Chamber and committees

I thank the witnesses for coming to speak to us about this very difficult subject. It is important that the committee hears about it. I should have said at the outset that I chair the adult survivors of childhood sexual abuse cross-party group in this Parliament, and Collette Stevenson is also a member of that group. The group has real concerns about some of the stuff that we have been hearing about today. I want to ask about the increase in abuse, particularly during the Covid pandemic, because almost every witness has talked about it. I think that I know the answer to this, but it would be good to get it on the record. Are we talking about a real increase overall—I think that we are—or are we talking about better detection methods, particularly on the part of the police? The police have attended several times to talk to the group about how, over the past few years, they have been able to deploy technology that they would not previously have thought it possible to deploy. Does anyone want to comment on the increase and the scale of such abuse? Are we uncovering it more or has there been an actual increase because of Covid and other factors?

My question follows on from the discussion that we have had. I want to reflect on what David Hamilton said.

For the record, I should declare an interest; this is in my entry in the register of members’ interests. Before I became an MSP, I was a social worker in criminal justice and child protection.

What David Hamilton said has always been the case, and I am now thinking about that in a new light, as I am seeing the issue from a different perspective. We were always told that the police were the last resort, and the police were used quite frequently. People would be told, “This is a police matter.” I go back to points that Mr Evans made. Should other agencies have more power and more confidence to take things? It is not necessarily the fault of social workers or health workers if they think that something is a police matter.

Another thing that Mr Evans said chimed with me. He said that we are a society that can call on the police. We definitely do not want to lose that. It is quite a difficult balance to find.

We have heard the term “burn-out” and about the pressures that police officers are clearly under. We all know police officers in our own lives. I have friends as well as constituents who are police officers, and I have heard from the ones whom I have spoken to that they still love their jobs, but they are feeling more pressure than they ever have. I hear that across a range of services.

Maybe ACC Hawkins could answer this question. Has any analysis been done of what the main contributing pressures are that lead to the feeling of burn-out that has been described? We have heard a lot about dealing with mental health and more complex issues. Where does Covid come into it? Where do resources come into it? Has any overall analysis been done?

It is just a wee supplementary to your line of questioning, convener—it is probably for David Hamilton. He said that there might be personal or work-related reasons for suicide. How do we make a judgment on that? Everybody’s life is complicated, and various elements might be intertwined. For example, a person’s work might lead them into substance abuse at home, which might then become the precipitating factor for a crisis. How would the police—or anybody, in fact—identify which factor was more prevalent? Does that make sense?

I know that we are short of time, but I think that Joanne Smith wants to come in.

What does the analysis point to or indicate? Even though, as you said, it is not very detailed, has the force come to any conclusions on that analysis?

Over time, have you noticed a marked increase in those absences?

I apologise—I know that it is a difficult question in a very sensitive area. With regard to the instances that have been described, I take the opportunity to pass on my condolences to all the witnesses, who have obviously experienced the loss of friends and colleagues in the service.

Convener, I was nearly finished, but that last answer leads me to another question, because that is a really good point. I imagine that you and your officers regularly deal with what the rest of us would consider really traumatic experiences. Has there been an increase in those really traumatic experiences? We have heard about the increase in contact from members of the public in relation to mental health issues, and I think that we are going to hear later about some quite disturbing increases in issues that affect children. Is that also on the increase?

Thank you for that. There are plenty of issues there for the committee and the Government to consider.

Good morning, panel. First, I must apologise, as I have moved into a new room in my office and the light seems to come and go. It is completely outwith my control. If, when I ask questions, I go into shadow, that is what is happening.

I thank the panellists for all their answers so far in what has been a very informative first session on the bill. There are two areas that I want to ask about. I know that you have touched on this a wee bit already, but are you able to expand on your views on the three-month reflection period proposed in the bill for an applicant to confirm whether they wish to proceed with the gender recognition certificate? I have already heard indications of some of your views, but the previous discussion was more about the period before the application. The views on that were given in quite strong terms, but can you talk about the proposed three-month reflection period?

Convener, as I am remote and you are there in person, I am happy for you to decide on the order in which folk respond.