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Chamber and committees

Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 4 May 2021
  6. Current session: 13 May 2021 to 5 November 2025
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Displaying 1001 contributions

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Finance and Public Administration Committee

Circular Economy (Scotland) Bill: Financial Memorandum

Meeting date: 7 November 2023

Daniel Johnson

No, I am not.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Subordinate Legislation

Meeting date: 7 November 2023

Daniel Johnson

I have been here before. [Laughter.]

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Circular Economy (Scotland) Bill: Financial Memorandum

Meeting date: 7 November 2023

Daniel Johnson

I am slightly nervous, given the billing that I got at the beginning, when you described me as a “stalwart”, convener. I feel that I have something to live up to.

May I clarify a couple of points based on answers that have already been given this morning? Is it correct to say, first, that we do not know what the full costs of the bill will be, because provisions are subject to co-design, and, secondly, that we do not have a detailed co-design process or timetable in place? Are both correct?

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Circular Economy (Scotland) Bill: Financial Memorandum

Meeting date: 7 November 2023

Daniel Johnson

I mean across the full scope of the bill. We do not know the full costs that will derive from the bill, because provisions are subject to co-design.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Circular Economy (Scotland) Bill: Financial Memorandum

Meeting date: 7 November 2023

Daniel Johnson

On the narrow question, we do not, because we cannot, yet know the full cost.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Circular Economy (Scotland) Bill: Financial Memorandum

Meeting date: 7 November 2023

Daniel Johnson

Can you clarify that we also do not know the co-design process that will be used and, therefore, the total cost of that? Is it correct that that process has not been set out yet?

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Circular Economy (Scotland) Bill: Financial Memorandum

Meeting date: 7 November 2023

Daniel Johnson

The plans for how that design process works are not yet in the public domain. Is that correct?

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Circular Economy (Scotland) Bill: Financial Memorandum

Meeting date: 7 November 2023

Daniel Johnson

In a number of your answers, minister, you have said that the bill will enable the Parliament to look at the detail when the secondary legislation comes forward. Do you acknowledge that secondary legislation, by its very nature, is a process by which the Parliament delegates its authority and powers to ministers? Furthermore, the secondary legislation process does not afford the same ability to scrutinise and, critically, amend legislation as the primary legislation process does. Do you acknowledge that secondary legislation gives the Parliament less, rather than more, ability to scrutinise?

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Circular Economy (Scotland) Bill: Financial Memorandum

Meeting date: 7 November 2023

Daniel Johnson

Minister, with all due respect, you are here representing the Government, and it is for the Parliament to decide whether it will have a sufficient level of power. You are conflating Parliament and Government powers. On the nimbleness, I accept that secondary legislation might well enable the Scottish Government to be more nimble, but it does not necessarily enable the Parliament to be more nimble because the Parliament, by definition of that nimbleness, has less ability to scrutinise. Indeed, part of the reason why primary legislation takes more time is that we have more ability and a greater length of time to look at the detail. We do not have that with secondary legislation because, in your words, it is more nimble. However, it is more nimble for the Government. Is that not correct?

Meeting of the Commission

Audit Scotland Annual Report and Accounts for the year to 31 March 2023 and Auditor’s Report on the Accounts

Meeting date: 28 June 2023

Daniel Johnson

Perfect. Thank you.