Chamber and committees

I assure Katy Clark that this is something that I intend to pursue rigorously for the reasons that she outlined.

Not that long ago, a soot-stained tunic was inextricably linked to the courage and the dedication of our firefighters. Now, we absolutely know that that soot, along with the aerosol vapours, signifies harmful contaminants. The SFRS has already made significant practical changes in procedures, equipment and facilities to reduce firefighter contact with equipment that could contain contaminants that are harmful to health. That important work will continue.

Many years ago—probably about 15 years ago—I was on call in a communal refuge in Ayrshire when we had a fire. I will forever be indebted to the firefighters who came out that day and to their dedication in ensuring that all the women and children were safe. For two years after that, I noticed the soot working its way out of every single nook and cranny in the refuge, so I know that soot is a significant contaminant.

We know about some of the practical changes that have been introduced, including working practices to ensure that firefighting equipment is properly cleaned and stored, in order to reduce contamination. Operational personnel, who might have been exposed to contaminants, are encouraged to shower as quickly as possible on their return to station grounds.

I know that, in some remote and rural areas, we have limited welfare facilities, and procedures have been developed to ensure that firefighters in those areas have appropriate decontamination solutions. That is not ideal, and I am very clear on my intention to engage directly on that urgent matter. A number of steps have also been taken to mitigate risk, including supplying all SFRS appliances and training centres with specialist decontamination wipes and, as Joe FitzPatrick mentioned, the trial of station zoning systems to limit potential spread.

In closing, I again thank Maggie Chapman for the opportunity to discuss the issue and I thank members for their considered contributions from across the chamber.

For my retired firefighter uncle—who, because of his very sunny disposition, was forever known to his watch mates as Dark Cloud—and for all current and future firefighters, members can rest assured that I am keenly focused on the issue, and I look forward to working with the FBU on that at our meeting on 1 February.

I, too, thank Maggie Chapman for raising this important issue and for bringing it to the attention of the wider Parliament today.

I acknowledge the significant work of the Fire Brigades Union in commissioning this important research with the University of Central Lancashire and producing the report that is being discussed today, which I have read closely. I welcome representatives from the Fire Brigades Union and Professor Anna Stec to the gallery today.

The safety, health and wellbeing of all SFRS staff, who work so hard to protect communities in some of the most challenging environments, are of the utmost importance and are a key priority to me. Although the FBU’s DECON campaign, the research and any of its subsequent findings are matters for the Scottish Fire and Rescue Service, as the employer of firefighters in Scotland, it is an issue that I, as the minister with portfolio responsibility, intend to pursue rigorously, given its vital significance.

Through regular meetings with the SFRS board chair and chief officer, I am fully aware of the research. I know that the SFRS has engaged with the work for a number of years and that it met Professor Anna Stec in November 2022 to hear directly about the important research that she was doing and to offer the SFRS continued co-operation on that work.

The SFRS established its management of contaminants working group in 2018, to look, as we have heard, at potential risks and how to support firefighter safety. The group includes representation from the FBU, has links to external specialists and is supported at the highest levels of SFRS staffing. The purpose of the working group is to look at technical, procedural and cultural solutions to mitigate the risks of personnel and any others who might be affected by the actions of SFRS personnel being exposed to contaminants.

As Jamie Greene pointed out, it is very difficult to answer those questions when I have not yet directly engaged with the FBU on that matter, although I will do so in a few weeks’ time. That will be an extra meeting because of the significant importance of the matter. I will come back on those issues, because I recognise their importance.

Opportunities are now being explored as to how the SFRS can work with Professor Stec on the potential positive impacts of policies, training, awareness and preventative measures, as the contaminants group continues to explore steps to minimise risk and improve firefighter safety as a result of the newly published report.

As part of the wider commitment to the welfare of SFRS staff, the service has developed a dedicated cancer awareness and prevention area in its internal i-hub. That is important, given that the increased rate of some types of cancers in some age groups is significantly higher than just 1.5 per cent or 5 per cent. The SFRS has also implemented enhanced cancer-focused screening questions and discussions—about, for example, skin checks and testicular and breast self-checks—during routine medical assessments, and it has introduced a data collection process to record, monitor and report on cancer diagnosis, which includes details of the type of cancer, age, gender, role, duty, system, work and home location. Given the recent research that highlighted a potential increase in the rate of heart attacks and strokes, I am keen to explore that further and will engage with the FBU on its asks surrounding annual health monitoring. I think that that is really important.

In February 2022, the service also signed the Dying to Work charter in order to show continued commitment to the welfare of its staff by protecting the rights at work of those people who face a serious or terminal illness. It is important that they can choose the path that is right for them and their families, without the additional worry of financial uncertainty.

We will continue to carefully consider any specific proposals from the FBU on the potential for any new legislation surrounding compensation and protection. Certain aspects of the health and safety legislation are reserved, so specific proposals would be required, so that they can be assessed against legislative competence. Should we get to that position, I am clear that I will work with the United Kingdom Government on that. My officials will also continue to investigate the current status of occupation recording, and we will look at options and procedures to see whether the proposed changes are feasible.

