Transport, Infrastructure and Climate Change Committee, 27 Nov 2007

Meeting date: Tuesday, November 27, 2007

Official Report 309KB pdf

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Ferry Links

Members will recall that we discussed having an inquiry into ferry links in Scotland. I refer members to the briefing paper that has been circulated. In light of the minister's letter outlining the Scottish Government's proposal for a review of lifeline services, do members wish to proceed with an inquiry?

I thank the clerks for the paper, which is a good summary of where we are at. It is important that we go ahead with an inquiry. The issues to resolve are the terms of reference and whether the inquiry should be carried out by the whole committee or by a number of its members. On the terms of reference, the key issues that the clerks have identified—routes, frequency, timetables, capacity and integration with other services—make a lot of sense. I flag up the issues of competition and the effects on the economy.

On the issue of capacity, members will be aware of the controversy over the Mallaig to Lochboisdale route. I discussed it with some of the operators and learned that the situation now is that Caledonian MacBrayne has no spare vessel for the route. I am not making excuses or saying whether that is a good or a bad thing. However, there are only two options. The first is to buy another vessel, which has an average lead-in time of five years due to world shortages, particularly in engines. The second option is to lease, but there is a world shortage of leased vessels that would be suitable for the west coast. Without boring the committee, I will say simply that there are issues to do with cargo arrangements and compatibility with harbours. There are huge constraints. Although I would welcome any increase in ferry services under the road equivalent tariff or any other model, the huge issue that we must address is the difficulty in bringing new capacity on to the market. If anyone listening wants to develop a passenger service industry in Scotland, or indeed the United Kingdom, they would be welcome. The lead-in time constraint is a nightmare that we will have to address in any inquiry.

The point that the member for Orkney has made to the committee makes sense. I stress the importance of looking at Shetland, the Western Isles and Arran, which are a good reflection of different sorts of markets. Whether we physically go in a ferry or use videoconferencing is an issue for the committee to sort out. If we are doing a ferry inquiry, it would seem sensible to cross the doors of a ferry at some stage, but I will leave that to the common sense of the committee.

I reinforce what David Stewart said about the importance of including issues of competition. Although we are dealing with a heavily subsidised industry, that industry must remain competitive. It is vital that we consider competition at all levels in the industry, and how that contributes to assessing a fair price for a fair service.

The structure of CalMac, and the amount of money that has been spent on creating that structure as a result of our relations with Europe—good or bad—is an inherited situation. I agree with David Stewart that it would be useful to tackle the issues that he raised. It will be difficult to do them all but, as long as we are not trying to do the whole job, it would be helpful to produce a report that can be compared against the Government review. We should be careful about the issues that we pick out to consider.

I acknowledge what Rob Gibson said about not being able to get through the whole list of things. I hope that we will be able to consider integration with other transport modes as part of the inquiry.

Is the committee agreed that we should proceed with the inquiry?

Members indicated agreement.

Can we agree therefore to call for evidence?

I am told that we have to agree the inquiry's remit first. A paper has been circulated about that. It might include routes, frequency, timetables, capacity, integration with other transport services, and so on. Alex Johnstone raised the issue of competition.

The elephant in the room is obviously RET. It would be daft to do an inquiry and not focus on that, because it is very important to the future.

Are people happy with that?

Members indicated agreement.

Is there anything to add? Are members also happy to invite comments on the other issues that have been laid down in the terms of reference? Do you want me to read them out?

No.

Are members happy with that?

Members indicated agreement.

We should make clear what the inquiry's emphasis will be and make clear that we would prefer to receive written evidence about what we have discussed today rather than about anything else. That will be clear from the Official Report.

Yes. The clerks should refer to the Official Report to be clear about what the emphasis should be in the call for written evidence. The committee agrees to the terms of reference that are outlined in the paper and agrees to call for written evidence. Is that right?

Members indicated agreement.

Should the clerks develop proposals for reporters to visit some areas? It might make sense to have a reporter to link into the inquiry. Is that agreed?

Members indicated agreement.

The idea has been discussed that the committee, or part of it, should take some time to go to Orkney, Shetland, the Western Isles or Arran. We should at least have a couple of meetings outside the Parliament and go on a ferry.

I would love to take evidence on a ferry.

I do not know how that would work logistically, but it is a good idea. We should certainly go to the islands and listen to people's experiences. All of this is laid out in the paper. Are members happy with that approach?

Members indicated agreement.

I understand that we have to seek the approval of the Conveners Group for any expenditure associated with the proposed visits. Are we agreed that we should go forward with that?

Members indicated agreement.

The final item on my list is to agree suitable locations for external committee meetings. Alex Johnstone suggested a ferry.

Not the Shetland service, please. It takes 12 hours.

The clerks can make suggestions in a further paper and we can discuss them later. Are people happy with that?

To back up Rob Gibson's point, if we get to Shetland by some other means, there is always an interisland ferry service, which would be a lot more manageable logistically.

Yes. Can we do it when the water is slightly calmer, not in January or February?

"Heel ya ho boys".

Exactly. I do not think I could even sing then.

Are members agreed?

Members indicated agreement.

Thank you.

Meeting closed at 16:54.