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Chamber and committees

Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 4 May 2021
  6. Current session: 13 May 2021 to 5 November 2025
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Displaying 1001 contributions

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Finance and Public Administration Committee

Subordinate Legislation

Meeting date: 7 March 2023

Daniel Johnson

Exactly so.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Subordinate Legislation

Meeting date: 7 March 2023

Daniel Johnson

How much has been spent in total to date? You have given me the projected figure and the figure that is being spent this year. What is the total figure that has been spent to date on the two vessels?

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Subordinate Legislation

Meeting date: 7 March 2023

Daniel Johnson

How much has actually been spent or will have been spent by the end of this budget year?

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Subordinate Legislation

Meeting date: 7 March 2023

Daniel Johnson

I will start at a pretty granular level. With regard to annex A, I am looking at the figures in table 1.2. You quoted the budget bill figures, minister. I am interested in the health line. I am slightly confused about the figure of 18,075.2 that you quoted from the first column of table 1.2. When I look at the budget bill as passed, I see that the figure in that line is 18,039,849,000. I am trying to understand the discrepancy there. What is the basis of that figure in the first column of table 1.2? It is not a huge difference but, at the same time, I think that we all want to be accurate.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Subordinate Legislation

Meeting date: 7 March 2023

Daniel Johnson

Yes. I am looking at table 1.2 in the papers with which we have been provided.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Subordinate Legislation

Meeting date: 7 March 2023

Daniel Johnson

Right—okay. That is a useful clarification. I misunderstood—I thought that we were using what was passed as the baseline.

Looking at the figure more broadly, I understand that, in terms of the narrative, the latest budget revision adds £427.4 million. Again, however, when I look at the aggregate figure as passed, it actually shows—as the convener pointed out—almost £80 million less.

If we look at the total additions and subtractions, given that there is some £135 million of resource being added to those budget lines, that would imply that around £200 million is coming out of other budget lines in health. Is that correct? If so, what are those things?

Again, in line with some of the convener’s questions, given the pressures—to which you rightly alluded, minister, and which we all understand—I think that people might be surprised that we are actually going to be spending less on health and social care in this budget year, rather than more, in comparison with what was originally budgeted for. What was the summary-level explanation for that lower-than-expected expenditure in that budget area?

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Subordinate Legislation

Meeting date: 7 March 2023

Daniel Johnson

Are we spending less on front-line health provision? That is the fundamental question. Is it all explained by that transfer? What are the implications in particular for the regional health boards and other front-line provision in the health budget? That is the fundamental question that I am asking. Are those figures in line with the budget, or are they up or down?

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Subordinate Legislation

Meeting date: 7 March 2023

Daniel Johnson

Is that the projected cost to complete them, or is that the spend to date?

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Subordinate Legislation

Meeting date: 7 March 2023

Daniel Johnson

That would be helpful.

As I look at all these areas, I am thinking about the biggest concern that people have about their domestic budgets, which is heating bills. There are reductions to the net zero budget lines, which, ultimately, provide funding for things such as insulation and retrofitting. People might be surprised that there is a lack of demand for those things. I do not dispute that that is the case, but, if we look at the programmes that those budget lines fund, we see that expenditure on them and demand for them have been on the decline year on year since they were launched. If there is a lack of demand for those programmes, does that not raise the question whether the programmes have been designed correctly? There should surely be increasing demand. Judging by my mailbag, my constituents are hugely concerned about how they can insulate their homes and control their heating bills in future years. Is there an issue around delivery or the design of the funds if there is a lack of demand for the programmes?

10:30  

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Subordinate Legislation

Meeting date: 7 March 2023

Daniel Johnson

I wish to clarify one point. Is it that the level of applications for the funds has declined, or is it that the level of approvals has fallen?