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Chamber and committees

Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 5 May 2021
  6. Current session: 12 May 2021 to 7 July 2025
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Displaying 1221 contributions

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Finance and Public Administration Committee

Budget Scrutiny 2025-26

Meeting date: 18 February 2025

Liz Smith

I do not think that that explains the difference between the DWP and Social Security Scotland.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Budget Scrutiny 2025-26

Meeting date: 18 February 2025

Liz Smith

I do not doubt that ministers have had discussions on the matter. Our job as the Finance and Public Administration Committee is to look at the effective spend of our public finances and to ensure that the evidence is there to support the choices that are made. My colleague Michael Marra asked for a specific options paper that we could scrutinise to look at what you call investments when it comes to various policies. A good investment will have good results. Therefore, if there are various options that involve different kinds of investment, you will want to weigh up the balance of the effective outcomes, particularly when it comes to action on child poverty, which is the Scottish Government’s number 1 priority. I do not think that we have had that information.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Budget Scrutiny 2025-26

Meeting date: 18 February 2025

Liz Smith

That would be helpful.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Budget Scrutiny 2025-26

Meeting date: 18 February 2025

Liz Smith

I will finish with a specific question and a suggestion. I have asked this question of you before, and of Shirley-Anne Somerville, in the Social Justice and Social Security Committee. There have been significant increases in adult disability payments and child disability payments. I have been trying to drill down into why that is. It seems that the Scottish Government’s argument is that the case load is considerably greater in Scotland than it is in other parts of the UK. Are you comfortable with that?

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Budget Scrutiny 2025-26

Meeting date: 18 February 2025

Liz Smith

Forgive me, but the Scottish Government has already made its choices. Michael Marra asked you when we would get an options paper. The key point here, which I have already questioned you and Shirley-Anne Somerville on in the Social Justice and Social Security Committee, is that, if there is evidence that proves that various social security policies would provide better outcomes than other policies when it comes to child poverty, surely it is the duty of the Scottish Government to provide that evidence, in line with the questions that the committee is asking. For example, what specific evidence have you found to show that the delivery of mitigation of the two-child cap would provide better outcomes than, say, an increase in the Scottish child payment? Where is that evidence?

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Budget Scrutiny 2025-26

Meeting date: 18 February 2025

Liz Smith

Let us assume that action on child poverty is the number 1 priority for the Scottish Government—which, as I understand it, it is. Given the state of the public finances, particularly with the considerable uplift in the social security budget—it is a huge increase, especially in a single budget—we cannot afford all the commitments that the Scottish Government has made without finding an awful lot of extra money.

There are two parts to my question. First, where is that extra money coming from? Secondly, on what basis is the Scottish Government making decisions on where the outcomes will be best when it comes to the delivery of social security?

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Budget Scrutiny 2025-26

Meeting date: 18 February 2025

Liz Smith

Cabinet secretary, I want to pursue our dialogue about social security spend. At your most recent appearance before the committee, you made various commitments. I will start with one that you made to Michael Marra when he asked you, in relation to the various aspects of the two-child cap mitigation,

“Will you write to the committee with information on the options appraisal that you carried out, setting out why you chose that option in preference to some of the others?”—[Official Report, Finance and Public Administration Committee, 14 January 2025; c 43.]

What has happened to that commitment?

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Budget Scrutiny 2025-26

Meeting date: 18 February 2025

Liz Smith

I will push you on that, because I think that it is very important that we see that evidence.

Social Justice and Social Security Committee

Social Security Scotland

Meeting date: 16 January 2025

Liz Smith

I am not questioning the decisions or the criteria that you have set out—there is just a bit of a contradiction here. The process is supposed to be much more user friendly and much easier; at the same time, however, your own survey is saying that people in receipt of adult disability and child disability payments are not finding it particularly easy, compared with the process for other benefits. Can you explain why that is?

Social Justice and Social Security Committee

Social Security Scotland

Meeting date: 16 January 2025

Liz Smith

Thank you.

There are no more questions from me, convener, but I would just go back to the point that Mr Balfour made earlier. When it comes to our deciding on best policy, what do you think are the benefits that are working most effectively to deliver on the ambition that you have set out? It is important that we get the right data and that we can use good quantitative as well as qualitative measurements of what is most effective. That was my final point.