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Displaying 3919 contributions
Public Audit Committee
Meeting date: 5 November 2025
Richard Leonard
Thank you. I note that one of your recommendations calls on the Scottish Government, with support from The Promise Scotland, to complete within the next six months—so there is an urgency to this—work to
“review and identify opportunities to streamline the remit, status, and expected impact of governance groups, boards and forums linked to The Promise”,
so you have clearly identified that as requiring urgent attention.
Public Audit Committee
Meeting date: 5 November 2025
Richard Leonard
I welcome everybody back to this morning’s meeting of the Public Audit Committee. I am very pleased to say that agenda item 3 is further consideration of the Auditor General’s report on adult disability payment. I am particularly pleased to welcome to the committee Edel Harris, who is the former chair of the independent review of adult disability payment. Thank you for joining us—it is greatly appreciated.
We have some questions to put to you, but, before we get to those, I invite you to make a short opening statement to get us under way.
Public Audit Committee
Meeting date: 5 November 2025
Richard Leonard
Graham Simpson will come in with some questions on that area shortly. I have one more question to ask before I bring him in—it is on a related area, but it looks at it from a slightly different angle.
In paragraph 20 of the report, you make the point that many of The Promise Scotland’s aims are to support longer-term change. On the other hand, the nature of these things is that there are often short-term projects and short-term imperatives. You identify that as a risk. The question that we, as the Public Audit Committee, have is, how is that risk being managed? Do you think that there is a danger of some of those longer-term structural changes, which are intended to be delivered by, at the outside, 2030, which is less than five years away, may be blown off course by shorter-term imperatives?
Public Audit Committee
Meeting date: 5 November 2025
Richard Leonard
Thank you very much. I will now turn to Joe FitzPatrick to put some questions to you.
Public Audit Committee
Meeting date: 5 November 2025
Richard Leonard
Thank you. I have a couple of final questions. The first question relates to something that you were speaking to Graham Simpson about, not in the last set of questions but in the ones before that. An argument has been paraded in Scotland that the reforms or even the removal of personal independence payment in England and Wales have had no effect in Scotland because we have adult disability payment. However, as you have explained, reforms to PIP have implications for Scotland because of the passporting issue that you have identified, the Barnett consequentials that would potentially result from such reforms and the way in which the fiscal framework operates, which means, in other words, that if the benefit bill in Scotland goes up, the financial settlement that comes through the formula goes down. Can you confirm your view that there is a direct relationship between what happens with the Timms review and what the consequences will be for recipients of adult disability payment in Scotland?
Public Audit Committee
Meeting date: 29 October 2025
Richard Leonard
Okay. I can say from my time as convener of this committee that it has not always been the case that timescales have been set by Audit Scotland or the Accounts Commission in reports. However, it has, I think, become practice to try to give a bit more of an impetus to acceptance and implementation of the recommendations. That is why the report is set out in the way that it is.
The report certainly uncovers some areas where there is a certain level of dissatisfaction, if not concern. Indeed, the very first recommendation talks about “gaps” and a lack of clarity over “roles and responsibilities”. How would you address that criticism?
Public Audit Committee
Meeting date: 29 October 2025
Richard Leonard
There have been gaps in cycle 1, presumably.
Public Audit Committee
Meeting date: 29 October 2025
Richard Leonard
We will return to those themes as we go through the morning.
I have one other question, which I think is largely for you to answer, Mr Brannen. You have told us already that things are well under way and that, although the recommendations and timescales might be quite challenging, the recommendations are already being addressed, and you accept them all.
We took evidence from the Auditor General and other people from Audit Scotland on 17 September—which is not that long ago—as well as from Andrew Burns from the Accounts Commission. As was also captured in the report, Mr Burns said that, while there is now a strategy, which is
“a step in the right direction ... there is not an implementation plan.”—[Official Report, Public Audit Committee, 17 September 2025; c 40.]
Why is that?
Public Audit Committee
Meeting date: 29 October 2025
Richard Leonard
The recommendation is that you will publish that implementation plan. Are you prepared to go on the record to say that you will do that?
Public Audit Committee
Meeting date: 29 October 2025
Richard Leonard
Thank you. That is very helpful.
I will now bring in Graham Simpson to put questions to you.