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Chamber and committees

Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 4 May 2021
  6. Current session: 13 May 2021 to 25 October 2025
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Displaying 2173 contributions

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Rural Affairs and Islands Committee

Natural Environment (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 4 June 2025

Jim Fairlie

I would not say that the system has not worked at the moment—it is just that deer numbers are where they are, and we are now going to take action to try to get those numbers down.

There is a huge amount of good will in the sector. I have had a number of meetings with land managers and deer managers, and everybody is agreed that we want to do this and get the numbers down. There are varying reasons as to why the numbers may have gone up, but there is a concerted effort to get them down. Everybody is actually on board with that—that is one of the things that I have taken from my engagement with stakeholders on the bill. They may be unhappy with individual bits of the bill, but the overall consensus is that we want to do this, and we want to do it collectively. As I said right at the start, we are not going to do this on our own. I do not see there being any greater use of the section 8 powers, because I genuinely see a concerted effort from everybody who is involved.

On the occasions when NatureScot has to get involved, that can usually be done through deer management groups and consultation with the people who are involved. I very much hope that that will continue, because there is a collective effort to achieve our aims.

12:15  

Rural Affairs and Islands Committee

Natural Environment (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 4 June 2025

Jim Fairlie

The bill gives certainty to the industry and the Government that we are working towards the same end and the same aims. Notwithstanding the point that I just made that there will be conflicts around different bits of the bill, overall, everybody is behind the aims and objectives, and everybody understands what we are trying to do. I therefore hope that we can resolve the vast majority of issues that come up through negotiation and consultation with the people who are on the ground, rather than by any kind of enforcement.

Rural Affairs and Islands Committee

Natural Environment (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 4 June 2025

Jim Fairlie

The public interest will have to be set out in the code of practice in the individual circumstances.

Rural Affairs and Islands Committee

Natural Environment (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 4 June 2025

Jim Fairlie

Yes. I understand that there is a desire for clarity on the meaning of the term “public interest” in that context. The right place to do that is in the code of practice and not in secondary legislation.

Rural Affairs and Islands Committee

Natural Environment (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 4 June 2025

Jim Fairlie

The public interest will be determined by the consultation process that NatureScot goes through with the people who are involved with a deer management plan or whatever it is that they are doing. Does that make sense?

Rural Affairs and Islands Committee

Natural Environment (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 4 June 2025

Jim Fairlie

I do not see that being a concern. There is definitely a difference between what lowland deer management will do and what upland and hill deer management will do, because there are deer management groups in those areas. Is the concern that deer management groups are being targeted as opposed to what is happening on low ground? We accept that there is a difference between the two areas.

Rural Affairs and Islands Committee

Natural Environment (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 4 June 2025

Jim Fairlie

I am genuinely not seeing the conflict here. The panel is advisory, NatureScot has to act reasonably and impartially in all its duties, and the panel must be approved by Scottish ministers. I do not see the issue being as dangerous to impartiality as other people think that it is. I just have a different opinion. I am sorry.

Rural Affairs and Islands Committee

Natural Environment (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 4 June 2025

Jim Fairlie

I cannot argue that off the top of my head, but if we cannot find the information just now, we will come back to the committee and give you any that we have on whether there is precedent for that.

Rural Affairs and Islands Committee

Natural Environment (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 4 June 2025

Jim Fairlie

There could be any number of circumstances. Currently, there has to be a three-year review; the bill proposes that it should be a 10-year review. Things could happen or change, and circumstances could require more immediate action to be taken, and that is why the provision was put in the bill.

Rural Affairs and Islands Committee

Natural Environment (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 4 June 2025

Jim Fairlie

It is purely to give that flexibility, yes.