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Chamber and committees

Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 4 May 2021
  6. Session 6: 13 May 2021 to 8 April 2026
  7. Current session: 14 May 2026 to 8 November 2026
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Displaying 214 contributions

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Finance and Public Administration Committee

Decision on Taking Business in Private

Meeting date: 9 September 2026

Alan Brown

Good morning and welcome to the fourth meeting in session 7 of the Finance and Public Administration Committee. I have one apology for today’s meeting, which is from the convener, Claire Haughey, so the witnesses have the joys of me convening the meeting.

The first item of business is to decide whether to take item 3 and future items to consider evidence heard during pre-budget scrutiny 2027-28 in private. Is that agreed?

Members indicated agreement.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Pre-budget Scrutiny 2027-28

Meeting date: 9 September 2026

Alan Brown

Kim Schmulian and Liam McArthur have indicated that they wish to come in. I will let Liam in on the back of that response, and then Kim can ask her questions.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Pre-budget Scrutiny 2027-28

Meeting date: 9 September 2026

Alan Brown

I have something to ask on the back of that, before I bring in Kim Schmulian. As has rightly been pointed out, there will probably be up-front costs associated with reorganisation. Shrinking the workforce will inevitably involve some redundancy payments for some people, which are further up-front costs. Does the fiscal framework make that more difficult? In effect, it is possible to borrow only for reconciliation and budget shifts. As you said, Professor Bell, much spend is demand led, and it is therefore much harder to set aside chunks of money that will bring efficiencies at the back end. Would that be a correct interpretation?

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Pre-budget Scrutiny 2027-28

Meeting date: 9 September 2026

Alan Brown

Of course, with reconciliation, there is a two-year lag before you see any positive or negative effects.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Pre-budget Scrutiny 2027-28

Meeting date: 9 September 2026

Alan Brown

My colleague Pauline Stafford has been very patient. If you do not mind, Pauline, I will ask a couple of follow-on questions and then bring you in. I appreciate your forbearance.

I want to touch on what has just been raised in response to Liam McArthur’s questions on council tax and LBTT. It struck me that we are still using council tax based on 1991 valuations. Many people are now buying houses whose valuations are older than the people moving into them. It has always been a thorny political issue, so there is a question about how we would reach agreement on it, but what would a fairer council tax system look like? How could we get politicians to coalesce around a solution that would fly through Parliament and stimulate economic growth and activity, without complaints about winners and losers?

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Pre-budget Scrutiny 2027-28

Meeting date: 9 September 2026

Alan Brown

We continue our evidence taking for the committee’s pre-budget scrutiny for 2027-28, looking at the affordability and sustainability of Scotland’s tax and spending plans.

I warmly welcome to the meeting our second panel of witnesses: Stephen Boyd, director, Institute for Public Policy Research Scotland; Professor Jim Gallagher, trustee and chair of the audit and risk committee, Royal Society of Edinburgh; and Alison Payne, research director, Enlighten.

You are probably all aware of this already, but I remind you that you do not have to activate your microphones—broadcasting staff will turn them on automatically.

If it is okay with you, we will move straight to questions. I ask Michael Marra to kick off.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Pre-budget Scrutiny 2027-28

Meeting date: 9 September 2026

Alan Brown

I thought it was you they were talking about.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Pre-budget Scrutiny 2027-28

Meeting date: 9 September 2026

Alan Brown

We will just move on and let other colleagues in, as the question has triggered quite a few supplementaries.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Pre-budget Scrutiny 2027-28

Meeting date: 9 September 2026

Alan Brown

I suspect that the supplementaries will provide further answers.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Pre-budget Scrutiny 2027-28

Meeting date: 9 September 2026

Alan Brown

At great risk of going back down the bonds rabbit hole, I have a question for Professor Gallagher.

You said that, in terms of administration costs, a bond scheme could cost the Scottish Government tens of millions of pounds. I am aware that Aberdeen City Council issued something like £370 million-worth of bonds. Has anybody done a review of how much that has cost the council in terms of the administration set-up? There is obviously some learning there. I am not comparing the council to the Scottish Government, but that means that issuing bonds has been done in Scotland before.