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Chamber and committees

Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 4 May 2021
  6. Current session: 13 May 2021 to 19 February 2026
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Displaying 1747 contributions

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Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee [Draft]

Draft Climate Change Plan

Meeting date: 16 December 2025

Kevin Stewart

Convener, I will leave it there, but I will point out that, with flood risk management in Scotland, Professor Curran delivered his part of a plan that has not delivered on the ground, and my fear is that we get too exercised by the climate change plan rather than the delivery.

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee [Draft]

Draft Climate Change Plan

Meeting date: 16 December 2025

Kevin Stewart

Can I stop you, Jess? I recognise all the work you have done and I recognise that folk have become engaged, but that is a very small number of people.

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee [Draft]

Draft Climate Change Plan

Meeting date: 16 December 2025

Kevin Stewart

But the market might make its decisions based on the fact that there are not many hydrogen refuelling stations at the moment. There are only three in Scotland, two of which are in Aberdeen and were out of action for a little bit. That in itself would have an impact, would it not?

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee [Draft]

Draft Climate Change Plan

Meeting date: 16 December 2025

Kevin Stewart

Sorry. I think that you were cut off there.

Unless anybody else wants to come in on that, I will hand back to you, convener.

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee [Draft]

Draft Climate Change Plan

Meeting date: 16 December 2025

Kevin Stewart

Actually, I wish you would because you said that your part was delivered—

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee [Draft]

Draft Climate Change Plan

Meeting date: 16 December 2025

Kevin Stewart

We live in a world in which anti-climate change rhetoric is growing. Jess Pepper said earlier that she sees energy and excitement about change from people, but I do not see that, I have to say. I have been knocking on a lot of doors of late and it is not one of the top issues; it was probably higher up the agenda previously. Folk listening to this evidence session will probably be somewhat bamboozled by what has been said. Folk have asked for more detail about the plan itself because there are too many assumptions, and what about the what-ifs? Assumptions have to be built in. We have heard about flexibility and being adaptive; we have heard various things about what is missing and what should be in. However, folk do not want too many assumptions; they want more detail, so I wonder what people out there will think of that argument.

A lot of this is about delivery. Earlier, Professor Curran mentioned the flood risk management in Scotland arrangements for 2012 to 2016 and talked about how that was done, the project managers and the rest of it. When it comes to delivery, has that worked? I make a point about the flood risk at Whitesands in Dumfries—an area of Scotland that I do not know particularly well but which has featured in the Parliament quite a lot—because there has been no delivery, yet I am quite sure that it featured in your plan for flood risk management in Scotland.

Why have we had the argument around the plan today—on what is there, what is not there and what should be there—why have we not thought about the what-ifs, and why are we not talking more about delivery?

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee [Draft]

Draft Climate Change Plan

Meeting date: 16 December 2025

Kevin Stewart

Can I come in on Professor Curran, convener?

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee [Draft]

Draft Climate Change Plan

Meeting date: 16 December 2025

Kevin Stewart

I am playing devil’s advocate here, but I go back to the lack of delivery or folk not wanting a project to be delivered. You talked about the costs of inaction, but the people of Whitesands in Dumfries know that there is a flooding risk. They know the cost of inaction, yet many of them do not want that flood prevention scheme.

Lloyd Austin talked about the communications and not everything being monetary, but, for many folk at the moment, their lack of income and the struggle to pay electricity, gas and food bills is the top priority without a doubt. Money in their pooch is aa they think aboot.

I will come to Jess next.

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee [Draft]

Draft Climate Change Plan

Meeting date: 16 December 2025

Kevin Stewart

You say that you are supportive of the plan—even though there has been a huge picking of holes in it in your evidence today—but you know what will be reported from this session today. Mr Austin has concentrated on agriculture. He basically wants everybody to eat less beef, other meat products and dairy. That will go down like a lead balloon with many folks, including many folks who cannot afford such things at the moment. There has been talk about a reduction in cars. I have no skin in the game—I am not a driver and never have been—but again that will be the thing that is reported. There will be the talk of putting in what folk see as very expensive heating solutions. Again, I have no skin in the game because I am already all electric, but you can see exactly where this goes.

In picking holes in the plan and not talking so much about the delivery that is required, each of you today has provided the headlines for the anti-climate change brigade, which has probably reduced energy and excitement among the folk who recognise that climate is an issue.

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee [Draft]

Draft Climate Change Plan

Meeting date: 16 December 2025

Kevin Stewart

Andy Poole said that he was not quite convinced about some aspects of the Climate Change Committee position. I take it that the not convinced bit includes hydrogen. Other countries are looking at hydrogen for HGV use and say that it is much better than electric vehicles. Does that need more exploration in these islands, as is happening in China, Germany and the United States?