Community and Village Halls
The final item of business is a members' business debate on motion S2M-3839, in the name of Andrew Welsh, on community and village halls. The debate will be concluded without any question being put.
Motion debated,
That the Parliament notes with concern the increased costs of water charges paid by new village and community halls and that these will also be imposed on older halls after 2010; recognises that these halls play a vital role as the hub of the community by providing a venue for educational classes, Scottish dancing, recreation, Scottish Women's Rural Institute meetings, keep-fit classes, youth clubs, scouts, brownies and other activities; believes that these charges to charitable organisations are an undue burden on local rural communities in Angus; notes that the Scottish Executive has partly funded numerous new halls and refurbishments for many more which has caused an increase in the rateable value burden, and believes that the Executive should extend the exemption scheme to all community and village halls with charitable status and introduce legislation to reinstate the exemption for community and village halls which have charitable status.
This debate is about the future viability of charitable organisations. More than 2,300 community and village halls throughout Scotland face massive increases in water charges because legislation is forcing Scottish Water to end exemption from water charges for new buildings now and for all such buildings run by charitable bodies by 2010.
Muirhead and Birkhill villages in Angus are rightly proud of the Muirhead and Birkhill Millennium Hall, which was built in 2002 as a result of local fundraising, lottery grants and Scottish Executive funding. However, those running the hall now find themselves hit by massive water bills, increased rateable values and a raft of compulsory regulation costs, which is a situation that every community hall will face in 2010 unless the Government reinstates sensible exemptions for the small charitable organisations that run these community resources.
Village and community halls are run not by large organisations with huge operating budgets but by small groups that are run by local people in and for local communities. They are non-profit bodies that raise funds through the hard work of unpaid volunteers. In rural areas, they are the backbone of community life. They support a vast range of activities, from education classes and Scottish dancing to meetings of the Scottish Women's Rural Institutes, the scouts, youth clubs and other organisations. All those activities are essential to the well-being of the local communities that the halls serve. Many halls have tiny operating budgets, so any income that is saved on water charges will free up essential resources, in terms of money and volunteer time spent on raising money.
Similarly, for charities, water supply has become a major operating cost. For example, Scotland's first children's hospice, Rachel House, would have had to pay water bills the equivalent of the salaries of two nurses had the Executive not given Scots hospices provision for that. Why then should a rape and sexual abuse centre in Stirling have to pay a water bill that is equivalent to the salary of one of its sessional workers? That is the situation that charities now face.
All this takes place in a charging system that is riddled with anomalies. Roughly speaking, some halls that were built before 1999 are exempt from water charges, but those that have been built since then are not. I say "roughly", because the exemptions are complex and are due to finish in four years. I do not underestimate the problems that Scottish Water faces in making good the past neglect of water services infrastructure, in meeting European Union quality standards and as a result of the ministers' decision that the cost of infrastructure improvements must be recovered from existing customers. Another issue, according to the Scottish Council for Voluntary Organisations, is the level of anarchy in the customer databases, which have been massively inaccurate from 1996 right up to the present. Those problems have led to some amazing situations. For example, a Gaelic-medium unit for eight under-fives on the Balivanich airfield found itself liable for the water charge for the entire base when the Ministry of Defence closed it down. A veteran's charity was faced with a six-figure water charge when it was billed for all the water from a leaky pipe that had wayleave through its grounds and which served abandoned properties that were owned by others.
Scottish Water has fixed some anomalies, only to be faced with the water industry commissioner's statement that the issue of concessions is a political matter for ministers to determine. Therefore, the responsibility is clear: the Scottish Executive can retain a rebate scheme if it so chooses. It is difficult enough to recruit volunteers in today's world, but constant, unattainable financial targets will make the time and effort demands on individuals impossible. Ministers must make clear what their policy intentions are in relation to charge relief for charities. Are ministers committed in any way to helping village halls and charitable organisations by exempting them from water charges? I look forward to the minister's response on that. The Executive's stated commitment to developing the social economy in Scotland and to a wider inclusion agenda is totally undermined when the voluntary sector is about to be hammered with increases in water charges and other compliance costs. Currently, seven hurdles stop charities from being exempt. Will the Executive remove any or all of those barriers? Again, I hope that the minister will make the Executive's policy clear tonight.
