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Chamber and committees

Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 4 May 2021
  6. Current session: 13 May 2021 to 25 October 2025
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Displaying 2218 contributions

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Social Justice and Social Security Committee [Draft]

Subordinate Legislation

Meeting date: 9 October 2025

Bob Doris

I will now suspend briefly before the next agenda item.

10:06 Meeting suspended.  

10:08 On resuming—  

Social Justice and Social Security Committee [Draft]

Wellbeing and Sustainable Development (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 9 October 2025

Bob Doris

That is helpful. If you have specific examples of those modest changes, it would be helpful if you could follow up in an email, so that we can see an illustration of that.

Social Justice and Social Security Committee [Draft]

Wellbeing and Sustainable Development (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 9 October 2025

Bob Doris

I just want to give everyone a time check, mainly to reassure Sarah Boyack that we will make time at the end of the session for her questions, too. We will run until about 11.10 or so, to give us a wee bitty more time on this.

Professor Reid, before I move to the next line of questioning, I want to ask a specific question that takes us back to the issue of the overlapping responsibilities of various public bodies. You could have the Scottish Environment Protection Agency, for example, investigating other public bodies and Environmental Standards Scotland investigating SEPA, and they will be taking into account sustainable development and a whole variety of environmental aspects therein. I know that there are no specific definitions for any of that, but they do have to comply with licensing conditions and other things. On top of that, you will have the future generations commissioner monitoring, reporting or ruling on things that might cut across the responsibilities of other public bodies. Could any tensions or confusion arise there?

Social Justice and Social Security Committee [Draft]

Wellbeing and Sustainable Development (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 9 October 2025

Bob Doris

I have one final question for both our witnesses. There are a couple of questions that we have not asked, which we will maybe send to you in writing—any reflections on those would be welcome—and the member in charge of the bill still has to ask some questions.

Professor Jones, at the start of our evidence session, you used the expression “big stick”, and you used it again just now. I think that you are making the point that there is not a big stick.

Social Justice and Social Security Committee [Draft]

Wellbeing and Sustainable Development (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 9 October 2025

Bob Doris

There is soft power and influence, and the backstop would be a judicial review, although that has never happened and it is unclear what it would look like. I am not trying to be glib about this, but, theoretically, if bodies did a tick-box exercise—to use your expression—in relation to showing compliance, which you suggested had happened to a degree in Wales, there appear to be no enforcement powers to deal with that, only soft power or the ability to influence. Do you have any thoughts about that?

Social Justice and Social Security Committee [Draft]

Wellbeing and Sustainable Development (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 9 October 2025

Bob Doris

Professor Reid, I suppose that we are asking whether the proposed powers of the commissioner are sufficient or whether they need to be extended. If so, would that have to be consulted on more widely because it is not contained in the current provisions of the bill?

Social Justice and Social Security Committee [Draft]

Wellbeing and Sustainable Development (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 9 October 2025

Bob Doris

Thank you.

Sarah Boyack has been very patient. We have a bit of time left for you to explore any themes that you want to ask questions on, Sarah.

Social Justice and Social Security Committee [Draft]

Wellbeing and Sustainable Development (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 9 October 2025

Bob Doris

Thank you, Sarah. We could have asked lots more questions, but we are under time constraints.

Thank you, Professor Reid and Professor Jones, for supporting us in our scrutiny this morning. If you have any further reflections, please follow up in correspondence. We have a couple of questions that we did not get around to asking, so we will make you aware of those, and we would welcome any reflections on them.

That concludes the public part of the meeting.

11:15 Meeting continued in private until 11:22.  

Social Justice and Social Security Committee [Draft]

Wellbeing and Sustainable Development (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 9 October 2025

Bob Doris

That would be helpful.

Professor Jones, do you have any reflections on the definition before I move on to my next question?

Social Justice and Social Security Committee [Draft]

Wellbeing and Sustainable Development (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 9 October 2025

Bob Doris

Can I just check something? I again refer to our time constraints, for which I apologise. Are the public bodies listed in Wales? Who decides what the public bodies are?