Plenary, 27 Mar 2003

Meeting date: Thursday, March 27, 2003

Official Report 580KB pdf

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First Minister's Question Time

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Prime Minister (Meetings)

To ask the First Minister when he will next meet the Prime Minister and what issues he intends to discuss. (S1F-2635)

I have no immediate plans to meet the Prime Minister, but I plan to speak regularly with him over the coming weeks. In particular, I intend to draw to his attention remarks that Scotland's aid agencies made yesterday. They stressed to me the importance of the United Nations not only in the provision of humanitarian aid in Iraq during and after the conflict, but in the reconstruction of Iraqi society. I am sure that those agencies and others strongly support the Prime Minister's efforts today to convince the American Government to take the same route.

I associate myself and my party with the First Minister's remarks about the work of the humanitarian agencies and the primacy of the United Nations in drawing the matter to a conclusion and putting in place the necessary humanitarian assistance.

In a recent keynote speech, Scotland was described as a country that suffers from low growth and population decline, that has the unhealthiest people in Europe, where the environment is spoiled, where we are reluctant to take a risk and quick to blame, and where communities are blighted by violence on Saturday nights. When he made those remarks on Friday, was the First Minister talking Scotland down, or was that just an assessment of the failure of his Government and successive London Governments?

It is a measure of my ambitions for Scotland that those are the issues that require to be addressed. I will be delighted to send Mr Swinney a copy of the whole speech, so that he can see the answers and solutions, as well as the challenges that Scotland faces.

The Parliament has several important functions. It is important that we pass the right legislation, and that we do that in the name of Scotland. It is important that we allocate our budgets and make decisions daily, weekly, monthly and annually in ways that befit the Scotland that we are trying to create. It is also important that we have wider ambitions and that we try to tackle the underlying problems over the years, such as maltreatment of our environment, the culture of violence on a Saturday night, the lack of entrepreneurial culture and a host of other matters. If challenges such as racism and sectarianism are taken on, Scotland will be made a better place. That is exactly what I intend to do as a continuing First Minister.

If we have all those problems, that raises a question: who has been running the country for the past 40 or 50 years among the crowd on the other parties' benches?

The First Minister offered to send me a copy of his speech, but he will not be surprised to learn that he does not need to do that, because I have examined his speech closely. It contains a number of interesting ideas. The big idea was a promise to take action against

"dealers who sell drugs to … children at the school gate".

That idea is admirable, but six years ago in "Labour's covenant with Scotland", the people were made an identical promise by Labour:

"We will … introduce … ‘drugs cordons' round Scottish schools, whereby anyone caught dealing in drugs within a specified radius will be liable for tougher penalties."

Since that promise was made six years ago, how many drug cordons have been established around Scottish schools and where are they?

It might have escaped Mr Swinney's notice, but the Parliament has been in existence for only four years, not six years. In the past four years, the Parliament has seen serious action being taken on tackling Scotland's drug dealers and tackling drugs in Scotland, such as the establishment of the Scottish Drug Enforcement Agency as promised, the staffing of that agency and the additional powers—on which SNP members were not keen—to take the proceeds of crime and put them back into communities to ensure that dealers pay the price for their actions.

Action has been taken throughout Scotland to pull together drug action teams that help those who require local rehabilitation and assistance. Those are the practical measures that the Parliament was meant to take and has taken. Other practical measures will be taken in the next session if we spend the next four years talking not about independence, but about problems in Scotland and how to address them.

The only thing that was missing from that answer was the word "none". The commitment that I cited has not been delivered; that is yet another broken promise. No wonder the First Minister read out that litany of failure; it is the failure of this Government.

The First Minister promised that he would cut waiting lists by 10,000. He has broken that promise. He promised that 80 per cent of primary school pupils would achieve appropriate standards in reading and writing. He has broken that promise. He promised to set up drug cordons, but he has broken that promise, too. Given that he has broken so many promises, how can the people of Scotland take seriously any of the First Minister's promises at the forthcoming election? Is not it the case that patients, pupils and victims of crime cannot wait any longer for the Government to deliver? Is not it the case that the people of Scotland should move on and change the Government of Scotland?