Villages and community halls provide a platform for community life to flourish, yet SCVO research shows that almost 85 per cent of the halls have an annual income of less than £5,000. On top of that, the Government is constructing even more regulations and barriers. The introduction of private water supply regulations in January means that community halls with private water supplies face a £350 cost for the initial test of water. Some, because of the nature of their supplies, will have further on-going costs from the testing regime. There are believed to be at least 150 halls for which that initial cost alone will be 10 per cent or more of their annual income.
The advent of the new Scottish charities regime some time this year will make it more imperative for hall committees to recruit and retain a good mix of people to ensure that halls not only survive but flourish and develop new activities that are suited to modern demands of new local residents. Is the Scottish Executive considering any specific provision for the training of members of those committees to reflect the recent marked increase in obligations on such volunteers? What training will be given to people to help them to perform better? We know that to get anybody to volunteer nowadays is very difficult. Whether it is the scouts or any other organisation, there are many hurdles that prevent decent, straightforward, honest people from coming forward. We must do everything in our power to ease that entry into helping voluntary organisations.
Village and community halls are the life-blood of local communities; indeed, more than 20 per cent of them are war memorials to Scots who fought and died overseas to defend our democracy. Scotland's charitable and voluntary organisations and their army of volunteers are a national asset, to be treasured and encouraged.
In the 15th century, the royal burgh of Canongate granted permission to freely draw water to organisations dealing with the sick and dying. It would be to the shame of the Scottish Executive if it failed to respond to similar charitable and voluntary needs in the 21st century.
I congratulate Andrew Welsh and thank him for introducing this issue for discussion. It is ironic that we have dealt with much legislation that has restructured the water industry, yet we still seem to be discussing its impact on community halls and buildings that are used by voluntary organisations. While the structure of the debate does not allow us the opportunity to ask for a commitment from the Executive that would cost it resources, it is important that we take the opportunity to ask the minister what can be done to consider in greater detail what has been happening to community halls and buildings that are owned by voluntary organisations, and how the impact on them can be alleviated over time.
The change in the water industry structure has meant that Scottish Water—although perhaps not as deeply involved in the commercial world as it ought to be—requires to reflect commercial reality in the way in which it operates, yet we know, through our contact with businesses, which also have problems with water charging, that there is a degree of unfairness in how water charges are levied against organisations of all kinds. It is, therefore, important that the minister gives us a commitment that she will at least consider the situation that has been brought about and the injustices that appear to exist. For example, some halls that have not been adjusted since 1999 still have their charitable status, while those that have been built since then are struggling to cope with their water bills. Will the minister tell us whether there is any provision in the structure to rectify that?
As we heard from Andrew Welsh, the water industry commissioner has made it clear that this is a political matter, and therefore a matter for ministers. It is important that the minister takes the opportunity to clarify what the commissioner said. She should answer these questions: is it within the power of ministers to grant relief to such halls on a charitable basis, and does she intend to consider whether that can be done in the near future?
I congratulate Andrew Welsh on raising an extremely important issue with a great deal of passion, and at the right time, because there is time to deal with it.
I circulated a copy of the motion to all the community councils in my constituency and received a great many responses. Inverness south community council, which does not yet have a community hall, pointed out that heaping more charges on it would deter it from creating a community hall.
The association of Cairngorms community councils made the point that a number of the committees that run halls do not have charitable status. If the minister is looking to extend the exemption scheme, I hope that she will take account of the fact that not all community halls have charitable status, which, as I understand it, means tax clearance from the Inland Revenue.
