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Chamber and committees

European and External Relations Committee, 09 Sep 2003

Meeting date: Tuesday, September 9, 2003


Contents


Promoting Scotland Worldwide Inquiry

The Convener:

We move on to our inquiry into external relations. The session with the minister was not part of our inquiry, which we have not yet started, but it might have given us some ideas about the subjects that we want to address. At our meeting on 24 June, we agreed that the inquiry would be a major inquiry and that we would conduct it very soon. We will examine the Executive's strategy for external relations and its efforts to promote Scotland world wide. The inquiry will be wide-ranging, so we will have to limit it to a number of key areas in order to keep it focused.

I will briefly go over the external relations matters that the background paper, which members should have read, suggests we concentrate on. The five key areas are: the Executive's general strategy; the Executive's external links with other nations and regions; input into EU decision-making processes; the Executive's efforts to promote Scotland world wide; and a review of tartan day. We should take into account the fact that our predecessor committee might have dealt with some of those issues, especially input into EU decision-making networks, although I do not think that we would want to exclude that from the forthcoming inquiry.

We should agree the terms of reference for the inquiry, because that will allow the clerks to issue a call for written evidence, which will enable us to begin the inquiry. I will go round the table for comments on the paper.

Irene Oldfather:

The Parliament's draft external relations strategy was circulated to us in June. From reading that document in tandem with the remit, it seems that we will miss out a whole chunk of external relations strategy. There are many inward and outward visits that involve the Presiding Officer and the committee. Paragraph 25 of the "Evaluation of the Scottish Parliament's External Liaison" says:

"At the SPCB's request, a fuller evaluation of the Parliament's experience of Tartan Day is underway."

I am slightly concerned that we might overlap with work on tartan day that is on-going in the Parliament's external liaison unit. We want the Executive and the committee to adopt a joined-up approach, so perhaps we should examine the Parliament's external relations strategy in relation to the unit at the Executive.

You touch on some interesting points, but our remit, which we agreed in June, is to scrutinise the Scottish Executive's external relations strategy. The inquiry must concentrate on that strategy and I do not want to muddy the waters.

Mr Raffan:

I agree strongly with Irene Oldfather, because our small external liaison unit, which does an admirable job with few people, is often linked into what the Executive does, in the sense that its agenda is dictated by the people who come to visit the Executive. That is not true in every case, but a large part of its work is dictated by the Executive. I have additional points to make, but Irene may not have finished, and I do not want to cut her off in midstream.

My other point is about the inquiry that is already under way on tartan day. Has the report of that inquiry been produced? At what stage is it? Why would we hold such an inquiry as well?

The Convener:

The existing inquiry into tartan day by the parliamentary authorities is about Parliament's, rather than the Executive's, relationship with tartan day. Our job is to scrutinise the Executive, not Parliament. That does not prevent us from incorporating into our inquiry the information that is out there, whether it is gathered by the Parliament or anyone else, but our job is to scrutinise the Executive's external relations activities, which is what we agreed to do in June. Keith, do you want to come back in?

Mr Raffan:

I have some other points to make, if I may. First, I hope that when we discuss the strategy we address resources, because the two are linked. The minister emphasised continually the point about having to concentrate on key objectives and being selective. To my mind, the Executive seems to work with an extremely small staff.

Secondly, our list of proposed witnesses who will provide written evidence is somewhat parochial—we should reach out further. For example, we should go to the Welsh and find out what they are about, in particular with regard to when they stole a march on us back in the 1980s and entered into the agreement with the motor regions, rather than entering into bilateral agreements, which we have done. We need to see what others are doing, and not just the Irish and the Welsh. We should think about approaching some of the Länder, or Catalonia, to see what they do. We have to widen the range of people from whom we are taking written evidence to find out how others—not just within the UK, but outside it—handle the subject. They might be a lot more imaginative and innovative than we are.

My third point follows the one that I made to the minister about the Commonwealth, which is part of the issue, given Scotland's long historic links with Commonwealth countries. We should take evidence from the Commonwealth Secretariat. We need to work out what is and is not a priority, and what should and should not be a focus. We have to rule things in or rule them out.

The Convener:

Every committee member is at liberty to send an e-mail to the clerks, adding to the list of people who should be invited to give written evidence. There is no limit to who we can ask for written evidence in the first instance. Are there any other comments?

Mr Home Robertson:

I simply want to add to what Irene Oldfather and Keith Raffan said about the need to have regard to what the Parliament is doing in this field. It would be ridiculous if there was not proper co-ordination between the Executive's external relations strategy and that of the Parliament. I take your point, convener, that the remit of the committee is to scrutinise the work of the Executive, as distinct from the Parliament, but it would be appropriate to examine the work of the Parliament. In fact, we have already had a paper from the clerk on the Parliament's external relations work. It is important that the Presiding Officer and the Scottish Parliamentary Corporate Body are properly co-ordinated with the Executive's external relations work. Although examination of the Parliament's external relations work could not go in the title of the inquiry, it should be implicit that that will be part of our line of questioning.