It is a pleasure to note that one of only three examples that Mr Swinney quotes—the other two are inaccurate—is an example from six years ago. It was included in a document, which I believe was issued prior to the 1997 general election.

During the past 12 months, only one significant promise has been broken by a politician in Scotland: the promise to talk about independence, which the leader of the Scottish National Party made last May. We have not heard the word "independence" since—entire party-political broadcasts do not even mention the concept, never mind use the word. When we get to the election campaign, we will talk about independence, but we will also talk about education, health, transport, crime and job creation, which are the priorities for the people of Scotland. That is exactly why they will back us to return after 1 May.

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Cabinet (Meetings)

To ask the First Minister what issues will be discussed at the next meeting of the Scottish Executive's Cabinet. (S1F-2630)

Yesterday's Cabinet was the last scheduled meeting before the Scottish Parliament elections on 1 May. In the current situation, contingency arrangements have been made for the Cabinet to meet during April, should that be necessary.

Although people's thoughts are at this time invariably focused on the international situation, we all reflect that the war in Iraq is, in part, about establishing a democratic society that has free elections like the one in which we will participate on 1 May.

I return to domestic concerns for my question to the First Minister. After four years of this Labour-Liberal Democrat Executive and no fewer than 53 tax increases, many people in Scotland will be disappointed that violent crime continues to rise, that 19,000 more patients wait for hospital treatment and that the number of new business start-ups has decreased. People will also have been disappointed to learn recently that more than half of the pupils in the second year of our secondary schools do not meet national standards for reading. Does the First Minister share our disappointment and concern? How will more of the same make any difference at all?

Contrary to what Mr McLetchie says, our many achievements include the highest standards in reading and writing that we have seen in our secondary schools in my lifetime and substantial improvements in support for business, not only for business start-ups, but in support that allows existing businesses to grow. We have not only ensured that we have better paid staff and better equipment and facilities in our hospitals; we have brought down waiting times for Scotland's key killer diseases.

I assure Mr McLetchie that, not only have we made those achievements, we have many ambitions. There is much more still to do—that is the challenge for the Parliament in the next four years. We will build on that record and I am sure that it will educate us and lead us to meeting the challenge, and to meeting it successfully.

The big problem is that the record completely contradicts all the First Minister's assertions. Is not it about time that he admitted that the centralising and top-down approach to running our public services that has been the feature of the Administration for the past four years has not worked and that it will not work?

Will he explain to people in Scotland why he did not cut his bloated Government down to size by halving the number of ministers who interfere in the running of our affairs? Why has he not cut the rates burden on Scottish businesses that puts them at such a competitive disadvantage compared with businesses south of the border? Why has he not given our doctors and nurses far more say in the running of the national health service in Scotland? I am thinking of foundation hospitals and general practitioner fundholding. Is not it about time that we had a Government in Scotland that does something about such problems rather than one that ignores them?

I am delighted to take up the member's challenge. On a top-down approach and not giving enough local power, not only has the partnership Administration devolved more powers to local authorities and bodies in Scotland than any other Administration in my lifetime, but it has done so successfully. It has worked in partnership with local authorities and many other bodies that deliver services at a local level. We are also devolving power to front-line managers of services who need such power in order to make the right priority decisions at local level.

Furthermore, we have cut the rates burden for Scottish businesses by freezing rates for next year and by giving a firm commitment that, in future years, the rate of inflation will be the maximum by which they will increase. There have been similar achievements for the new Scottish Parliament and the Scottish Executive in a wide range of other areas.

In the next parliamentary session, it is important that we build on our achievements not only by maintaining smaller class sizes in primary schools, but by reducing class sizes in secondary schools. Not only did we build on the 20,000 modern apprenticeships that we promised to deliver, but 30,000 apprenticeships have been delivered for young people. We have put behind us the absolute hopelessness of the 1980s and 1990s and built a Scotland that is fit for the 21st century.

