Co-operation with Ireland Inquiry and Transposition and Implementation of European Directives Inquiry
We move on to item 3, which is to enable our two reporters to provide a brief update to the committee on the inquiries that they are carrying out. Briefing papers were circulated to members, but I invite both reporters to say a few words in addition. I should use the European term "rapporteur" to refer to them. Dennis Canavan is first, acting as reporter on the inquiry into possible co-operation between Scotland and Ireland. Dennis, could you speak to the section of the briefing paper that relates to your inquiry?
An interim report has been circulated to members but I will add a few details. On the Dublin visit, I met Éamon Ó Cuív, who is Minister for Community, Rural and Gaeltacht Affairs and an influential member of the Irish Cabinet. He seemed very enthusiastic about the prospects for co-operation between Scotland and Ireland. He has made a ministerial visit to Scotland and he hopes to make another one fairly soon. I notified the First Minister and other relevant ministers in the Scottish Executive of that possibility.
During my meeting with Éamon Ó Cuív, Bertie Ahern—the Taoiseach—came in. He stayed with us for about 10 minutes and took part in the discussion. He seemed very positive about co-operation between Ireland and Scotland and said that he would discuss the matter with his Cabinet colleagues. I also met Dan Mulhall, who is director general of the European Union division of the Department of Foreign Affairs in Dublin. He was the first Irish consul in Scotland—he was based here in Edinburgh—so he has a lot of background knowledge about Scotland and Ireland and co-operation between the two countries.
Cecilia Keaveney TD is a leading member of the Irish Parliament and she was very helpful in organising the programme. She represents Donegal North East and is convener of the Irish Parliament's Joint Committee on Arts, Sport, Tourism, Community, Rural and Gaeltacht Affairs. We also met the senior officials from the Department of Finance who have responsibility for European Union funding. The main message that I took from that meeting is that if Scotland is to be included in the existing co-operation programme between the Republic of Ireland and Northern Ireland, a decision will be required soon about structures. I have alerted the First Minister to that. If Scotland is to be included in the co-operation programme, the Scottish Executive should ensure that it does not miss the boat.
We also met representatives of various business and enterprise bodies including the Irish Cross Border Area Network, Inishowen Rural Development Ltd, Chambers Ireland and the Irish Business and Employers Confederation.
Before I went to Ireland, I attended a meeting in Glasgow that was organised by the Scottish Council for Development and Industry. The guest speaker was Enterprise Ireland's representative in Scotland and I was invited to give a short presentation about the committee's inquiry. I got a positive response from the people at that meeting and the SCDI and some individual members hope to make submissions. Strictly speaking, the closing date has passed, but there is a degree of flexibility on that, as I explained to them.
Last Friday, Nick Hawthorne and I attended a seminar-cum-workshop in Glasgow that was organised by the Scottish Executive's Europe division. It was about territorial co-operation and European Union funding of the co-operation objective, which is to replace Interreg funding at the end of the year. Again, we got the message that decisions will have to be made fairly soon on the principle of Scottish participation in the programmes and the structures for taking that forward.
I intend to visit the Western Isles on Friday next week. That area is at the forefront of Scottish-Irish co-operation in many respects, including the work of Iomairt Cholm Cille—formerly the Columba initiative—on the promotion of Gaelic culture. Also, Comhairle nan Eilean Siar, the local authority, has a partnership with local authorities in Northern Ireland and the Republic of Ireland. Alasdair Morrison, who is a former member of the European and External Relations Committee, is being helpful in trying to arrange a programme for the day. I hope to visit Northern Ireland and Donegal next month—probably during the Easter recess—and I will report back to the committee in due course.
Thank you. As members who have looked will know, the written evidence that has been posted on the website has been very positive about the objectives. You also said that decisions must be made soon if we are to take advantage of this funding and that you have written to the First Minister in that regard.
That is right.
Can we record that that was done with the committee's full support?
I should say that I am getting the letter off to the First Minister for the purpose of speed. Last week, I had a personal word with him and thought that I should put down my thoughts in writing. Obviously, it would help if I was able to say that the committee backed me.
I have just come back from being outside, so I do not really know what I am supposed to be agreeing to.
Dennis, will you quickly explain the issue to Irene?
As you will know, there are already participation programmes between the Republic of Ireland and Northern Ireland. When we were in Dublin, we met senior officials from the Department of Finance of the Irish Government, who explained that if Scotland wanted to get involved in the existing participation programmes, decisions would have to be made very soon on the principle of Scottish involvement and the structures for developing such involvement. I have already explained that to the First Minister in an informal conversation, but I simply thought that I would get on record the fact that I was following it up in writing.
