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Chamber and committees

Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 5 May 2021
  6. Current session: 12 May 2021 to 7 May 2025
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Displaying 2559 contributions

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Finance and Public Administration Committee

Scottish Fiscal Commission (Publications)

Meeting date: 6 September 2022

John Mason

That is great. The committee will be interested in pursuing that within two years.

Moving on to social security, I was interested in some comments in your report. Paragraph 2.7 states:

“However, the new systems used by Social Security Scotland are currently not designed in a way that meets or prioritises our, and other users’ data needs”.

It has been suggested that there is a lack of resources, but if the systems have not been designed in the right way, that suggests that the problem is not a lack of resources but a lack of foresight or consultation earlier on—which is it?

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Scottish Fiscal Commission (Publications)

Meeting date: 6 September 2022

John Mason

The issue of sex and gender has been mentioned, which is quite a hot political issue. Am I right in understanding that your view is that, in relation to older people—adults—it does not really matter quite so much? I would have thought that it would be a factor that, generally, men die younger than women, because, if women claim benefits for longer, there will be a greater cost. However, from what Professor Ulph said, among children, there are specific conditions that boys have that girls do not have, and vice versa. Is it mainly children that you are focusing on for data on sex and gender?

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Scottish Fiscal Commission (Publications)

Meeting date: 6 September 2022

John Mason

Thank you, convener. You are convening the meeting, and there is a debate over that, but I will try not to make any jokes about it.

I will start by returning to the “Statement of Data Needs” document, because that interested me quite a lot. Towards the end of the statement, on pages 28 and 29, there is an annex on previous requests. The document says that some of the requests are “in progress” and that some have had “no progress”. I am intrigued by those descriptions, which could mean quite a lot of things. If the document says, “in progress”, are you broadly happy that things are moving ahead, albeit slowly? For example, I take the point that a statutory right to access to information from UK Government departments may end up being part of the fiscal framework, so in that case there is a timetable. Some of the “no progress” ones such as VAT are not urgent. Are you broadly happy with the position?

10:00  

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Scottish Fiscal Commission (Publications)

Meeting date: 6 September 2022

John Mason

That is helpful. As I understand it, you are not planning to produce another report like this for two years. Given that you think that some of this is urgent, could we at least have an update before two years? Why two years?

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Scottish Fiscal Commission (Publications)

Meeting date: 6 September 2022

John Mason

Would you say that those are teething problems, or is there a more fundamental issue? Relatively speaking, Social Security Scotland is still a new body and the DWP has been going a long time.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Scottish Fiscal Commission (Publications)

Meeting date: 6 September 2022

John Mason

Terminal illness is mentioned as a specific issue—Social Security Scotland did not have the number of people who were getting a payment because of terminal illness. I would have thought that that number would be quite essential. Is that because Social Security Scotland has not collected that information, or is it because it has not worked the information through the system yet?

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Scottish Fiscal Commission (Publications)

Meeting date: 6 September 2022

John Mason

Maybe you cannot answer this, but do you have any idea whether that is a political decision, because we are not wanting to emphasise sex so much nowadays, or is it the case that Social Security Scotland has not thought about differentiating in collecting the data?

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Scottish Fiscal Commission (Publications)

Meeting date: 6 September 2022

John Mason

I would be happy enough if you wanted to come back to me on that.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Scottish Fiscal Commission (Publications)

Meeting date: 6 September 2022

John Mason

Fair enough.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Scottish Fiscal Commission (Publications)

Meeting date: 6 September 2022

John Mason

In paragraph 2.49 on page 14 of the “Statement of Data Needs” document, you say:

“We would like early engagement with the Scottish Government on data requirements for these payments.”

Is that improving?