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Chamber and committees

Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 4 May 2021
  6. Current session: 13 May 2021 to 3 December 2025
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Displaying 3978 contributions

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Finance and Public Administration Committee [Draft]

Scottish Public Inquiries (Cost-effectiveness)

Meeting date: 25 November 2025

Kenneth Gibson

Okay—I stand corrected if that is the case, although my understanding was that it was because of the inquiry that the police made their decision. Even if that is the case, however, the amount should be in the public domain, should it not? Is it going to be in the public domain?

Finance and Public Administration Committee [Draft]

Scottish Public Inquiries (Cost-effectiveness)

Meeting date: 25 November 2025

Kenneth Gibson

Okay. In terms of responding to inquiries, one issue is that, sometimes, after it has taken many years for an inquiry to come up with recommendations, months—if not years—elapse without them being implemented. I see that you are smiling at that.

Finance and Public Administration Committee [Draft]

Scottish Public Inquiries (Cost-effectiveness)

Meeting date: 25 November 2025

Kenneth Gibson

The total cost of the Sheku Bayoh inquiry is £51 million if you include both sides, because there are two sides to the issue—that is what we are looking at.

Finance and Public Administration Committee [Draft]

Scottish Public Inquiries (Cost-effectiveness)

Meeting date: 25 November 2025

Kenneth Gibson

As I pointed out earlier, and as John Mason mentioned, there are significantly more UK inquiries, and the UK Government has spent about £1.5 billion.

We have not really touched on terms of reference. I think that we have to be clear and robust in setting terms of reference. We can look at the Piper Alpha and Dunblane shooting inquiries, for example. Those incidents were very traumatic for all those who lived through them and remember the details, and 167 men died on Piper Alpha and 16 children and a teacher died in Dunblane, and yet those were very short, succinct and straightforward inquiries that cost a fraction of the inquiries that we are talking about. I think that Lord Cullen’s inquiry into Piper Alpha cost under £2 million and lasted for just over a year.

As Professor Cameron stated in written evidence,

“It has to be recognised that inquiries are a source of substantial income for some large legal firms and as such the question arises as to the extent to which they are motivated to keep costs to a minimum and within budget.”

We have seen almost an explosion of legal costs. Do you find it inappropriate that some legal firms have people going on television demanding the establishment or extension of inquiries when they themselves have a direct pecuniary interest?

Finance and Public Administration Committee [Draft]

Scottish Public Inquiries (Cost-effectiveness)

Meeting date: 25 November 2025

Kenneth Gibson

In her written evidence, Dr Ireton, who specialises in this area, said:

“there has been remarkably little evidence-based work commissioned on what inquiries cost, how they manage those costs, and how spending compares against original budgets.”

She also said that they are

“often ... concluded with minimal formal evaluation or system-wide learning.”

Is the Scottish Government going to alter that as we move forward?

Finance and Public Administration Committee [Draft]

Scottish Public Inquiries (Cost-effectiveness)

Meeting date: 25 November 2025

Kenneth Gibson

We will make recommendations in our report, but it will be up to the Government to act on those.

We talked about public inquiries, with their interim reports, making changes as they go along. I would hope that the Government, seeing where we are coming from, would already be looking to make some changes.

Finance and Public Administration Committee [Draft]

Scottish Public Inquiries (Cost-effectiveness)

Meeting date: 25 November 2025

Kenneth Gibson

To be honest, I do not think that you have been defensive at all.

Finance and Public Administration Committee [Draft]

Scottish Public Inquiries (Cost-effectiveness)

Meeting date: 25 November 2025

Kenneth Gibson

They do it out of the goodness of their hearts—they do not get paid vast amounts of money, no? [Laughter.]

Finance and Public Administration Committee [Draft]

Scottish Public Inquiries (Cost-effectiveness)

Meeting date: 25 November 2025

Kenneth Gibson

Deputy First Minister, I thank you and your officials for your contributions. Do you wish to make any further comments at this point?

Finance and Public Administration Committee [Draft]

Scottish Public Inquiries (Cost-effectiveness)

Meeting date: 25 November 2025

Kenneth Gibson

Thank you very much. That was helpful and it generated quite a lot of questions that I want to ask. I am not going to ask all the questions that I want to ask, because I know that my colleagues are quite keen, and I do not want to tread on their toes, but I might come in after them, as well as before them.

I want to start with the guidance for public inquiries. I understand that it was laid in August 2024, but, despite having started an inquiry a couple of months before being informed of its existence on 30 May, the committee was then advised that the guidance would not be ready until October, and it has only just been published. Why has it taken 14 months to publish that guidance?