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Chamber and committees

Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 4 May 2021
  6. Current session: 13 May 2021 to 13 October 2025
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Displaying 1302 contributions

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Finance and Public Administration Committee

Children (Care and Justice) (Scotland) Bill: Financial Memorandum

Meeting date: 9 May 2023

Natalie Don-Innes

That is an important question. I understand the committee’s concerns around that. Obviously, the financial memo was completed well prior to my time in office but, as the member pointed out, it was completed prior to some wider issues, such as inflation. As I said, the financial memo was completed with the contribution of stakeholders and organisations, so it was a good snapshot in time of what the costs were at that point.

As we have rightly said, that will need to be updated, but we are confident that we can fulfil that. The multi-agency meeting on 5 June that I referred to in my opening statement will take forward these discussions with the appropriate stakeholders and organisations. Based on the feedback that we have already received or heard, that will be helpful.

In terms of the longer constraints, it is important to recognise the wider backdrop of the benefits that these change programmes could have and the potential savings to public expenditure. The negative costs to society—both economic and social—of offending and crime are well documented. For example, the Promise “Follow the Money” report estimated that the cumulative cost for physical and emotional harm, lost output and public service costs equated to £3.9 billion. We will need to consider that in terms of the savings that will be made in the longer term.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Children (Care and Justice) (Scotland) Bill: Financial Memorandum

Meeting date: 9 May 2023

Natalie Don-Innes

Obviously, this can fluctuate but, at the moment, there is capacity in secure care. There are currently six spaces and there are five 16 and 17-year-olds in young offenders institutions. However, as already mentioned, we look to expand the last-bed policy, which currently sits at four beds, to 16 beds to ensure capacity for Scottish children. That is being discussed at ministerial level and we hope to provide an update on it soon. Therefore, the answer is yes, in essence.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Children (Care and Justice) (Scotland) Bill: Financial Memorandum

Meeting date: 9 May 2023

Natalie Don-Innes

Yes.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Children (Care and Justice) (Scotland) Bill: Financial Memorandum

Meeting date: 9 May 2023

Natalie Don-Innes

I do not have a date for that at the moment. The working group has a meeting scheduled for 5 June, and stage 1 needs to be completed before that can happen. Everything that we have heard so far from committees and stakeholders will feed into that.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Children (Care and Justice) (Scotland) Bill: Financial Memorandum

Meeting date: 9 May 2023

Natalie Don-Innes

No. Stage 1 will feed into the financial memo, so it will be following that.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Children (Care and Justice) (Scotland) Bill: Financial Memorandum

Meeting date: 9 May 2023

Natalie Don-Innes

It expired at the end of March 2023 and we are looking to expand and increase it now.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Children (Care and Justice) (Scotland) Bill: Financial Memorandum

Meeting date: 9 May 2023

Natalie Don-Innes

I understand that concerns have been raised about the funding for social work. I reiterate that the figures were worked out in conjunction with various organisations, including Social Work Scotland. We very much value the work of our social workers, and I want to ensure that their engagement continues throughout the process. They will be involved in the meeting of the group on 5 June that I have mentioned.

I will pass back over to Helen Duncan on the intricate details.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Children (Care and Justice) (Scotland) Bill: Financial Memorandum

Meeting date: 9 May 2023

Natalie Don-Innes

Again, it is difficult to quantify that.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Children (Care and Justice) (Scotland) Bill: Financial Memorandum

Meeting date: 9 May 2023

Natalie Don-Innes

That is the case with many things in the bill, as has been alluded to. That is something that will be looked at.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Children (Care and Justice) (Scotland) Bill: Financial Memorandum

Meeting date: 9 May 2023

Natalie Don-Innes

I have seen COSLA’s comments and I am aware of them. As I said, we will be engaging on the matter.