Boat of Garten community council has just received money from the lottery to establish a hall, and it is trying to raise the final £80,000 to achieve its aim. It is already struggling with strict requirements in relation to health and safety, public entertainment licences and the provisions of the Disability Discrimination Act 1995, as well as the cost of heating. The water charges could well be the last straw. Iain Murray of the community council points out that in the average hall, water demands are confined most of the time to little more than tea making and the use of toilets. The use of the water has to be considered; I hope that the minister will cover that.
Lochaber federation of village halls points out that it already has cash-flow problems and that increased rates could lead to the closure of many village halls, as Andrew Welsh was quite right to point out.
Kincraig community hall committee points out that it runs a wide variety of events, such as health and fitness classes, youth clubs, children's dance classes, children's football, the partially sighted bowling club, volleyball, yoga and pipe band practices. Some of those activities will cease because the hall committee cannot afford to pay the rates.
I am passionate about this subject, because community halls—many of which are in small areas—provide a focal point for the community at a time when the post office and the petrol station are under threat in rural Scotland, which has suffered at the hands of successive Governments.
Although I am pleased that the minister is here to respond—I have great respect for her and the obvious sincerity that she brings to the task—and that the Deputy Presiding Officer is here, for whom I have nothing but praise, not one Scottish Socialist Party member, Labour back bencher or Liberal Democrat member is present. I do not often say something when members are not here, because there might be reasons for it, but I cannot think of any reason why there are no Labour, Lib Dem or SSP members here to discuss an issue that is so crucial to communities.
I have covered more territory than I expected to cover in such a short space of time by the expedient of speaking extremely quickly. I look forward to the minister's response.
Andrew Welsh is to be congratulated on bringing forward a debate that has so much resonance in communities throughout Scotland.
The community or village hall is the hub of the community and the focus of many activities and events. It has the capacity to bring local people together for socialising, fundraising, learning or even protesting. Like the local school, shop or church, it helps to define the community and gives people a sense of belonging. All in all, such halls enrich communities, whether they are small isolated villages or bustling city suburbs.
People in many communities, often driven by a few dedicated individuals, have worked incredibly hard as volunteers to fundraise to improve or even build new community halls. I know from my many years on Auchterhouse hall committee the amount of effort that goes into years of working to support and improve local facilities. I know that many communities feel frustrated by the lack of support from those who advocate supporting rural communities but who do not always translate that rhetoric into action.
In Muirhead and Birkhill, which are next to where I live, the committee and community spent five long years fundraising for what is now a tremendous new hall. For people there to face the possible closure of that hall due to high water rates is unacceptable and must be soul-destroying for those involved. It simply must be recognised that community halls are in a different category and provide valuable services. Support must be given to sustain them in the most effective way possible. An exemption from water charges for halls with charitable status is one solution, but, as we have heard, not all halls have charitable status.
I would like Scottish Water to be more flexible with regard to the possibility of apportioning reduced costs where community facilities are involved. I am sure that no one would deny that halls have to pay something for the water and sewerage facilities that they use. However, the costs have to be commensurate with a recognition of the benefits that the facility offers the local community.
Why is it so difficult to apply a bit of lateral thinking to this issue and to consider the savings to the health service that are due to the activities that are offered by community facilities, or the savings to the justice system that must result from our young folk being offered alternative activities that can help to keep them out of trouble? Some halls provide internet facilities, which offer a wide range of opportunities to the more disadvantaged people in the community. In rural areas, all the facilities offer a much improved quality of life that, if taken away, cannot easily be replaced.
There is a need for more thought to be given to the sustainable design of halls. Many halls, such as our one in Auchterhouse, which is an old, stone, high-ceilinged building, are crying out for improvements in energy efficiency to make them warm, welcoming and cheap to run. It is not only water bills that are rising; increasingly high fuel bills will also create problems.
Hall committees need to be given maximum information and support to incorporate energy efficiency, grey water use, water-saving devices and even microrenewable alternatives that will enable them to generate their own energy. I hope that it is not too late for people to investigate how cost and environment-saving solutions can be incorporated in halls such as the one in Muirhead.