That sounds like a very good idea. Further to that, we discussed the matter at the structural funds forum, and identified the issues on which the Northern Irish are working. I asked whether it would be possible to piggyback quickly on some of those initiatives. There is certainly a will to move forward on the matter.
I thank Emma Berry and Nick Hawthorne for helping to expedite this inquiry.
Jim Wallace will now report on his inquiry on the transposition and implementation of European directives in Scotland.
Most of the detail is contained in paper EU/S2/06/4/3, which has been submitted to the committee. There has been a reasonable response to our call for written evidence.
One challenge that we faced with this inquiry, which is indeed as open-ended as members would think it might be, was to identify three regulations that we could use as case studies. We eventually agreed on the Waste Incineration (Scotland) Regulations 2003, which cover a wide range of activities; the Registration of Fish Sellers and Buyers and Designation of Auction Sites (Scotland) Regulations 2005; and the very recent Public Contracts (Scotland) Regulations 2006, which relate to the procurement of goods and services in the public sector, on which concerns have been expressed.
With the assistance of Professor Alan Page of the University of Dundee, our legal advisers are carrying out an analysis of those regulations and comparable implementing directives in other parts of the United Kingdom and at least one other comparable jurisdiction.
We have met representatives of a company that operates north and south of the border that has highlighted various implementation issues and has been able to give us an insight into certain differences between Scotland and England in enforcing legislation. After all, enforcing the implementation of directives is as relevant to this matter as the directives' actual wording. Last week, we also visited the Scottish Environment Protection Agency to get its perspective, and I have further meetings lined up this week.
Our starting point for the inquiry was a desire to find out whether we are gold-plating or overegging things by comparing the implementation of directives. However, other issues are beginning to emerge, such as the value of regulatory impact assessments and how they are put together and the level and nature of consultation with key stakeholders, including enforcement authorities, in implementing regulations. If we want to make the inquiry worth while, the challenge is to keep it strictly focused, as it could easily blossom out.
I look forward to reading more about the subject, and I might seek the opportunity to listen in on some of the forthcoming discussions that Jim Wallace mentioned.
There is a perception that the regulatory authorities in Scotland—SEPA being an example—take some sort of delight in announcing and enforcing new regulations that, although they might have been imposed with the best possible intentions, do not offer any practical advice on implementation. Businesses might experience all sorts of difficulties as a result. It ought to be incumbent on authorities not just to tell people that they may not do certain things but to offer some sort of solution, explaining, "You can't do it that way any more, but we suggest you do it a different way in future." That is not how a number of authorities are currently implementing regulations. It would be useful to develop some sort of culture change in that respect. Perhaps I can talk to Jim Wallace about that directly.
That is an emerging issue. Timing is an issue. I am not picking on SEPA specifically, but what notice does the Executive give it of regulations, for example? The National Audit Office has done some worthwhile work, although not in exactly the same way as we are doing our work. Last year, or certainly within the past 18 months, it conducted an inquiry into the implementation of seven sets of regulations by the Department for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs in England and Wales. I found it useful to read the report on that, if only to help to identify some of the questions that we could ask and to ascertain what parallels we can draw with practice in Scotland.
I appreciate what Jim Wallace is saying about being focused. Such inquiries have a habit of growing arms and legs. Does Mr Wallace expect to have the opportunity to consider whether we are at a comparative disadvantage in relation to not just the rest of the UK but other regions or member states?
That is the intention. If the committee wants me to go off and visit all the other 24 member states, I will be delighted to do so. In making our selection, we will consider member states of comparable size and perhaps a Spanish autonomous region. We will try to make reasonably good comparisons with Scotland. For example, if we are going to examine the registration of fish sellers and buyers, we will not readily go to Austria. We will try to choose somewhere that seems a comparable place.
One suggestion might be to consider complaints to the European Commission in respect of infringement proceedings.
That is a useful suggestion, which might help to identify a suitable place.
I compliment Jim Wallace on what he is doing. We would certainly not want the inquiry to blossom out. Jim mentioned the registration of fish sellers and buyers. I acknowledge the difficulties that various port authorities have experienced with auction sites. Indeed, the Scottish Fishermen's Federation and other bodies are involved in such issues. Is it the intention to involve such organisations in the inquiry, or would that mean things blossoming out too far?
It is important to discuss specific regulations with the key stakeholders.
Thank you very much for that, Jim. We will all look forward to seeing the draft report in due course. I thank Alasdair Rankin and the committee's legal advisers for their help.