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Entitlement Cards

To ask the First Minister whether the Scottish Executive has any plans to introduce entitlement cards. (S1F-2640)

As part of our commitment to providing people with better public services, we are supporting the development by Scottish local authorities of a citizen's smart card. The card will initially be used for bus travel, school meals and registration, access to some leisure services and as a library card, although other services can be added as required. We plan to make the card available on a voluntary basis.

I appreciate that there can be benefits to such a card, which the First Minister has outlined, but he will be aware of the concerns of many Scots that such a scheme could violate civil rights to privacy if it is not presented properly. In the light of such concerns, will he assure me that the purpose of any entitlement card would be made clear and that there will be full consultation with Scottish communities about it? Will he assure me that all our citizens, including asylum seekers, will not be forced to carry any card that might be seen as an identity card and will not be harassed by police authorities for not carrying such a card?

I am not in favour of compulsion. It is important that such a card is voluntary, which is why we are piloting the card with local authorities that wish to pilot it. It is right that they should have such an opportunity.

I am not, however, in favour of our making it compulsory in Scotland for people to carry several cards in order to access different public services. In an age of modern technology and easy access to other services, it is absolute common sense that people should have easy access to public services and that information be held on one card that will allow people local and national access to public services. If that can be achieved, we will make Scotland a better place to live.

Will the First Minister say what the difference would be between the entitlement card that he suggests and the entitlement card that is being suggested for south of the border? Will he spell out in more detail exactly what information will go into the card?

The Home Secretary has begun a consultation on entitlement cards in the United Kingdom; we will obviously engage with him in that consultation. Such an entitlement card would impact on some devolved areas, so it is important that the Scottish Executive and the Parliament should make representations in due course. However, that is an entirely different concept to the idea that I have just described. A citizen's smart card in Scotland, which local authorities will pilot, can be successful in allowing people in Scotland to get rid of all the clutter of cards and other mechanisms that they use to access local services. There can be access to local and national services through one card, which is an important development. We have been willing to pilot and support such a card and I hope that we can bring it about.

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Forth Estuary Transport Authority

To ask the First Minister what discussions the Scottish Executive has had with the Forth Estuary Transport Authority regarding transport options across the Firth of Forth. (S1F-2634)

Officials are in regular contact with the Forth Estuary Transport Authority concerning a range of cross-Forth transport issues and we have a seat on its management board.

I thank the First Minister for that answer. Does he agree that it will be important to run a sustainability slide rule over any proposed new crossing, and that every effort should be made both to maximise the rail capacity over the current rail bridge—for example, by using longer trains—and to consider using the planning framework to group together homes, leisure facilities and jobs in order to cut down commuting?

I have much sympathy for the points that Nora Radcliffe makes. It is important that we maximise the use of existing routes and that we have the rolling stock that allows us to do that. It is also important that, in our planning policies, we design homes and communities in such a way as to reduce the need to travel distances to work or for other purposes. I am happy to take up the points that Nora Radcliffe raises and pass them on to the Forth Estuary Transport Authority.

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Schools (British History)

To ask the First Minister what commitment the Scottish Executive will give to ensure that British history is adequately covered in the curriculum in schools. (S1F-2627)

Guidance to education authorities and schools provides ample opportunities for teaching British history, including Scottish history, at every level of the school curriculum.

The First Minister might be surprised to hear that I was present during the march that took place outside the chamber at half past 5 last Thursday. I assure him that although I did not take part, I felt that it was my duty as an elected member of Parliament to stand by to hear and see what was going on at that march. Does the First Minister agree—given this great country's history of sacrifice in opposing tyranny and oppression wherever it may occur—that it is high time that our young people were made fully aware of the sacrifice that has been made by the generations that preceded us and of the great and distinguished heritage of this country?