The Convener:

That is a perfectly fair comment. The issue of the Parliament and the Executive having the same agenda and co-ordinating their activities is perfectly genuine. I do not doubt that that will be built into the inquiry. The point is that the specific remit is to scrutinise the Executive's strategy.

Dennis Canavan:

I hope that our inquiry will cover certain aspects that are referred to in the paper. Naturally, external relations with European Union and other European countries are high on the Executive's list of priorities.

The document also makes specific reference to protocols with a number of regions in the European Union, namely Catalonia, Tuscany, North Rhine-Westphalia and Bavaria. We should consider those protocols in detail and find out how they are developing. Are they simply bits of paper? How are they working out in practice? Bearing in mind what the minister said earlier about external relations covering relations with the rest of the UK, we should consider the relationships between the Scottish Executive and the Welsh Administration, the Northern Ireland Administration and the Government of the Republic of Ireland. In terms of bilateral relations, Scottish-American relations figure high in the Executive's priorities. I am not sure whether tartan day is the best expression of Scottish-American relations, but I have a fairly open mind at this stage. We should consider that and other aspects, such as trading opportunities between Scotland and America, and between Scotland and other countries throughout the world.

Lots of members are nodding their heads.

Mr Morrison:

As others have said, we need to be clear about what the Scottish Executive and the Parliament do—I am sure that the Presiding Officer would be delighted to assist us in that. Dennis Canavan mentions the other regions, and the agreements and the memorandums of understanding, or whatever the proper term is, in relation to the other regions. Before we can recommend to the Executive anything on the accession countries, it is essential that we know what the current members are about, that we understand them fully and that we appreciate what the outcomes are. That merits further examination.

Gordon Jackson (Glasgow Govan) (Lab):

The document and the whole approach are good; when I first read the document I was quite up for it. I agree with other members' comments, in particular about the Parliament's strategy having to be included, although I accept the convener's point on that matter.

However, I wondered about the scale of the job that we are taking on, which strikes me as being very big. I have been listening to members say that they want to add various things to the inquiry—Dennis Canavan had a lot of perfectly good ideas—but I caution that we will eventually have to draw a line under the subject because it is the sort of inquiry that would, like Topsy, continue to grow. No matter how much time we gave it there would always be something else that someone would want to do. We will need to be disciplined in deciding how far we will go because not everything that everybody wants will be done. It would be impossible to do that. The European Parliament is on the list of witnesses—can I assume from that that we intend to take evidence from MEPs?

There is no reason why we should not.

That would probably be worth while. As we are interested in knowing how well we are doing quoad the European Parliament, it would be good to hear the view from MEPs' side.

The Convener:

Those points are very fair. We need initially a relatively broad outline but, if members agree, we will focus on those five areas. It should become easier for the committee to focus as the written evidence comes in. Gordon Jackson is right—the inquiry could grow lots of arms and legs.

It might never end.

Irene Oldfather:

It would be helpful if we could have early sight of the external liaison unit's review of tartan day. Although the paper that we have was circulated in June, it is dated February 2003. It sets us the objective of ensuring that tartan day represents value for money. Our objective is to assess the merits of tartan day and its potential; however, rather than reinvent the wheel, early sight of that paper might allow us to be more focused, to be clear about our objectives and not to go over the same ground.

Stephen Imrie (Clerk):

It might help members to know that the review of tartan day is not complete—at least in so far as the Parliament is involved. I discussed with colleagues in the external liaison unit the draft terms of reference so that I could get an idea of where the Parliament fits into the process. I am happy to make inquiries on behalf of members about the tartan day review and to incorporate information into the committee's inquiry in a way that is suitable.

Mr Raffan:

I hope that tartan day will not loom too large. I accept what Irene Oldfather says.

Dennis Canavan raised the important point that trade is an important part of the strategy. I tried to make that point earlier. We must examine certain issues. We should consider the example of Wales. We all know about outsourcing to India and it is interesting that three Indian companies announced last week that they were establishing bases in Wales. The Welsh have also established a strong connection with a cluster of Japanese companies. We do not want to get bogged down in inward investment, but those kinds of developments are relevant to the inquiry.

The Convener:

Can I take it from members' comments that they are in broad agreement with the five areas that have been chosen, that they are happy to sign off the title and that we can incorporate the emphases that members have placed on the various issues today? That will enable the clerks to open the inquiry by inviting written evidence; we can come back to the matter in the near future. Is the committee happy to proceed on that basis?

Members indicated agreement.