Perhaps the Executive can review its support and advice to ensure that there are sufficient opportunities for local communities to reduce the long-term burden of utility bills through the use of more sustainable solutions.
I congratulate Andrew Welsh on securing the debate.
We should be aware of some of the background to today's debate. We are discussing the problem of water charges, but a broader crisis is emerging for village and community halls throughout Scotland, which is a result of the drying up of sources of funding and withdrawal by the Scottish Executive of the capital grant scheme. That is creating difficulties for the future of many community and village halls.
Halls will face all sorts of challenges over the next few years; one of the big challenges for many will be the need to bring them up to scratch in terms of access for disabled people. We want to achieve that as far as possible, but the reality is that the cost of that is often prohibitive for small community-led ventures. Maintenance and insurance costs increase all the time, but essential modernisation and repairs are important and must be paid for.
Halls are vital to communities. In my constituency, challenges and increasing problems confront Crieff community hall, Madderty village hall, the Bridge of Earn institute, Glenfarg village hall and Forgandenny village hall. When the problem that Andrew Welsh has brought before us today is added to their situations, the scale of the difficulty that confronts many small communities across Scotland becomes clear. They fear that their local halls might have to close because they cannot be sustained in the longer term.
If rural halls areas are closed, it will be a tragedy for the social cohesion of the communities. People who are not connected with rural areas do not understand the extent to which the local hall is a lynchpin of many communities.
The dearth of MSPs of all parties who have attended this debate—which Fergus Ewing noted—suggests that the extent to which halls are fundamental to communities throughout the country is not appreciated by members of the Scottish Parliament. That is the only lesson that I can take from the low attendance. The problems relating to water charges are but one part of an enormous crisis that faces village and community halls across Scotland. I do not want to diminish the issue of water charges, but the crisis is not only to do with them. Andrew Welsh knows that the problem is about more than just water charges. He chose to highlight that issue today, but there is a greater issue about the social inclusion of people who live in rural areas, who need places that act as a focus for their communities. If the halls close, the guts will be taken out of many communities. I, for one, do not want that to happen.
As other members have done, I congratulate Andrew Welsh on bringing the debate to Parliament. I thank members who stayed to contribute to the debate.
I am originally from Glasgow, but I have spent most of my adult life in rural constituencies. Indeed, my first sally into public involvement was as a member of the Ferintosh school and hall committee on the Black Isle. I represent Midlothian; a large part of my constituency is rural so I am cognisant of the important and often central role that village halls play in communities. Village halls are a vital part of the infrastructure that supports rural communities throughout Scotland.
The Executive has provided direct support for village halls through grants under the local capital grants scheme. That support has been provided in recognition of the role that community halls play in strengthening the social cohesion of rural and urban communities. I understand that village halls in the Angus area have benefited under that programme.
The Scottish rural partnership fund has provided rural communities with grant aid to build community capacity and to help communities to find local solutions to local problems. In 2005-06, some £3 million was awarded under the SRPF to projects in rural communities in Scotland. About £9 million has been awarded during the past three years. Those figures illustrate the Executive's commitment to supporting and enhancing rural and urban communities in Scotland. We also provided support to the Scottish Council for Voluntary Organisations, which manages a village halls website that offers guidance and advice to people who seek support in developing and running village halls. It is a good website and it would be useful for those who are involved in village halls to look at it. It can genuinely help to support the work that is done by volunteers.
Does the minister accept that we have a crisis with running costs? How can the Executive help voluntary organisations that raise relatively small amounts of money but which are the lynchpins of their communities? How is the Executive helping such organisations to deal with the crisis with running costs?
As we look to the future, we are continuing to focus on fair water charges for all. That is the right way forward. We will consult in the period up to 2010 so that everybody will be on a level playing field. We need to ensure that, through that consultation, we arrive at a fair system of charging. The recent final determination of the water industry commissioner ensures that water bills will not increase above the rate of inflation. That is good news for village halls.