I announced towards the end of last year that I thought that it was important that we in Scotland acknowledge a variety of occasions in our history, including the union of the crowns in 1603. I think that it is important, not for party political reasons but for reasons of knowledge, history and understanding, that young people in this country understand all of their roots, where they come from and what our country has done—good and bad—in the past. I certainly hope that in every secondary school and primary school throughout Scotland we not only teach our young people their Scottish history as effectively as possible, but teach them about the time during which they have been part of Britain, which should constitute part of their knowledge and understanding of where they come from. That will also help to inform them of the benefits of democracy, tolerance and respect, which are part of our national character.

Does the First Minister agree that anyone who studies British history should also recognise that Britain was first in the world in economic performance in the 19th century, but is today 19th and falling? We should recognise that many of the countries that became independent from Britain during the intervening period have prospered and that none of the countries that have become independent from Britain want to get back in.

Mr Wilson is full of contradictions; he has just made more. He has spent his four years in the Parliament—when the eyes of business were not upon him—criticising private profit, criticising those who would manage public spending, advocating substantial increases in spending on every occasion and trying to ensure that a culture is created in the Parliament that is hostile to public-private partnerships and other engagements with the private sector. He cannot do that and go round Scotland's boardrooms telling people that he is a friend of business. Mr Wilson must be more consistent. I hope that he will be in the weeks to come.

Does the First Minister agree that one of the strands that goes through British history is the quest for justice? Four years ago, patients who had been infected with hepatitis C from blood products had been waiting many years for justice; they are still waiting for it today. Will the First Minister do all that he can to put pressure on the UK Government to allow the Scottish Executive ministers and the Scottish Parliament to do exactly what we want to do, which is to give fair payments to those who have been infected with hepatitis C?

I am sorry—that was possibly wide of the original question. Does the First Minister want to respond?

I confirm that Malcolm Chisholm will—as he has been doing over recent months—work extremely hard to ensure that we bring about a just conclusion to the matter.

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British Sign Language (Interpreters)

It is appropriate that the last question in this session of Parliament should be asked by the person who uttered the first words in the Parliament.

To ask the First Minister whether, in the light of Her Majesty's Government's decision to give official recognition to British Sign Language as a language in its own right, the Scottish Executive will fund a long-term training programme for more sign language interpreters. (S1F-2624)

As a start, I believe that we should double the number of British Sign Language interpreters in Scotland and I have asked officials to prepare plans for how we might achieve that, which will be presented to whatever set of ministers occupies the Executive offices after the election.

That was an encouraging answer.

I am proud to be asking the last question in the Parliament. Since my members' business debate on the subject, during which the public galleries were packed with deaf people, the Executive has taken quite a lot of steps on the issue, such as the type-talk scheme, interpretation for visitors, the BSL video, leaflets and the £10 million for audiological assistance. I am happy to congratulate the Executive on those developments, but is the First Minister aware that the core problems remain? Those problems are the need for formal recognition of BSL, which is an ancient, sophisticated and evolving language, and the emergency shortage of interpreters, which has been referred to.

There are now 39 interpreters; at the time of my members' business debate there were 32. However, Finland has 350 interpreters. There are fifteen BSL students on the go, but because they are part time, they receive no funding. I suggest the practical step of making the Heriot-Watt University course a degree course, which would attract more students and allow them funding as full-time students. That would speed up the process for the many people who would like to be interpreters. The deaf also wish a centre for deaf studies, which could perhaps be considered by whomever succeeds the First Minister—I am optimistic about that.

In yesterday's debate on children, Jackie Baillie said that we want a Scotland where every child matters; I ask that it should be a Scotland where every deaf child matters.

I share Winnie Ewing's commitment to British Sign Language. As a child, I learned basic BSL from my father. It is not only important that we have enough interpreters in Scotland, but that we encourage recognition of the language's importance to the deaf community, especially to deaf children. We can do a lot more and I am sure that we will do it. One of the marks of this young Parliament during the past four years has been its willingness to do the right thing for Scotland's children. I am sure that we will do that again on this issue in the years to come.