over the evidence sessions that we have had, it has grown on me that we are talking as if things are going to stay the same. However, if we are really going to respond to the nature and climate emergencies, the way in which we farm will change and the way in which we manage our land will need to change. Did you give any consideration to that as you drafted the bill?

11:45  

Rural Affairs, Islands and Natural Environment Committee

Hunting with Dogs (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 29 June 2022

Ariane Burgess

The committee has heard and read evidence from several witnesses who do not agree that there is a need for a licensing scheme and are concerned that it will leave loopholes for traditional fox hunting to continue.

If there is to be a licensing scheme, do you believe that it would benefit from incorporating some of the principles that were set out in Alison Johnstone’s proposed member’s bill from the previous parliamentary session on protecting Scotland’s wild mammals? It proposed that there should be no negative impact on the local or national conservation status of the species in question, that licences should be issued where there is a risk that dependent young will suffer and that licences must be conditional on reporting the number of animals that have been killed or hunted for publication by the licensing authority. Has the Scottish Government considered those or other licensing principles that were suggested in my former colleague’s proposed member’s bill?

Rural Affairs, Islands and Natural Environment Committee

Hunting with Dogs (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 29 June 2022

Ariane Burgess

Thank you.