Chamber and committees

You raise two really important points, particularly the one about venison. I will touch on one scheme. We have worked with the Soil Association, which provides the food for life served here scheme, which 16 Scottish local authorities have signed up to. The Soil Association is working closely with Argyll and Bute Council and Wild Jura to get a supply of venison into the school estate. That is really positive and I hope that other areas can learn from it. The scheme is not only about schools and local authorities. It has been looking at the care sector and universities and is branching out to support local supply chains, because we know the benefits that come from doing so.

It is important to highlight measures that will be taken forward through the Natural Environment (Scotland) Bill. Parliament has had extensive discussion of and questions about community larders for venison. We have that healthy source of protein right on our doorstep and must ensure that more people in Scotland have access to it.

You asked about support for the wider supply chain, which is absolutely critical. If we want to have strong local supply chains we must ensure that the infrastructure for those is there. We have a small producers pilot scheme at the moment. Farmers and crofters in some of our most rural areas are particularly dependent on smaller abattoirs. We have provided funding for Dingwall, Mull, the mart in Orkney and Shetland to try to better co-ordinate those services so that they are fully utilised and well supported, because we know that supporting the work of the wider supply chain is hugely important, as you have rightly highlighted.

You are absolutely right: that is critical. If there is a sense that there is not enough in relation to that, we are more than happy to consider it. That is why the views on that are so important, especially if it is felt that they could be better reflected.

One thing that that highlights to me is the role of the specified functions and descriptions that we have set out in the legislation. The fact that ministers have to have regard to the plan when we are exercising specific functions and following policy is really important. The policy is still to be brought forward by regulation, so the detail is not there just yet. Taking breastfeeding as an example, when we are developing plans or strategies, we have to consider the good food nation plan and delivery of the outcomes in relation to that, as it is how we will deliver on what we have set out in the plan and the legislation. I am more than happy to consider whether that needs to be more clearly drawn out.

They could also feature as part of the outcomes for the local authority plans when those are being developed. We want to roll out free school meal provision, but we do not have the finances to be able to roll that out fully at the moment, which is why it is being rolled out in the phases that have been proposed. Currently, the indicators that we have in the plan consider free school meal uptake, but we must consider how that would work in relation to the local authority plans that will be developed and think about the potential outcomes in that regard. Any extra data that we could gather from that that would then inform the overall national outcomes and indicators would be helpful.

Do you mean how do we define it in relation to the one health approach? I know that, in some of the evidence, people felt that there was not a focus on the one health approach in the plan, but I think that what we have set out in the plan aims to ultimately deliver on what that is, which involves animal health and welfare, a healthy environment and our overall health and wellbeing.

I feel that what we have articulated in the plan is probably in the right area but, again, if you have any particular recommendations or suggestions for things that we should be looking at, I am happy to hear them.

Again, if you feel that that is not properly articulated, I am happy to hear suggestions from the committee. I completely appreciate the points that you have raised about the importance of having a healthy balanced diet and, with regard to what that looks like, we point to the “Eatwell Guide”.

FSS has also done a lot of work in this area, which highlights that some people are consuming more than the recommended red meat intake while younger people in particular are not getting enough of the nutrients that they need. Again, we need to promote the healthy balanced diet that we all want people to have.

Yes; that is a good point. That is why we have supported what I think is called extra time—I stand to be corrected if that is wrong—which is exactly about what you have said about drawing people into an activity and providing food while they are there. We have provided around £5.5 million to the breakfast clubs to support exactly that. We have also extended that and provided a further £3 million funding to extend the reach of breakfast clubs to about 20,000 more young people.

Of course, as we were saying when we were talking about free school meals, rolling that out universally comes at a huge financial cost, so targeting it and rolling it out in the way that we have, through free school meals, breakfast clubs, and activity-related food provision, is really important. What you have said is absolutely right.

Absolutely.

I completely understand the concerns around the matter, which has been raised directly with us and has come through the evidence that the committee has received as well. However, as I understand it, there are issues with evidence gaps—I believe that the Scientific Advisory Council on Nutrition will undertake another review next year. I think that the issue is that some of the definitions and classifications of ultra-processed foods do not differentiate between white bread and wholemeal bread or account for how you cater for people with allergens who are looking for other alternative food products, which are then more processed. As far as I understand it, there are issues with classifications in the evidence. However, the fact that UPFs might not be in this iteration of the plan does not mean that they would not feature in future iterations of it once that evidence becomes available.

The issue of how we can better support local producers through public procurement is one that we have discussed in the chamber a number of times, and the theme of procurement came through strongly in the evidence that we heard when the Good Food Nation (Scotland) Bill was being considered. We highlight that aspect in the plan, and a number of pieces of work are under way. We must ensure that we are working within international regulations and our own domestic regulations, but we must do so with a view to ensuring that we help SMEs and smaller producers to access some of the opportunities that are available.

We are trying to do that through a number of initiatives, and there is a positive trajectory in the number of small and medium enterprises that are getting contracts and the amount that is being spent on those. There is also the supplier development programme. Through those initiatives, we are working with such businesses to ensure that they are in a position in which they feel that they can bid for some of the opportunities that are available, as well as highlighting what can be done in procurement to break things down into smaller lots and smaller geographic areas to make it easier for smaller producers to access the process.

I do not know whether Jo Mitchell has anything to add.

Yes, we are very much alive to that and, indeed, concerns about certain issues that have recently come up in that respect. In those cases of people losing contracts that they had, I would just point out that they were able to be awarded those contracts in the first place. Through our work on public procurement, there is the ability at the moment to help local suppliers and producers, and I hope that, when we have finalised our national plan, local authorities and health boards will, in the work that they take forward, have a strong focus on these things to ensure that they continue in the direction that we all want with the establishment of strong, local, resilient supply chains.