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Chamber and committees

Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 5 May 2021
  6. Current session: 12 May 2021 to 15 May 2025
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Displaying 1184 contributions

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Meeting of the Parliament

Portfolio Question Time

Meeting date: 15 December 2022

Patrick Harvie

We are working with the operator that is taking forward the trial and we will continue to liaise with it in response to the reports that have been cited.

However, I go back to my first answer: we are very clear that, although hydrogen might play some role in decarbonising emissions from heating buildings, it is not likely to play a central role. That is in the context of the anticipated rise in demand for export and the significant demand for green hydrogen from other industries, which do not have ready alternatives for decarbonising. In short, we think that the promise of hydrogen tomorrow must not stop us from taking action now with technologies such as heat pumps and heat networks, which are much more likely to play a central role.

Meeting of the Parliament

Portfolio Question Time

Meeting date: 15 December 2022

Patrick Harvie

We continue to invest substantially in the energy interventions that we are making, including everything under the heat in buildings agenda.

In the climate change plan update that was published in 2020, it was acknowledged, including by the Government, that we have to go further and faster as we develop the new climate change plan; it is currently under development. In fact, the welcome acknowledgement in the Climate Change Committee’s report demonstrates the need for us to bring to that area the added ambition that we are bringing.

I refer Roz McCall to comments by the British Energy Efficiency Federation, which said in response to our work:

“My advice to Whitehall is simple. Whether you take the high road or you take the low road, you had best be copying Scotland’s initiatives.”

Meeting of the Parliament

Portfolio Question Time

Meeting date: 15 December 2022

Patrick Harvie

I think that the current economic circumstances justify the Government’s intention to move away from fossil fuels, because overreliance on fossil fuels is part of the problem for the very consumers whom Rhoda Grant is rightly concerned about.

The Government has also recently made the package of grants and loans that are available to people much more flexible and attractive, including by a specific rural and islands uplift for the energy efficiency and zero-emission heating elements of that package of grants and loans. I encourage the member to make her constituents aware of that and to encourage them to visit the Home Energy Scotland website for further information.

Meeting of the Parliament

Portfolio Question Time

Meeting date: 15 December 2022

Patrick Harvie

We published a report in October setting out our progress against the heat in buildings strategy. Since publication of the strategy, we have published our heat networks delivery plan and legislation requiring all local authorities to produce a local heat and energy efficiency strategy in 2023. We have also introduced a grant to replace the cashback element of Home Energy Scotland loans for homeowners.

We intend in 2023 to publish a consultation on our proposals for a heat in buildings bill and to launch our public engagement strategy, to raise awareness and support among the public for this vital transition.

Meeting of the Parliament

Portfolio Question Time

Meeting date: 15 December 2022

Patrick Harvie

Across the wider economy, we expect hydrogen to play an important role in achieving net zero ambitions, particularly in sectors that are otherwise hard to decarbonise. Although it is possible that hydrogen might play some role in reducing emissions from heating buildings in Scotland, we do not expect that to be a central role. If demonstration and safety trials prove successful, blending of hydrogen and the conversion and repurposing of parts of the network to carry 100 per cent hydrogen might take place. However, at present, those are decisions for the United Kingdom Government, and we urge it to make those decisions soon.

Meeting of the Parliament

Portfolio Question Time

Meeting date: 15 December 2022

Patrick Harvie

I am not sure whether I need to declare an interest as a resident in one of the tenements in Kaukab Stewart’s constituency that she referred to.

We are, of course, aware that stakeholders have raised valid concerns about the existing tenant management scheme, which is set out in the Tenements (Scotland) Act 2004. The independently chaired tenement short-life working group has been empowered to consider the issue and, as the member mentioned, we await its recommendations. I am sure that Kaukab Stewart will be keen to discuss that with the Government once the recommendations are available.

To meet what is in our ambitious heat and buildings strategy and in “Housing to 2040” we need communal work in tenements to be carried out in a way that is fair and effective. We will, therefore, fully consider any changes to the TMS before making legislative change.

Meeting of the Parliament

Portfolio Question Time

Meeting date: 15 December 2022

Patrick Harvie

Thank you, Presiding Officer. I have a note of the question.

The Scottish Government recognises that households, especially in rural and island areas that rely on unregulated fuels for their heating instead of gas, need both general and targeted assistance. Although the powers to support off-gas-grid consumers as regards the price that they pay for higher alternative fuel costs are primarily reserved, we are taking every action that we can with the powers that are available to us, including doubling our fuel insecurity fund to £20 million for the financial year 2022-23 and introducing the new £1.4 million islands cost crisis emergency fund.

Meeting of the Parliament

Portfolio Question Time

Meeting date: 15 December 2022

Patrick Harvie

I agree with the member, and I share her concerns. The UK Government’s unwillingness to regulate the alternative fuels market will lead to more Scottish households—especially in rural and island communities—being at risk of moving into fuel poverty. It is also of concern that the alternative fuel payment, which does not come close to meeting the rising cost of alternative fuels over recent months, has not even reached consumers yet, despite having been announced four months ago.

I say again that the whole issue highlights our overreliance on fossil fuels and why it remains absolutely essential that we accelerate our transition to zero-carbon alternatives for heating our homes.

Meeting of the Parliament

Portfolio Question Time

Meeting date: 15 December 2022

Patrick Harvie

As I said in answer to the original question, we call on the UK Government to regulate the alternative fuels market and to ensure that the support that has been committed to is actually made available to people.

However, given our experience over a number of years of trying to get the UK Government even to sit down and talk to us about the added flexibility that we could build in through schemes such as the energy company obligation—ECO—scheme, and given its refusal to negotiate and find better ways of doing things, I think that we will all share the member’s frustration at the UK Government’s unwillingness to work with us on those matters.

Meeting of the Parliament

Portfolio Question Time

Meeting date: 24 November 2022

Patrick Harvie

We are aware that consumers who do not have a direct contract with an energy supplier but pay their landlords for their energy consumption are not eligible for the United Kingdom Government’s energy bills support scheme. We continue to engage with the UK Government to highlight that issue. It has committed to distributing equivalent support to those consumers as soon as possible and, on 26 October, the UK Government published legislation to ensure that landlords pass on the discount to tenants who pay all-inclusive bills. It would, of course, have been more desirable if the UK Government had done so in the first instance, rather than back-fitting the measure on to the interventions that it has made. However, we will continue to maintain close dialogue with the UK Government to ensure that the changes take place.