Our support is designed to enable the development of new halls and the refurbishment of existing halls. An example of an application from the Angus area is Kilry village hall. The approved works to that community facility will lead to increased year-round use and comfort, especially for the older members of the community.
The sustainable management of community facilities rests with the community bodies that run them. That includes work to ensure that all the costs of running a hall are built into its business plan. That touches on points that Andrew Welsh and Shiona Baird made about the complexity of ensuring that the range of running costs are considered. Those costs include utility costs such as water charges, and there is a range of other costs.
Shiona Baird mentioned provision of advice on renewable energy. I hope that, as part of our support for rural communities, we can provide much better information on energy-efficient ways of heating village halls, for example. I know that some people who run village halls are considering imaginative ways to use resources efficiently—I encourage others to learn from them. That is exactly the kind of information that we can disseminate through the SCVO's website. I am more than happy to consider that suggestion and to take it forward. Of course, mandatory and discretionary business rates relief also help to support community and village halls.
I have a difficulty in that I am not comfortable about cross-subsidising from some water customers to others to support halls, which is what would, in effect, happen if Andrew Welsh's suggestions were accepted.
As the minister will know from my previous speeches on water legislation, I do not support cross-subsidisation where it can be avoided. Is not it the case that in many village halls, particularly smaller ones, charges massively exceed the level of services that are used? Is there nothing we can do to reduce the charges to reflect the level of service that is used?
As I have said, we must look toward the fundamental change that will be implemented in 2010. We will fundamentally change the basis on which we will charge non-household customers for water and water services. We will consider the concerns that are expressed in the consultation, but we must look to 2010 to secure a more level playing field for village halls. I have said that is neither right nor fair that some customers are charged less, in some cases potentially at the expense of others who pay more. It is a complex issue.
As a result, we have no plans to extend the scope of the current water charges exemption scheme to assist organisations that do not meet, or which no longer meet, the statutory eligibility criteria. Any move towards abolishing charges for particular groups would, as I have said, place an undue burden on other customers. It would also run counter to Scottish ministers' policy that all customers should contribute to the cost of the water and waste water services that they receive.
The aim of the exemption scheme is to allow small organisations that occupy premises that had formerly been getting relief to prepare to pay for services from 2010. The deadline for the exemption scheme was extended from 2006 to 2010 to allow more time for preparation and to ensure that those who would pay for the first time would not start payments until a new fairer and more transparent system of charging all non-household customers is introduced. In this regard the Scottish Executive is planning a fundamental change to—
On cross-subsidies, the Scots are known for their generosity and we have seen that they dig deep into their pockets for charities, whether for Bosnia, Malawi or other parts of the world. I remind the minister that we are dealing with charitable organisations. She has to cope with the fact that Scottish Water pays for capital projects through revenue, which is the worst way to fund such schemes, because every customer is immediately hit. We are talking about the effects on charitable organisations that are crucial to rural areas and to some towns. Does the minister accept that Scots would be much more generous to charities than the Executive seems to want to be?
Given the level of exemptions to which the Executive has agreed, the member would not expect me to agree with that. We are saying that we have to look forward to the change that will happen in 2010, which will fundamentally change the basis on which non-household customers pay for their water services. As I have said, we will consult on the proposals for introducing general non-household metering and banded drainage charges, which will be implemented—as far as possible—by 2010.
The new basis for charging non-household customers will break the existing link with rateable values and replace it with a regime that reflects the cost to customers of using the system. That will be a fairer and more transparent means of charging non-household customers.
Looking forward, Ministers have put in place a regulatory regime that is keeping charges down for all customers. I have referred to it already, but the recent good news on water charges demonstrates our policy of subjecting Scottish Water to rigorous independent economic regulation. That is paying dividends for all customers, who can look forward to bills rising by less than the rate of inflation, while bills in England and Wales rise by 18 per cent above inflation. Our continuing focus on fair bills and on keeping all customers' bills down is the right way forward. I hope that members will agree with that approach.
Meeting closed at 17:35.