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Chamber and committees

Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 5 May 2021
  6. Current session: 12 May 2021 to 9 May 2025
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Displaying 1502 contributions

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Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee

National Planning Framework (NPF4)

Meeting date: 8 February 2022

Monica Lennon

Before I ask my question, I note that Mark Ruskell referred to a moratorium on new incinerators. My understanding is that ministers have not confirmed a moratorium but have asked planning authorities to notify them of any new applications and decisions for energy-from-waste developments. Perhaps we could get clarification on that later for the Official Report.

It is good that we are discussing the role of incineration and energy from waste in the waste hierarchy. From 2011 to 2020, the total quantity of waste that was incinerated in Scotland increased by more than 200 per cent, so it is clearly an issue that is worth exploring today.

If we do not see a permanent ban or moratorium on new energy-from-waste developments, what should we see in NPF4 in relation to their future role, bearing in mind possible climate and nature impacts? We have already heard from Iain Gulland that NPF4 is missing the point on the circular economy so there is a bigger picture. I am interested to hear views from the witnesses, starting with Iain, given that I have mentioned him.

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee

National Planning Framework (NPF4)

Meeting date: 8 February 2022

Monica Lennon

If you want to add something, please go ahead.

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee

National Planning Framework (NPF4)

Meeting date: 8 February 2022

Monica Lennon

I think that Rosie Simpson wants to respond.

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee

National Planning Framework (NPF4)

Meeting date: 8 February 2022

Monica Lennon

I am glad that you got your point on the record.

What is Scottish Environment LINK’s perspective on the climate and nature impacts of incinerators or large-scale energy-from-waste developments? What are its views on the point about clarity and how NPF4 aligns with other reviews?

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee

National Planning Framework (NPF4)

Meeting date: 8 February 2022

Monica Lennon

While we are chatting, I note that we do not yet have the circular economy bill in place. Does anyone have a view on the importance of that bill being introduced so that everyone involved in making planning decisions knows that the issues are important? Iain has popped up on my screen.

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee

National Planning Framework (NPF4)

Meeting date: 8 February 2022

Monica Lennon

I am glad that you mentioned policy 20 in NPF4. I am looking at the part that says:

“Development proposals which involve the recovery of energy from waste should only be supported where ... it is consistent with climate change mitigation targets and in line with circular economy principles; and ... should supply a decarbonisation strategy aligned with Scottish Government decarbonisation goals and be refused where the strategy is insufficient”.

I am a former town planner and I find that difficult to navigate. We have heard about the shortage of planners and issues around skills. You have mentioned part of policy 20 and I have read out another part. Are we creating mixed messages?

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee

Subordinate Legislation

Meeting date: 8 February 2022

Monica Lennon

Good afternoon, minister, and congratulations on your new role.

What type of conditions are likely to be applied to licences? Can you give some examples? How would compliance with conditions be monitored and resourced?

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee

Subordinate Legislation

Meeting date: 8 February 2022

Monica Lennon

I want to clarify my question, minister, as I think that you answered a different question. I am sorry if I was not clear. I am thinking about what happens once a licence has been approved. It is a bit like when planning consent is given and conditions are set. Do we know, from learning elsewhere, what conditions typically look like and how compliance is monitored—[Interruption.]

I am sorry: my dog is barking.

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee

Subordinate Legislation

Meeting date: 8 February 2022

Monica Lennon

Yes.

I am looking for examples of what conditions might look like. I know that that is a matter for the local authority, but do we know, from lessons elsewhere—such as Nottingham—what conditions tend to look like?

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee

National Planning Framework (NPF4)

Meeting date: 8 February 2022

Monica Lennon

That is helpful.

My next question is for Chiquita Elvin, Paul White and David Hunter. Mark Ruskell covered the need to align different strategies. On that theme, the Scottish Government’s trunk roads investment programme includes planned expenditure of more than £7 billion, but it is not mentioned in the draft NPF4. Does that support the spatial principles and the priorities that are set out in the draft NPF4? If not, how could the two be brought into alignment?

Chiquita Elvin is on my screen, so I will come to her first.