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Chamber and committees

Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 4 May 2021
  6. Current session: 13 May 2021 to 9 November 2025
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Displaying 2809 contributions

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Education, Children and Young People Committee

Petitions

Meeting date: 26 October 2022

Stephen Kerr

You mentioned it: an annual check-in with some quantitative and qualitative information behind it.

Education, Children and Young People Committee

Pre-budget Scrutiny: Early Learning and Childcare

Meeting date: 26 October 2022

Stephen Kerr

I was going to say that, if it really was a market, it would be first in the queue to be investigated by the Competition and Markets Authority. Frankly, if you think that it is a market, let me disabuse you of that idea. It is not a market, because the local authorities are the funders of the private sector and their competitors. As a result, there is undoubtedly a drift that is beyond anecdotal—for example, in relation to staff, the private, voluntary and independent sector believes that it recruits and trains people and gives them experience, and then the local authority comes along and hoovers them up because it offers them such better salary terms.

I want to ask about your engagement with the PVI sector. Does it tell you similar things to what Willie Rennie and I have said in our questions? I will go first to Carrie Lindsay, then to Wendy Brownlie.

Education, Children and Young People Committee

Pre-budget Scrutiny: Early Learning and Childcare

Meeting date: 26 October 2022

Stephen Kerr

I seek the convener’s guidance. I respect the fact that the authorities that are represented before the committee are—I understand this from PVI partners across Scotland—among the best reputationally for some of the things that we are talking about, but I would like to hear from Stewart Westwater what Fife Council’s PVI partners are saying to the council.

Part of the important reflection that we need to make here is about what the sector is telling the council, because it is the funder and a competitor. We need to hear those partners’ voices, but we will not hear them in this evidence session unless our witnesses reflect to us what they have told them.

Education, Children and Young People Committee

Pre-budget Scrutiny: Early Learning and Childcare

Meeting date: 26 October 2022

Stephen Kerr

What are they telling you in your engagement with them?

Education, Children and Young People Committee

Pre-budget Scrutiny: Early Learning and Childcare

Meeting date: 26 October 2022

Stephen Kerr

I am interested in the recruitment profile. Carrie Lindsay mentioned that Fife Council has been successful in recruiting older people. It has been put to me that there is a bit of a cliff edge past the age of 19 in the support that is available. I wonder whether Fife’s success in recruiting older people is reflected in the PVI sector.

Education, Children and Young People Committee

Pre-budget Scrutiny: Early Learning and Childcare

Meeting date: 26 October 2022

Stephen Kerr

The convener has prompted me to bring in Margot Black. I am interested in hearing her response.

Education, Children and Young People Committee

Pre-budget Scrutiny: Early Learning and Childcare

Meeting date: 26 October 2022

Stephen Kerr

Is that happening in the PVI sector?

Education, Children and Young People Committee

Pre-budget Scrutiny: Early Learning and Childcare

Meeting date: 26 October 2022

Stephen Kerr

Are they bringing people in and training them?

Education, Children and Young People Committee

Pre-budget Scrutiny: Early Learning and Childcare

Meeting date: 26 October 2022

Stephen Kerr

Is that predominantly younger people because of the reduced rates for those who are over 19?

Education, Children and Young People Committee

Pre-budget Scrutiny: Early Learning and Childcare

Meeting date: 26 October 2022

Stephen Kerr

Convener, we might seek information on that point from the representative bodies for the PVI sector, because it has been put to me that it is losing out at an apprenticeship level—on top of the other issue that the sector is losing talent to the public sector because of the different terms and conditions.