Chamber and committees

If I am honest, we do not talk about it enough. There is no doubt that we do talk about it, but I share your frustrations about that, especially at a time when we are seeing quite divisive rhetoric playing out in public discourse that is pitting groups against one another. That is not helpful at all. I have reflected on this in my role as minister. Given that polarisation, I have reflected on the leadership role that I have. I certainly do my absolute best to make sure that all discourse is conducted respectfully, being mindful that we are protecting everybody across the protected characteristics. I have said to the committee before that it is not about a hierarchy of needs, and it is not a pick and mix either.

Before I go into detail on what we have done in the area, I note the responsibility that we all have—all of us in this room—as public sector workers. At every level, all of us who work for the public have a duty to foster good relations. It is incumbent on us all to reflect on how we are conducting ourselves and what we are doing to make sure that we foster good relations between the people that we serve. We need to be mindful of that.

This year, we have provided £7.9 million of funding across third sector organisations to support anti-racism work, interfaith dialogue, hate crime prevention, and asylum and refugee integration projects. Part of that investment is the work that I mentioned in my opening remarks on establishing the Anti-Racism Observatory for Scotland, which is a national centre for excellence to tackle structural racism and promote inclusion. It is anticipated that, once AROS is fully operational later this year, it will focus on developing strategic partnerships across all sectors to collaboratively embed anti-racism change. That will include working collectively with third sector organisations to ensure that lived experience and co-production are at the heart of driving that meaningful change.

I am very mindful of the tensions that can arise when people maybe feel that their standard of living has plateaued and resources can be scarce. My opinion is that we all have more in common and that, actually, we all want the same thing. We all want access to good public services. We all want to feel a sense of belonging, to be included, not to be discriminated against, and to have equality. In order to enhance community cohesion in that space, I was able to secure £300,000 of additional funding that will directly support the community cohesion work and projects—I hope that they will be mainly grass-roots projects—in the heart of our communities that build strong, connected, resilient communities across the country. As far as I am concerned, that is a must have.

That is a really good question. I will not name any specific organisations, but I will give a general overview. I have visited a wide variety of organisations that are based in the heart of our communities. One reason why I will not mention names is that, unfortunately, some groups have drawn negative attention and been targeted as a result of the work that they have done in relation to anti-racism, for example, so I want to avoid that.

When I ask such organisations how we reach the people we need to reach—those who feel disenfranchised—I am reassured by the fact that the organisations are based in the heart of communities. That is one reason why STV, not the Government, is distributing the fund. It has extensive networks and is very experienced in doing such work, in creating new opportunities and in enhancing current ones.

The organisations gave me the example of outreach workers, who go into the heart of communities and communicate with people wherever the touch points are. People are bound to attend a centre of some sort, whether it is a leisure centre, a general practitioner surgery or a shopping centre. Those outreach workers have conservations in which people can express their concerns or views, and they can signpost those people to services or have difficult conversations with them. That is very skilled work. Some people might be applying for £50 from the fund, whereas others might be applying for much more. There is no prerequisite, because I want the fund to be as flexible, responsive and accessible as possible so that we can reach the very people you are talking about.

We have made it very clear, as I have said—thank you for the opportunity to restate it again—that the Scottish Government accepts the Supreme Court ruling. We expect everyone to comply with the law.

The PSED was introduced due to the desire to see tangible improvements for our society. That positive vision is clearly set out in the three underlying goals that I mentioned. Since the PSED was created as part of the Equality Act 2010, we have seen significant improvements to some groups’ experiences of equalities and rights. For example, we now have equal marriage, stronger hate crime laws, new domestic abuse laws, a more robust approach to using equality evidence and significantly more investment in equality groups.

However, as the PSED is a due regard duty, it procedural. It cannot be used to require public bodies to act in certain ways beyond what might be provided under the Scotland-specific duties which are in themselves restricted due to the “due regard” part of the duty.

It might be helpful for the committee to understand the interactions and complexities, so I will bring in Vuyi Stutley.

Just to help you—I did actually see that bit.

Apologies, convener. I was invited to come between 11 and 12, so I scheduled an extra half hour on top of that, and we are now over that as well. If there are any further questions that members feel they need answers to, the committee can—as always—write to me, and I will be happy to supply the information in writing.

Dissatisfaction. However, it is not within my gift and control. It is also unfortunate that, in the short time that I have had here, I have not also been able to go into regulation 11, which I was able to use for the first time. I have not had the opportunity to discuss, or been asked about, the use of regulation 12. I have also not had the opportunity to talk about our mainstreaming toolkit. There are many areas that I have not been able to cover but that come under the inquiry and the public sector equality duty.

Respectfully, that is not within my scope. That is for the committee to decide.

I am sorry, but could you repeat that?

Nick Bland can kick off and then I will come in.