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Chamber and committees

Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 5 May 2021
  6. Current session: 12 May 2021 to 10 June 2025
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Displaying 1885 contributions

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Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee

Environmental Governance

Meeting date: 5 March 2024

Monica Lennon

A lot has been said already, particularly in Dr Dixon’s helpful opening remarks, but I will stick with the issue of Aarhus compliance. ESS has said:

“In principle, a court, tribunal or other judicial measures ... would help support better access to environmental justice for Scotland”.

Can you give examples of what “other judicial measures” could mean?

Planning has been mentioned a couple of times. In a previous session of Parliament, Graham Simpson and I were on the Local Government and Communities Committee, which looked at the Planning (Scotland) Bill and the opportunities that existed to make the process more democratic, for example by having rights of appeal. You said that a merits-based review is important when it comes to Aarhus compliance, but developers have that right now through the planning appeals process, while communities and—to use that horrible phrase—third parties do not.

What is meant by “other judicial measures”? Could we look at tweaking the planning system to get more equality around appeals to help with access to environmental justice?

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee

Environmental Governance

Meeting date: 5 March 2024

Monica Lennon

Do you agree with Scottish Environment LINK and others that there needs to be an independent review of the case for an environmental court or tribunal?

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee

Environmental Governance

Meeting date: 5 March 2024

Monica Lennon

On that, your annual report mentioned there being an advisory panel on international developments. Has there been progress on that?

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee

Environmental Governance

Meeting date: 5 March 2024

Monica Lennon

That is helpful. I do not know whether Dr Dixon wants to add anything.

I was struck by a passage in the same press release, which said:

“MEPs also ensured that member states will organise specialised training for police, judges and prosecutors, prepare national strategies and organise awareness-raising campaigns to fight environmental crime.”

That seems very much linked to our earlier discussion of environmental governance and access to justice. Are you aware of similar commitments to embed training and upskilling of people who are on the front line and who are trying to do those difficult jobs at the moment? Dr Dixon, have you had any involvement in that?

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee

Subordinate Legislation

Meeting date: 5 March 2024

Monica Lennon

Welcome, minister, and congratulations on your appointment.

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee

Subordinate Legislation

Meeting date: 5 March 2024

Monica Lennon

So, that is the procedure. What are the likely consequences? Could they involve a bus operator saying that it is no longer viable to provide a certain route or service? Is that what we are talking about?

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee

Subordinate Legislation

Meeting date: 5 March 2024

Monica Lennon

Okay. You sound confident. Can we see the modelling after this meeting? Can it be shared with the committee?

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee

Subordinate Legislation

Meeting date: 5 March 2024

Monica Lennon

Okay.

We have talked a lot today about the cap on the older and disabled persons scheme, and the reasons for it. We look forward to seeing some of the homework and modelling behind that. There has been a lot of discussion, both in Parliament and outside Parliament, about the ageing population and some of the challenges that we have with demographics. In your role with buses, are you protective of the current age limit, or do you think that it could be raised? Have you been involved in discussing that with officials or colleagues? Are you able to give any reassurance today that the qualifying age for the older persons bus pass will not be raised as long as you are connectivity minister?

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee

Subordinate Legislation

Meeting date: 5 March 2024

Monica Lennon

So, that is not a red line for you?

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee

Subordinate Legislation

Meeting date: 5 March 2024

Monica Lennon

It has been a really good session. Thank you, minister, for your responses. I will support the motion, but I have a couple of points to make that I hope will be kept in mind.

We need to ensure that some flexibility is built in, particularly around the young persons travel scheme, because there are challenges not just in Central Scotland but across the country around school transport. It is about making sure that different systems can work together.

I am reassured to hear about the engagement with bus operators and with business, but I reiterate the point about the wider engagement that is needed with our communities. Those who already use the bus and those who want to use the bus face many barriers. We have talked before in the committee about bus deserts, which are areas across Scotland where people just cannot get a bus any longer, and that is a worry.

I appreciate the commitments that the minister has made today, particularly on engagement with MSPs such as me who have challenges in our areas at the moment. I will support the motion.