I know that capital resources are very tight, specifically this year, and we have ensured that the current level will be protected, but I will continue to discuss capital requirements with the SFRS, including looking at a degree of estate rationalisation to ensure that fire stations are located where they are most needed, in order to cover risks in our communities and to allow additional investment in remaining fire stations, while keeping that research at the forefront of my mind.

Thank you, convener, and good morning, members.

This suite of three sets of regulations will transfer all the functions of the valuation appeals committee and certain functions of the Lands Tribunal for Scotland to the Scottish tribunals, and will set out the composition of those tribunals when they are exercising the transferred functions.

The Tribunals (Scotland) Act 2014 created a new simplified statutory framework for tribunals in Scotland by establishing the Scottish tribunals, consisting of the First-tier Tribunal for Scotland and the Upper Tribunal for Scotland. That framework brings the range of existing tribunal jurisdictions together into one system and provides a structure for new jurisdictions coming in.

The valuation appeals committee and some limited functions of the Lands Tribunal for Scotland are due to be transferred to the Scottish tribunals on 1 April 2023. The draft First-tier Tribunal for Scotland (Transfer of Functions of Valuation Appeals Committees) Regulations 2023 provide for the transfer of the existing functions of the valuation appeals committees to the First-tier Tribunal for Scotland local taxation chamber. Existing members of the valuation appeals committees will not transfer to the Scottish tribunals; instead, members have been appointed through a fair and open recruitment process that was undertaken by the Judicial Appointments Board for Scotland.

In addition, the regulations make provision for cases that are in progress on the date of transfer, and they make amendments to primary and secondary legislation that are necessary as a consequence of the transfer of the functions.

The second instrument is the draft Upper Tribunal for Scotland (Transfer of Valuation for Rating Appeal Functions of the Lands Tribunal for Scotland) Regulations 2023. Currently, appeals in relation to non-domestic rates cases can, in certain circumstances, be referred from a valuation appeals committee to the Lands Tribunal for Scotland. Such circumstances have included cases in which the facts were particularly complex, the law was particularly difficult to apply or the property in relation to the valuation that was being appealed straddled two valuation areas. A decision by a valuation appeals committee not to refer a case to the Lands Tribunal for Scotland can also be appealed to the Lands Tribunal for Scotland.

Upon transfer of those matters to the Scottish tribunals, a referral system similar to the current one will be retained, but with qualifying cases being referred to the Upper Tribunal. That will ensure that complex or significant cases can be considered by a body with additional expertise and that the matters are dealt with entirely within the Scottish tribunals system. Parties will also be able to pursue an appeal to the Upper Tribunal if they disagree with a decision of the First-tier Tribunal not to refer such a case.

Finally, the draft First-tier Tribunal for Scotland Local Taxation Chamber and Upper Tribunal for Scotland (Composition) Regulations 2023 specify the number and types of members—for example, judicial, legal or ordinary—of the local taxation chamber of the First-tier Tribunal who are required in relation to the different appeals before that body. Likewise, the regulations set out the membership of the Upper Tribunal when it considers appeals or referrals from the First-tier Tribunal. I understand that the Delegated Powers and Law Reform Committee considered the regulations on 20 December 2022 and raised no points on them.

The functions of another body, the Council Tax Reduction Review Panel, are also due to be transferred to the First-tier Tribunal, to take effect at the same time. That transfer is provided for in a separate set of regulations, which I know will be considered by the committee at a later meeting.

I would be happy to answer any questions, and my officials are also here to help.

Public safety is a central priority for the Scottish Government. In Glasgow, as in the rest of Scotland, we work for a society in which people feel, and are, safe in their communities. To that end, we will continue with our transformative policies, including those outlined in “The Vision for Justice in Scotland” and the programme for government. In doing so, we will engage with a range of partners, including not only the emergency services but wider community safety organisations such as the Scottish Community Safety Network, Crimestoppers and Neighbourhood Watch Scotland, as well as local community safety partnerships.

I know that Maggie Chapman, like Jamie Greene, has a keen interest in the matter—as do I. Both the Scottish Government and the Scottish Fire and Rescue Service set as a high priority protection of the safety and wellbeing of firefighters. I know that the SFRS is taking action across all aspects of operations to reduce exposure to contaminants, which includes investment in new fire appliances and facilities. I am keen to engage with it and the FBU on the issue. Difficult decisions have had to be taken on allocation of the finite capital budget that is available to the Scottish Government but—as I said—we have protected the capital budget for the Scottish Fire and Rescue Service as far as possible.

Jamie Greene raises very important points, of which I am well aware. We have committed to increasing the Scottish Fire and Rescue Service resource budget by £10 million this coming year, and we have protected the capital budget as much as we could.

It is worth noting that, when we merged the former services into one service, that came with a £389 million capital backlog. I will make sure to engage with the service and the Fire Brigades Union in the short term about their priorities for the buildings, fleet and equipment.

As I mentioned, the draft 2023-24 budget includes a £10 million increase to the resource budget for the Scottish Fire and Rescue Service to support service delivery and reform. That will bring the total budget to £362.7 million, which is more than £55.3 million higher than the budget for 2017-18.

Currently, the Scottish Fire and Rescue Service has 357 fire stations, which provide fire and rescue cover to communities across Scotland.