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Chamber and committees

Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 4 May 2021
  6. Current session: 13 May 2021 to 13 November 2025
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Displaying 4390 contributions

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Criminal Justice Committee

Police (Ethics, Conduct and Scrutiny) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 8 May 2024

Audrey Nicoll

Okay. I am going to pull the evidence session to a close. Thank you all for joining us and for your time. It has been a really interesting session.

We will have a short suspension to allow a changeover of witnesses.

11:06 Meeting suspended.  

11:13 On resuming—  

Criminal Justice Committee

Police (Ethics, Conduct and Scrutiny) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 8 May 2024

Audrey Nicoll

That is a helpful clarification.

This has been an interesting session, and we have covered quite a lot. Thank you for coming along today; we appreciate your time.

That concludes the public part of our meeting, and we will now move into private session.

12:47 Meeting continued in private until 13:13.  

Criminal Justice Committee

Police (Ethics, Conduct and Scrutiny) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 8 May 2024

Audrey Nicoll

I am sure that members will come back with some more questions on that interesting notion around an ethics culture survey. That is certainly a new one on me.

I have one follow-up question around breaches of the code and the implications of breaches. What came into my head when you set that out was how easy or difficult the practicalities of being able to respond to breaches of the code would be, given the vast range of breaches that could take place. Do you have a view on that?

Criminal Justice Committee

Police (Ethics, Conduct and Scrutiny) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 8 May 2024

Audrey Nicoll

I will bring in Sharon Dowey and then Pauline McNeill.

Criminal Justice Committee

Police (Ethics, Conduct and Scrutiny) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 8 May 2024

Audrey Nicoll

Sorry, I know this is an interesting point, but I am going to have to bring in Fulton MacGregor.

Criminal Justice Committee

Police (Ethics, Conduct and Scrutiny) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 8 May 2024

Audrey Nicoll

I am going to bring in Pauline McNeill and then Fulton MacGregor, Sharon, but I will come back to you if there is time at the end.

Criminal Justice Committee

Police (Ethics, Conduct and Scrutiny) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 8 May 2024

Audrey Nicoll

Does what you have helpfully set out have a bearing on misconduct, performance and complaints, so that there is a direct link to the provisions of the bill?

12:00  

Criminal Justice Committee

Police (Ethics, Conduct and Scrutiny) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 8 May 2024

Audrey Nicoll

In your submission, there is quite a lot of reference to the perspectives and reflections of the victims whom you support. Could you outline what their reflections were on the point about a code of ethics?

Criminal Justice Committee

Police (Ethics, Conduct and Scrutiny) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 8 May 2024

Audrey Nicoll

That is very interesting to hear. I will open questions up to members.

Criminal Justice Committee

Police (Ethics, Conduct and Scrutiny) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 8 May 2024

Audrey Nicoll

Good morning, and welcome to the 17th meeting in 2024 of the Criminal Justice Committee. We have apologies this morning from John Swinney.

Today, we continue our stage 1 evidence taking on the Police (Ethics, Conduct and Scrutiny) (Scotland) Bill. I welcome Stephanie Griffin, Scotland policy manager with the Equality and Human Rights Commission; Dr Genevieve Lennon from the Scottish Institute for Policing Research; and Kate Wallace, chief executive at Victim Support Scotland. Thank you all for taking the time to attend today’s meeting; it is greatly appreciated.

I refer members to papers 1 to 3. I intend to allow around an hour and 20 minutes for this evidence session. I will kick things off with a question on the code of ethics. Quite a bit of the evidence that has been submitted to the committee refers to not just the establishment of a code of ethics and support for that, but the need to make sure that compliance and the effectiveness of such a code is monitored.

I note that the Equality and Human Rights Commission’s original response to the Justice Sub-Committee on Policing’s call for views referenced the recommendations that were made in Elish Angiolini’s review around equality training for police officers and/or staff and that it should, at a minimum, include learning around protected characteristics, acceptable behaviour, the risk of ignoring inappropriate behaviour and so on. I know that training is not a specific provision within the bill, but nonetheless it relates to the provisions around the code of ethics and how Police Scotland ensures that officers and staff are equipped as much as they can be with the knowledge, understanding and skills that they need to comply with a code of ethics. That was teased out a little bit in the SIPR submission as well.

Stephanie Griffin, can you say a bit more about the Equality and Human Rights Commission’s views on the code of ethics and how it can be monitored to ensure it is working effectively?