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Chamber and committees

Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 5 May 2021
  6. Current session: 12 May 2021 to 7 July 2025
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Displaying 3298 contributions

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Public Audit Committee

Section 22 Report: “The 2023/24 audit of the Water Industry Commission for Scotland”

Meeting date: 19 February 2025

Richard Leonard

Of course.

Public Audit Committee

Section 22 Report: “The 2023/24 audit of the Water Industry Commission for Scotland”

Meeting date: 19 February 2025

Richard Leonard

Please go ahead.

Public Audit Committee

Section 22 Report: “The 2023/24 audit of the Water Industry Commission for Scotland”

Meeting date: 19 February 2025

Richard Leonard

Okay, thanks. As I mentioned, the deputy convener has a final question. It might invite a yes or no answer.

Public Audit Committee

Decision on Taking Business in Private

Meeting date: 19 February 2025

Richard Leonard

Good morning, and welcome to the sixth meeting in 2025 of the Public Audit Committee. We have apologies this morning from committee member Stuart McMillan.

Under agenda item 1, does the committee agree to take agenda items 4, 5, 6 and 7 in private this morning?

Members indicated agreement.

Public Audit Committee

“Administration of Scottish income tax 2023/24”

Meeting date: 19 February 2025

Richard Leonard

Agenda item 2 is consideration of the Auditor General for Scotland’s report, “Administration of Scottish income tax 2023/24”. I am very pleased to welcome our witnesses this morning. We are joined by the Auditor General, Stephen Boyle. Alongside the Auditor General are Carole Grant, an audit director, and Richard Robinson, a senior manager, both from Audit Scotland. I am also very pleased to welcome once again to the Public Audit Committee Gareth Davies, who is the Comptroller and Auditor General at the National Audit Office. Alongside Mr Davies is Darren Stewart, who is His Majesty’s Revenue and Customs financial audit director at the National Audit Office.

I think that you are aware that we are quite tight for time this morning. We have some important areas of ground that we want to cover with you, so if you are able to make your answers concise, that would be helpful—and I have leant on the committee to encourage concise questions. Before we get to those questions, I invite both Stephen Boyle and Gareth Davies to make opening statements. I will begin with you, Auditor General.

Public Audit Committee

“Administration of Scottish income tax 2023/24”

Meeting date: 19 February 2025

Richard Leonard

Thank you very much indeed. I will turn to a couple of issues that both of you raised in your opening statements. In particular, Auditor General, you referred to something that is in your report. Exhibit 3 shows that £3.367 billion of additional income tax revenue has been raised from the Scottish population, but that that converts to additional budget spend of only £629 million. Presumably, that is a product of the fiscal framework. Do you have any observations about how the fiscal framework is working? What are the implications of that? As I calculate it, for every £5 raised, only £1 is available for the budget.

Public Audit Committee

“Administration of Scottish income tax 2023/24”

Meeting date: 19 February 2025

Richard Leonard

I said at the start we are quite pressed for time, but can I ask you to confirm my calculation? The figure in exhibit 3 is a cumulative figure—I draw attention to it because it is one of your key messages. For every £5 that has been raised through additional income tax in Scotland, only £1 of that—or less than £1 of that; it is about 18 per cent—finds its way into the Scottish budget.

Public Audit Committee

“Administration of Scottish income tax 2023/24”

Meeting date: 19 February 2025

Richard Leonard

Okay. Let me move on to another area that your report draws attention to and which you mentioned in your opening statement. The reconciliation figure for 2025-26 is £449 million—nearly half a billion pounds—which is the largest reconciliation to date. Is there a likelihood that that level of reconciliation will continue in the future? How does that affect the Scottish Government’s budget setting?

Public Audit Committee

Section 22 Report: “The 2023/24 audit of the Water Industry Commission for Scotland”

Meeting date: 19 February 2025

Richard Leonard

I have a couple of questions on a similar area to those that were raised by the deputy convener. One is about Mr Sutherland’s written submission, in which he goes further than what has been said so far. He says that he suggested that he should retire in October 2024, but that it was suggested to him by the Scottish Government deputy director that he might want to leave before then, so that he did not have to appear in front of the Public Audit Committee.

Public Audit Committee

Section 22 Report: “The 2023/24 audit of the Water Industry Commission for Scotland”

Meeting date: 19 February 2025

Richard Leonard

We may return to explore that a little bit further. Another thing—I have raised this before, so you might be prepared for it—is that it strikes me as quite odd that Mr Sutherland’s contract provided for him to receive 12 months’ notice on dismissal and only 6 months’ notice on resignation. Is that normal in the Scottish public sector, in your experience?