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Chamber and committees

Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 4 May 2021
  6. Current session: 13 May 2021 to 16 January 2026
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Displaying 6326 contributions

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Local Government, Housing and Planning Committee

Pre-Budget Scrutiny 2026-27

Meeting date: 23 September 2025

Ariane Burgess

That is an interesting point. There is lots of detail that we could dig into, but, on a general level, it has been helpful to get a positive response from you on that issue.

That concludes our questions, although I could ask more, so rich has the conversation been. Thank you very much for your contributions.

As the committee previously agreed to take the next items in private, that concludes the public part of the meeting.

10:53 Meeting continued in private until 11:30.  

Local Government, Housing and Planning Committee

Decisions on Taking Business in Private

Meeting date: 23 September 2025

Ariane Burgess

Thank you.

Local Government, Housing and Planning Committee

Pre-Budget Scrutiny 2026-27

Meeting date: 23 September 2025

Ariane Burgess

That is certainly the case when third sector organisations are run by volunteer boards, as they often are. That is an added layer.

I was going to ask about social care, but you have covered that issue nicely. It was great to hear directly from Maureen about her personal story, because that is one of many stories of families across Scotland.

The fiscal framework has been mentioned a few times in our conversation. I remember the question of who is responsible for the fiscal framework first coming up, after I became convener of the committee, years ago, when Kate Forbes was here as finance secretary. The Scottish Government and the Convention of Scottish Local Authorities agreed to work on that as part of the Verity house agreement. Within that framework is the funding formula, and it was pointed out a couple of evidence sessions ago that that is what needs to be addressed. The allocation for each local authority is based on various criteria, but nobody seems to want to address that. I am interested in your thoughts about the fiscal framework in general and about the funding formula.

Local Government, Housing and Planning Committee

Pre-Budget Scrutiny 2026-27

Meeting date: 23 September 2025

Ariane Burgess

That is a really important point. I like that you made the connection between your point that people who are experienced in dealing with social work cases really understand the nuances of such cases and the fact that AI uses a great deal of power. You also connected that point to the need to tackle the climate emergency.

I will bring in Alexander Stewart to ask about workforce issues.

Local Government, Housing and Planning Committee

Decisions on Taking Business in Private

Meeting date: 23 September 2025

Ariane Burgess

Good morning, and welcome to the 24th meeting in 2025 of the Local Government, Housing and Planning Committee. I remind all members and witnesses to ensure that their devices are on silent. We have received apologies from Mark Griffin MSP, Meghan Gallacher MSP and Willie Coffey MSP. Fulton MacGregor joins us online this morning.

Under the first item on our agenda does the committee agree to take items 3, 4 and 5 in private?

Members indicated agreement.

Local Government, Housing and Planning Committee

Pre-Budget Scrutiny 2026-27

Meeting date: 23 September 2025

Ariane Burgess

Thanks. Do you have anything to add, Maureen?

Local Government, Housing and Planning Committee

Pre-Budget Scrutiny 2026-27

Meeting date: 23 September 2025

Ariane Burgess

You covered that well, John. You started to touch on the impact on your members, and I am interested to hear your thoughts on the impact of previous spending decisions on service users and employees. Could you expand on your view of that?

Local Government, Housing and Planning Committee

Pre-Budget Scrutiny 2026-27

Meeting date: 23 September 2025

Ariane Burgess

Fulton MacGregor is with us. He has always been with us, but we have had a bit of a technical issue in getting him up on the screen and getting his microphone turned on. It is good to see you, Fulton. If you want to come in on anything—[Interruption.] His image is gone, so I will keep talking and hope that he is still there. Is there anything that you want to pick up on workforce issues, Fulton? If you could then ask your remaining questions, that would be great. No? Okay, then I will pick up those questions.

We are interested in understanding—in the context of transformation, but it is connected to the workforce—the need for training in digital literacy to ensure that our workforce is capable of navigating changes and challenges. I hear the backdrop of suspicion that is out there, but, AI aside, there are tremendous opportunities with digital literacy. I wonder what your thoughts are on that.

Local Government, Housing and Planning Committee

Pre-Budget Scrutiny 2026-27

Meeting date: 23 September 2025

Ariane Burgess

Yes, Fulton—we covered that area sufficiently. We bottomed that one out, I would say. If you could move on to collaboration and involvement in the public service reform board, that would be brilliant.

Local Government, Housing and Planning Committee

Pre-Budget Scrutiny 2026-27

Meeting date: 23 September 2025

Ariane Burgess

That is great. We have been talking about collaboration. The idea came out of the work on the Christie commission that we need to move towards a more joined-up approach with collaboration across agencies.

Maureen, you said that you did not have any solutions. Let us pull back from IJBs and community planning partnerships specifically and think about your experience. What do we need to do more of to get genuine collaboration? What is happening? Are there skill sets that fall under collaboration? Do we need to support people to recognise that giving up their own corner and stepping in leads to something better, which is ultimately what we are trying to do with public service reform? You might not have an idea now, but you could come back to us on that.